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JFK Conspiracy Theories: It Never Ends

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matt.tansy said:
Why is it every CT is incapable of visualizing how shadows will fall in our 3D world?

Some idiotic Moon Hoax movie said one photo showed the angle cast by an astronaut's head onto the surface measured 26° but the Sun was only 15° above the horizon at the time so therefore the photo was faked. They failed to mention foreshortening.
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Shadow directions are meaningless in attempting to prove 2D photographs have been faked. Shadow directions are part of the "evidence" the Moon Hoax conspiracy kooks (like Jack White, one of Robert's photographic "experts" on the JFK assassination) used to attempt to discredit NASA photos taken on the moon on the Apollo missions.

Channel Five in the UK did a great show back in 2003 about the Moon Hoax conspiratards and demolished this shadow "evidence." Here is the link to that documentary cued up to the relevant segment.

Robert just keeps repeating his mantras. He has not come up with anything new. He has not proven anything.
 

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Border Reiver said:
Given the passage of time (48 years) what's point of this alleged conspiracy?

Any conspirators are either dead or so close to it as to make it irrelevant.

Anyone in any institution that may or may not have done anything to bring any kind of conspiracy off at the time is long since retired, as very likely their successor and their successor's successor's successor is as well, meaning that any "punishment" meted out to organizations would be beyond ludicrous.

And in the end, what would proving a conspiracy change?
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It would confirm in our minds that suspicion that the US Government had not been straight with us. Remember, this is the granddad of modern conspiracy theories. People still think that Oswald didn't act alone. Having the JFK movie come out 20 years ago didn't help in cementing the case against Oswald. Those of us who have studied it and come to the conclusion that it was Oswald and Oswald alone are in the minority.
 
Robert Prey said:
I had one guy so peeved at my ignorance of shadows that he went right to the backyard in question at the right time of day with broomstick in hand. But he failed to replicate.
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Are you Rouser2's brother? He and you use the same words, such as "amen chorus," "goose stepping," and you both referred to broomsticks in replicating the back yard photos.

Hmmmm
 
Robert Prey said:
I had one guy so peeved at my ignorance of shadows that he went right to the backyard in question at the right time of day with broomstick in hand. But he failed to replicate.
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You have also had the shadows replicated. Besides the only post I can find describing this story has you state he was removed from the premises before attempting his experiment. So hardly supporting your possition that the shadows are impossible.
 
Walter Ego said:
Robert isn't going to watch the video so here's a screen grab from the video next to the picture of Robert's hero (the one he keeps posting and claims is a fake).
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That is clearly a magical baseball cap...Or Robert is still wrong.
 
CurtC said:
Are you Rouser2's brother? He and you use the same words, such as "amen chorus," "goose stepping," and you both referred to broomsticks in replicating the back yard photos.

Hmmmm
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Odds are the person actually did a decent duplication and Rouser, err, Robert moved the goalposts and declared victory.
 
Do you Believe in Magic

bynmdsue said:
You just won't watch the video will you?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3AuNDNpY4f4

I know it's 11 mins long but you only need to see the first 30 secs.
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Looks impressive. The guy appears to have achieved the impossible. But do you believe in Magic? Each time the guy moves the angle of the pipe from 11 o'clock to 10 o'clock when showing the 90 degree shadow, which does not quite make it to 90 degrees. Nonetheless, an impressive trick. I tried, but couldn't do it even cheating. The big log is just another magicians prop, being sufficiently curved to achieve the intended shadow.
But nice try.
 
Robert Prey said:
Looks impressive. The guy appears to have achieved the impossible. But do you believe in Magic? Each time the guy moves the angle of the pipe from 11 o'clock to 10 o'clock when showing the 90 degree shadow, which does not quite make it to 90 degrees. Nonetheless, an impressive trick. I tried, but couldn't do it even cheating. The big log is just another magicians prop, being sufficiently curved to achieve the intended shadow.
But nice try.
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You're bragging that you're too inept to achieve the same result? Did you ever comprehend what the picture of the posts with shadows was telling you?

BANG!
 
Robert Prey said:
I tried, but couldn't do it even cheating. The big log is just another magicians prop, being sufficiently curved to achieve the intended shadow.
But nice try.
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Aha! We have something to add to your false dichotomy to make it a false trichotomy. Are you lying, mistaken or incompetent?
 
Robert Prey said:
Looks impressive. The guy appears to have achieved the impossible. But do you believe in Magic? Each time the guy moves the angle of the pipe from 11 o'clock to 10 o'clock when showing the 90 degree shadow, which does not quite make it to 90 degrees. Nonetheless, an impressive trick. I tried, but couldn't do it even cheating. The big log is just another magicians prop, being sufficiently curved to achieve the intended shadow.
But nice try.
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I claim this Stundie for Spain.
 
RoboTimbo said:
You're bragging that you're too inept to achieve the same result?
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The other possibility is that Robert is lying. The guy in the video duplicated the shadow in the backyard photo so it must be a magic trick. Robert isn't even trying anymore.
 
Walter Ego said:
The other possibility is that Robert is lying. The guy in the video duplicated the shadow in the backyard photo so it must be a magic trick. Robert isn't even trying anymore.
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You're asking me to believe that Robert is lying? I'll only believe that if he doesn't post the video of him trying it himself and showing his ineptitude in duplicating the shadow.

Ok, Robert. Go ahead and post your video to show you aren't lying.
 
RoboTimbo said:
You're asking me to believe that Robert is lying? I'll only believe that if he doesn't post the video of him trying it himself and showing his ineptitude in duplicating the shadow.
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I wasn't saying that Robert is necessarily lying. I'm saying there are two possibilities, that he is inept (as you suggested) or that he is being less than truthful.

Robert says the shadow angles in the backyard photo of his hero Lee Harvey Oswald cannot be recreated therefore the photo is a fake.

Robert Prey said:
I tried, but couldn't do it even cheating.
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The posted video shows the shadows can be easily recreated. Robert says it must be some kind of magic trick. You are correct, however, that Robert can clear this up by posting a video (preferably featuring himself) showing that the shadow angles cannot be recreated without trickery.

The ball is in your court, Mr. Prey.
 
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Robert Prey said:
Looks impressive. The guy appears to have achieved the impossible. But do you believe in Magic? Each time the guy moves the angle of the pipe from 11 o'clock to 10 o'clock when showing the 90 degree shadow, which does not quite make it to 90 degrees. Nonetheless, an impressive trick. I tried, but couldn't do it even cheating. The big log is just another magicians prop, being sufficiently curved to achieve the intended shadow.
But nice try.
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You are the same Robert Prey who argues that the existence of existence must mean a god outside the universe obeying different rules? That people should open their minds to the spiritual? If so... why would "magic" be an invalid response? Do you follow different rules here from the USA politics threads? Oh my... so only some kinds of magic should be believedin?

More importantly, as this is the James Randi Educational Foundation, if you mean "magic" in the stage sense, then that should give the clue that a fair few people around here have a vested interest in the simplicity of achieving "impossible" shadows.
 
Walter Ego said:
I wasn't saying that Robert is necessarily lying. I'm saying there are two possibilities, that he is inept (as you suggested) or that he is being less than truthful.

Robert says the shadow angles in the backyard photo of his hero Lee Harvey Oswald cannot be recreated therefore the photo is a fake.
The posted video shows the shadows can be easily recreated. Robert says it must be some kind of magic trick. You are correct, however, that Robert can clear this up by posting a video (preferably featuring himself) showing that the shadow angles cannot be recreated without trickery.

The ball is in your court, Mr. Prey.
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Oh, ye of little faith. This is so ridiculous, but nonetheless in the interest of science and especially FRAUD detection, here is what the shadow refraction is supposed to look like, un-tainted, forged, or slight of handed:




 
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