Why vegans are simply better people

[RandFan]

Many great replies to the OP, hmmm.....I wonder why he or she hasn't returned to defend his or her position that he or she is so much better than the rest of us.

I think Kevin is on to something.

When people make a moral criticism of my actions... troll them...

 

[Cainkane1]

I've seen fat vegans. Too man chickpeas and cashews are as fattening as meat.

 

[NeilC]

When I watch people who smoke, I often ask myself how can they do it. What is it that makes these people tick. They deliberately engage in a vice that they know will probably hasten their own death.
Is it because they really don't enjoy life and dying early is OK with them.
Is it because they don't believe in the science that shows how dangerous smoking is?

Or it it because they are selfish. They think of themselves and their enjoyment and don't worry about the consequences until they occur. They don't care that smoking arround their kids infuences their kids to smoke. They don't care that others often have to foot the medical bills in the form of higher insurance premiums, and they don't care about secondary smoke.

I'd say none of the above. I think they are addicted and lying to themselves. I was when I smoked. My lie was that I'd stop pretty soon and so it wouldn't matter. Actually it wasn't all that much of a lie as it turns out because I didn't smoke for long. They just put the bad health effects to one side. I don't think that makes them selfish just human. We all lie to ourselves. Knowing that is one less lie.

I believe that people who don't smoke are better people than those who do. Because I believe those who smoke do it for the last reason.

Since I don't think you have good evidence for that belief I think you should stop thinking they are lesser people in that respect.

Now lets talk about meat eaters. That veal you ate last night. A young holstein bull calf was taken from its mother at day one. Kept in a cage to prevent him from moving and fed bucket milk for a few days until he was butchered. A newborn highly evolved consciousness was bought into this world to be tortured basically, a torture we would not perfrom on a prisoner of war, all for your veal.

Actually not all veal is now bred like that. Most veal in the UK is pink veal which is just young male calves. They are otherwise killed for nothing as they have little value. But even for white veal - it's choice of ethics. I may take the view that animal suffering isn't that important to me as it appear to be to you. Just like the chicken cares little about the worms it eats.

Chickens kept in cages, debeaked to prevent pecking each other after they go insane from not being able to move for the short one year life span they are given to furnish you your eggs.. the list goes on.

yes it's unkind but you can eat free range if this bothers you.

Heart disease. We now know the cause. Meat and oil do not just contribute to heart disease, they are the cause. thats right they are the cause.

That is not proven. Vegans also die of heart disease. Although, excess animal fats and red meats do contribute. Exercise is key and veganism says nothing about that.

I dare you meat eating smart asses to actually take time to read this link:

http://www.thechinastudy.com/PDFs/ChinaStudy_Excerpt.pdf

I've read it previously. I've also read the criticisms of it. I dare you to read this: http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/index.php/385/

When you go out into public, it is impossible not to see fat slobs wherever you go. Basically fat footballs with a head on top. Why are they such, just like the smokers.... they eat excessively because they enjoy it and will worry about the consequences later.

This harshly put but essentially true

They are ugly. Not just because they are obese. But their fat, disgusting bodies are a testimony to their own extreme selfishness and complete lack of discipline. Their bodies are testimony to the worst afflliction one can posess....selfishness, glutony, overindulgance, lack of empathy, and refusal to set an example on how to live well for others, especially our children.....whatever you want to call it...if its bad,,,,baby you go it.

Lack of discipline probably but selfish and lack of empathy? I don't see it. You appear to lack some empathy I must say. But I know what you mean - watch a truly obese person stuffing more down isn't pleasant.

Its been known for years now how dangerous sugars and simple carbs are,,,but I bet your reading this with a dougnut stuffed in your mouth and one in your kids...,now our overindulgance in meat and oil has become our biggest killer. But that won't stop you from eating damn well what you want will it and taking the kids for a bigmac later too. After all, its all about you. And if all this ***** about nutrition is true, you worry about it later.

I'm sipping an equally dangerous glass of white wine as it happens but I take your point that one ought to watch one's diet.

Thats why vegans are better people...we aren't you.

I don't think it would prove that even if your facts were right but they're not anyway.

 

[commandlinegamer]

Pol Pot was a vegan.

Is there a proper adjective for a thread which has been Khmer-Rouged?

 

[Noztradamus]

I didn't have veal for tea last night

Then what are you doing on this thread? The rant was for the people who did have veal.

OK. I shouldn't be here either. I had chicken (which did taste a bit fowl)

 

[Alt+F4]

I believe that people who don't smoke are better people than those who do.

My mother smoked for 30 years, I never smoked. She was a better person than I could ever hope to be. Your "beliefs" are nothing other than a pathetic attempt at self-aggrandizing, of which few on this forum agree. Start your own website, Iambetterthanyou.com. Having fun with that.

 

[jakesteele]

You seemed to have missed the boat if you had to lower yourself to an inferior cooked vegetable diet sans animal products. The only diet that can wear the Crown of Superiority is this one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raw_foodism. All others, vegan and meat alike, cook the nutrients out of their food. I, personally, have transcended even that. I am a Breatharian. I live on breath, air and sunshine. This works so well for me that I am able to treat myself with Happy Meals, oatmeal, steaks and Cadbury Fruit and Nut bars.

So wise up and get with it before you end up living the same time span as the rest of us.

 

[GlennB]

Now lets talk about meat eaters. That veal you ate last night. A young holstein bull calf was taken from its mother at day one. Kept in a cage to prevent him from moving and fed bucket milk for a few days until he was butchered

Wrong. The veal liver I ate a few days ago came from a free-range calf. The veal meat we regularly eat comes from free-range calves.

If you stick out your neck with rash generalisations be prepared to have it cut off.

 

[Battman]

It's a little known fact that 'Vegan' is a ancient word that has been attributed to the Iriquois people of the Great Lakes area of North America. It means 'Lousy hunter'

 

[Kevin_Lowe]

Get down off the cross, we need the wood.

Oh, and moral criticism faced with trolling and name calling?

I agree completely that if you can criticise the original poster than any amount of stupid arguments or outright trolling in response is perfectly justified. Two wrongs make a right, and the last thing we'd want anyone to do around here is rise above the level of the initial post and have an intelligent discussion.

However I do have to say that exactly the same arguments and attitudes get trotted out whenever this topic comes up regardless of whether the OP is a troll or not. So I have this little suspicion that criticising the OP is just an excuse.

 

[TheGoldcountry]

Many great replies to the OP, hmmm.....I wonder why he or she hasn't returned to defend his or her position that he or she is so much better than the rest of us.

No, you don't wonder. The best win over an obvious troll is others enjoying the discussion anyway, while his/her obvious "bomb" fizzles.

 

[The Central Scrutinizer]

A newborn highly evolved consciousness was bought into this world to be tortured basically, a torture we would not perfrom on a prisoner of war, all for your veal.

Apparently you don't know much about cows.

Chickens kept in cages, debeaked to prevent pecking each other after they go insane from not being able to move for the short one year life span they are given to furnish you your eggs.. the list goes on.

Are you in favor of chickens pecking each other?

I dare you meat eating smart asses to actually take time to read this link:

http://www.thechinastudy.com/PDFs/ChinaStudy_Excerpt.pdf

I would, but I have to organize my sock drawer, then rotate the light bulbs. I promise to read it next year, 2013 at the latest.

 

[RandFan]

... the last thing we'd want anyone to do around here is rise above the level of the initial post and have an intelligent discussion.

In my recent thread about morality I was criticized for my tact. Perhaps deservedly. However, it would sure have been nice if more than just a minority of people had wanted to have an intelligent discussion without resorting to personal attack and acrimony. I can't even remember the names of those who were willing to have an intelligent discussion. There was a lot of trolling behavior.

Again, I accept my responsibility for some of that. But you are right, two wrongs don't make a right.

 

[therival58]

My experience has been:

people who use the word "vegan" to describe themselves = pretentious, condescending douchebags who try to talk down to you with a smug smile.

people who call themselves "vegetarians" mostly = are usually alright.

.

It's interesting because most vegans would say they do not feel themselves to be superior to us 'meat-eaters' in any way, yet I always have this thought in the back of my head that they 'secretly' view themselves and us much as described in the OP.

 

[The Big Dog]

I agree completely that if you can criticise the original poster than any amount of stupid arguments or outright trolling in response is perfectly justified. Two wrongs make a right, and the last thing we'd want anyone to do around here is rise above the level of the initial post and have an intelligent discussion.

However I do have to say that exactly the same arguments and attitudes get trotted out whenever this topic comes up regardless of whether the OP is a troll or not. So I have this little suspicion that criticising the OP is just an excuse.

Well, to be perfectly honest, I rarely venture outside certain areas of this site, but this thread and its title was so spectacularly obnoxious that I felt compelled to contribute to critiquing the OP.

I've also read his "poetry" published on the site, and it approaches Vogon levels of incompetence.

Anyway, imagine having an intelligent discussion in a thread that basically is titled "everybody other than people who agree with me are stupid."

The OP is worthless.

 

[Caper]

Strict vegan here, active in the animal rights movement for the past several years. Some thoughts....


I'm not a vegan for my health, so much for animals' health.

I've often recommended a low-fat, vegan diet as a way to lose weight. But in all seriousness, the argument from health benefits is not a knock-out argument for veganism:

1) People have a right to eat themselves to death. Its none of your business how people conduct their health.

2) People can be healthy on a non-vegan diet, live unremarkably healthy into old age. You undermine the argument for veganism (that is, prescribing it as an alternative to non-vegan diets) by advancing it as a health argument.


I'm not a vegan for my looks.

I really really really dislike this view as well. Its judgement in the EXTREME. I was the ugly kid in high school, I know what its like to be bullied for it. I know what its like to see very attractive young women being surrounded by friends and having all manner of nice things handed to them, and for me to be essentially friendless.

Not everyone is beautiful according to your standards. Its a fact of life, but is not a factor in whether someone is "better" than another. Please keep your judgemental attitude to yourself.


The argument from animal welfare is essentially strongest argument for veganism there is. There are lots of us on the forum who take this view, you might be interested in my perspective on the subject.

I can be a bitch sometimes in these discussions, its bad habit because this is such a touchy topic for me, but I try to keep a level head. People like calm, cool rational argument, even if its for a really microminority view like ethical veganism. Peter Singer and Tom Regan, two of the nicest people on the planet with a powerful capacity for lucid and rational argument, have inspired more people to jump on the vegan train than any invective personalities ever will.

At the moment, I find your style confrontational, off-putting, and judgemental. Its not helpful. Please stop.

Best post on the topic. I'm incapable of not eating meat. But the cruelty part of it does bother me a bit. But like someone else said..... not as much as I love tasty bacon....ummmmmmm.

Would you eat meat if scientists managed to creat some kind of brainless cow? Forget a about the weird factor of such an animal... or even if it is possible.... just think of the tasty stake. Would you find such a beast violated your own personal moral code?

 

[Stomatopoda]

Imo, empathy for cows can be eliminated/cured by spending 5 minutes in the presence of cows.

 

[angrysoba]

Vegans are definitely more self-righteous than normal people.

 

[Psiload]

Taken from reverebison's last sermon:

These are the three keys to happiness:

***snip***

2. Become a vegetarian, better yet a vegan. Sounds wierd, but its true. When your healthy, your happy. Heart disease would be extinct if we all were vegans. Obesity would be rare. We are killing ourselves and worse than that, we are chronically ill for much of our later years...due to our overindulgance in meat, dairy, oil, simple carbs. I really never believed in being a vegan until I saw "The Last Heart Attack" special on TV. It was based on Dr. Cauldwell Essyslstein's book. He claims that you can completely prevent heart disease and even reverse and treat heart disease with a vegan diet. So does Dr. Cornish and many other medical experts are slowly getting on the bandwagon. After being a vegan for a while I lost 25 pounds, ate all I wanted, and feel so good at 53 I almost feel guilty. And thanks to my arteries not being so blocked I no longer have a problem making my sexy wife happier too.

***snip***

Dr. Cauldwell Essyslstein's book was published in 2008, so that means that reverebison has been a better person for all of three years now(tops), and the sort of overindulgent meat eater that he seems to despise for the previous half a century of his life.

***edited to add***

It appears that the television program "The Last Heart Attack" first aired on CNN on August 28th, 2011.

So that would make reverebison a better person for all of four months now(tops).

 

[Gord_in_Toronto]

Best post on the topic. I'm incapable of not eating meat. But the cruelty part of it does bother me a bit. But like someone else said..... not as much as I love tasty bacon....ummmmmmm.

Would you eat meat if scientists managed to creat some kind of brainless cow? Forget a about the weird factor of such an animal... or even if it is possible.... just think of the tasty stake. Would you find such a beast violated your own personal moral code?

In the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy at the Restaurant at the End of the Universe the cows wanted to be eaten. This presumably could be accomplished through genetic engineering. Would it be wrong or a violation of moral code?