US church votes to ban interracial couple

[Ziggurat]

There can be no thought crimes as long as we cannot even read anyone´s thoughts.

And yet, what you actually proposed was a thought crime.

I am not sure how this incident would end up in Finland. The offence against human rights here is discrimination based on race. Not the mere thought of it (unless it publicly targets a specific person), but the act of it

But "racism" is only a thought. It is not synonymous with discrimination, which is the action.

A bit like if WalMart published a job advertisement: "White females wanted as cashiers in our shops. No blacks or hispanics." How would that end up? Or what is Greyhound bus service installed a 1940s German style "Not for Jews" sign at the door of their buses, how would that end up?

Large employers and commercial service providers are legally prohibited from practicing racial discrimination in the US. But those laws frequently don't apply to small private organizations, such as a church, because there is neither the constitutional grounds nor the need to do so.

And so the hell what if some nutjobs want their little church to be racially pure? Let them have it. Everyone else is better off staying away from those loons, and allowing them to practice their lunacy serves as an easy way to broadcast to everyone else that they're lunatics.

Similarly, there should be a difference between campaigning for legalization of racism (in a universal sense, without targetting any specific person) and acting as if racial discrimination were legal now as we speak (a crime for which a punishment should be determined in legislation).

But it's only a crime in certain contexts. This isn't one of those contexts. Nor should it be. Hell, it's not even possible to stop racial discrimination via legislation. You'll just drive it underground and make it fester like rotting sore. People who aren't racist will end up getting hassled (and possibly even turned racist out of resentment), and people who are racist will just be more careful about how they act on their racism. We're better off only trying to stop it through government intervention where it really matters, and it doesn't really matter here.

 

[ponderingturtle]

The entire Neanderthal race, come to think of it. Consider that "neander" means "new man". I think you're on(to) something, TM.

Odd name for a valley which is where the Neanderthal name comes from.

 

[RecoveringYuppy]

Odd name for a valley which is where the Neanderthal name comes from.

The species is named for the valley, which was named for a person, whose name was the Greek for "New Man", IIRC.

 

[bikerdruid]

just out of curiosity...
is there no central authority for the baptist churches?
are ministers not held to something of a common standard within their church?
how would they feel about this decision?

 

[RecoveringYuppy]

just out of curiosity...
is there no central authority for the baptist churches?
are ministers not held to something of a common standard within their church?
how would they feel about this decision?

Depends on the church but Baptists are quite the opposite of centralized. The wikipedia article on Baptists cover this. So does Emo Phillips:

 

[RecoveringYuppy]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Baptist_sub-denominations

 

[WildCat]

The species is named for the valley, which was named for a person, whose name was the Greek for "New Man", IIRC.

Newman!

 

[Gazpacho]

Depends on the church but Baptists are quite the opposite of centralized. The wikipedia article on Baptists cover this. So does Emo Phillips:

And that highlights the context in which the church made its decision. Any union of Baptists, from congregations to state and national conventions, is based on a basic unanimity of faith. When unanimity breaks down over a question of faith (and anything can become a question of faith), the typical response is to leave the convention or divide the congregation. Baptists are fundamentally anarchic.

 

[Architect]

They do realize, don't they, that US has freedom of speech and association, and ...

Yes, about twice a month someone from the US likes to state this as if they're the only country in the world to enjoy such rights....

 

[Cleon]

"Turns out the whole world now thinks we're racist morons. Let's have a revote."

 

[JamesDillon]

"Turns out the whole world now thinks we're racist morons. Let's have a revote."

This sounds even worse, actually:

Stacy Stepp, pastor of the Gulnare Free Will Baptist Church in Pike County, told The Associated Press that the vote by nine people last week was declared null and void after it was determined that new bylaws can't run contrary to local, state or national laws. He said the proposal was discriminatory, therefore it couldn't be adopted.

So in other words, we've decided that since our first vote was illegal (even though it wasn't, unless there's some weird local ordinance about this, and even then I'd bet the church would be exempt under the First Amendment), we'd better change it, and oh look we're not racist any more.

 

[MaGZ]

Pretty rich for a religion founded by someone who was not only mixed-race, but claimed to be mixed-species as well!

If there is a picture of Jesus on the wall of that church you can bet he is White and Nordic.

 

[Cleon]

This sounds even worse, actually:

So in other words, we've decided that since our first vote was illegal (even though it wasn't, unless there's some weird local ordinance about this, and even then I'd bet the church would be exempt under the First Amendment), we'd better change it, and oh look we're not racist any more.

Yeah, they've been taking lessons in damage control from Jerry Sandusky.

Whether the rule stayed or was overturned, this little stunt ensured that no person who's even slightly tan will ever come to their church. So in the end, they got what they wanted.

 

[Cleon]

If there is a picture of Jesus on the wall of that church you can bet he is White and Nordic.

Well, yeah. Racists aren't real good with accuracy and realism. Otherwise, they wouldn't be racists.

 

[MaGZ]

That's not mixed-race; that's not even mixed-species. That's... I don't know what that is but it ain't natural.

"Myth" is the word you are looking for.

 

[MaGZ]

Well, yeah. Racists aren't real good with accuracy and realism. Otherwise, they wouldn't be racists.

Would you prefer Jesus to look like Henry Kissinger?

 

[JamesDillon]

Interestingly I'm up tonight looking at poll data on attitudes toward miscegenation for a paper, and am stunned to see how controversial this issue was not all that long ago. When Loving v. Virginia was decided (in 1967! We're not talking early 50s here), a majority of the nation felt that interracial marriage was immoral. Approval didn't break 50% until the early 70s, and even as late as 1980, the last date on the poll I'm looking at, it was only around 70%.

 

[Cleon]

Would you prefer Jesus to look like Henry Kissinger?

"Nordic" to "German" isn't much of a stylistic leap, really.

 

[Cleon]

Interestingly I'm up tonight looking at poll data on attitudes toward miscegenation for a paper, and am stunned to see how controversial this issue was not all that long ago. When Loving v. Virginia was decided (in 1967! We're not talking early 50s here), a majority of the nation felt that interracial marriage was immoral. Approval didn't break 50% until the early 70s, and even as late as 1980, the last date on the poll I'm looking at, it was only around 70%.

I remember a few years ago when Alabama finally decided to repeal the still-on-the-books-but-not-legally-enforceable ban on interracial marriage. There was an active campaign and protests against the repeal.

 

[MaGZ]

"Nordic" to "German" isn't much of a stylistic leap, really.

A Jew is a Jew regardless of where he is born.