No death penalty for Mumia

[curi0us]

There's no doubt Mumia did it, at least for those of us who are skeptics.

It seems every high profile murder case has it's gang of useful idiots (OJ, AK, WM3, etc), and this one was no exception.

Actually, my very firsts posts about AK were about "useful idiots" and how the same kind of people who think Mumia and Peltier were innocent were the ones running the big anti-Knox website. An example:

Posted by Ergon:
But there I go again, a system that sends petty drug users to jail, that sends black people in disproportionate numbers to for-profit Prisons, that never will give a Leonard Peltier, Mumia Abdul Jamal, Drs. Aafia Siddiqui or Sami al Arian a fair trial, that allows judicial coup d'etats when it comes to presidential elections and skewing electoral politics towards the rich and powerful in society, is rotten and corrupt to the core, and if I defend Italy's system, that is because it is infinitely <b>better</b>
http://perugiamurderfile.org/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=375&p=92428&hilit=Mumia#p92428

PMF's leader is so deranged she pushed the idea that the motive for the murder of Kercher was "Racism and Ethnic Cleansing" and her husbands blog is named Friend of Peltier and sources militantly dishonest propagandist Ward Chruchill who regularly lied to support Mumia and Peltier. So you have to ask yourself, do really you think Knox killed Kercher to ethnically cleanse her and that Ward Chruchill is a legit source? Because if not the "useful idiot" all along has been you.

 

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Actually, my very firsts posts about AK were about "useful idiots" and how the same kind of people who think Mumia and Peltier were innocent were the ones running the big anti-Knox website. An example:



PMF's leader is so deranged she pushed the idea that the motive for the murder of Kercher was "Racism and Ethnic Cleansing" and her husbands blog is named Friend of Peltier and sources militantly dishonest propagandist Ward Chruchill who regularly lied to support Mumia and Peltier. So you have to ask yourself, do really you think Knox killed Kercher to ethnically cleanse her and that Ward Chruchill is a legit source? Because if not the "useful idiot" all along has been you.

I have no idea what a PMF is or what you are blathering on about.

Back to Mumia, please.

 

[kookbreaker]

And for the 30th anniversary of Faulkner's murder a bunch of yahoos got together at the Constitution Center and babble about political prisoners (yeah, shooting police officers in the face makes you a 'Political Prisoner') and Mumia gets to ramble about hwo everyone should feel sorry for him for killing someone.

The usual crap was bawled:

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/l...hering_to_mark_30_years_since_his_arrest.html

 

[TubbaBlubba]

In every U.S. jurisdiction I'm aware of, you can use the level of force that is reasonably necessary to effect self-defense or defense of another. So it depends on what sort of assault we're talking about. If the assault involves a deadly weapon, or multiple attackers and a defenseless victim who is still being assaulted despite already being prone, deadly force would likely be legal. If, for example, the assailants are unarmed and kicking a prone victim in the head repeatedly, the threat of deadly force might be the reasonable course, followed by the application of force if the threat does not stop the attack. But even then, how do you know whether someone is unarmed? It is always a factual determination based on the particular circumstances, and the standard is reasonableness.

In addition, some states evaluate reasonableness subjectively ("reasonable to me based on my subjective perception of the circumstances"), while others (most, I think) use an objective test (the hypothetical "reasonable person"). I realize that what I've called an objective test might seem subjective as well, but that's the legal jargon. Also, some states require that in self-defense situations you must retreat if you can safely do so. Some states have a duty to retreat except in one's home. Some states have no duty to retreat.

Wouldn't it also depend somewhat on the person? Someone who's weakened due to disease, for example, or a woman facing a man, might get away easier with, say, whacking the attacker over the head with an iron pipe because they don't have much damned choice compared to a healthy and strong man.

 

[Caper]

I admit I never really looked into the case Indepth. But I did listen to a podcast (true murder), and the author did make a good case for his innocence.

 

[bynmdsue]

I admit I never really looked into the case Indepth. But I did listen to a podcast (true murder), and the author did make a good case for his innocence.

Did he tell the .44 caliber story? Because it's very easy to sound convincing when noone is there to rebut.

 

[kookbreaker]

I admit I never really looked into the case Indepth. But I did listen to a podcast (true murder), and the author did make a good case for his innocence.

And just what were his "facts" to make that case.

 

[Morrigan]

There's no doubt Mumia did it, at least for those of us who are skeptics.

It seems every high profile murder case has it's gang of useful idiots (OJ, AK, WM3, etc), and this one was no exception.

There is no way the WM3 are in the same boat as OJ or Mumia, ffs. They were pretty obviously innocent.

 

[bynmdsue]

And just what were his "facts" to make that case.

The podcast I found (if it's the right one) is J. Patrick O'Connor discussing his book The Framing of Mumia Abu-Jamal. He fingers Kenneth Freeman, who being dead, can't argue.

 

[kookbreaker]

The podcast I found (if it's the right one) is J. Patrick O'Connor discussing his book The Framing of Mumia Abu-Jamal. He fingers Kenneth Freeman, who being dead, can't argue.

Haven't heard that one in a while. Even Mumia's old lawyer said that was a bad joke.

Nobody sees this Freeman fellow, and even Mumia's own brother won't say a word about the mystery man.

 

[bynmdsue]

That's the worst part, his very own brother won't help him out, just "I didn't see anything".

Has Mumia actually ever denied it? Just come right out and say "I did not shoot him"?

 

[kookbreaker]

That's the worst part, his very own brother won't help him out, just "I didn't see anything".

I don't think Cook even said that much, I think they only thing he ever said (as quoted by the police arriving on the scene) was 'I got nothing to do with this'.

Has Mumia actually ever denied it? Just come right out and say "I did not shoot him"?

Nope. He uses a lot of weasel words and has attached his signature to the laughable Arnold Beverly story in the 11th hour. He "argues" his innocence in general terms - "society is to blame for all crimes", "I am political prisoner", etc.. Never once has he said he did not shoot Faulkner to my knowledge.

 

[bynmdsue]

Arggh! that Arnold Beverly story is so STUPID! It's like the "No Planes" of the Mumia story. It's "the driver shot JFK" stupid!

 

[Sword_Of_Truth]

And for the 30th anniversary of Faulkner's murder a bunch of yahoos got together at the Constitution Center and babble about political prisoners (yeah, shooting police officers in the face makes you a 'Political Prisoner') and Mumia gets to ramble about hwo everyone should feel sorry for him for killing someone.

The usual crap was bawled:

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/l...hering_to_mark_30_years_since_his_arrest.html

Amazing that a party to celebrate a convicted cop-killer isn't just cause to tear gas the whole bloody lot.

 

[kookbreaker]

Arggh! that Arnold Beverly story is so STUPID! It's like the "No Planes" of the Mumia story. It's "the driver shot JFK" stupid!

It even dumber than that. Captains and Liutenants of the police appear and then vanish when the first police car arrives? A helicopter moves over the scene (Philadelphia Police didn't have helicopters until the 90's), "noble Mumia" offers assistance to the wounded Faulkner only to get shot by the wounded but evil Faulkner....ugh.

And yet I have seen folks try to use it is as proof.

 

[JudeBrando]

Too bad. I would have put the needle in his arm personally.

Likewise, and still would.

 

[JudeBrando]

Good, the death penalty is always wrong.

Paraphrasing William F. Buckley, is it wrong to teach that kidnapping is wrong by kidnapping?

 

[JudeBrando]

Good, the death penalty is always wrong.

Oba Chandler was finally executed by lethal injection in Florida last month.

In 1989, Oba Chandler lured Joan Rogers, 36, and her daughters Michelle, 17, and Christe, 14, onto his boat. He proceeded to rape them, bind and gag them, chain them with concrete blocks, and then throw them overboard while still alive.

Peephole, was it wrong to execute Oba Chandler?

 

[Gazpacho]

While not opposed to the death penalty myself, I have no trouble seeing that "some very bad people got the death penalty" is a sensationalist argument that misses the point.

 

[Barber Shop]

The consensus on JREF seems to be that this man is undoubtedly guilty and the support he has received from certain quarters to be misplaced.

I did some brief searching that was not that helpful, but does anyone know WHY people support Mumia? Is there ANY reason to doubt this conviction? Just what puts the doubt in people's mind (so much so that they make a campaign out of it?)