Merged General Holocaust denial discussion thread

[Wroclaw]

So, um, dead people don't disappear? Really? Any idea how BIG the world is?

 

[Saggy]

Yeah, I'm terrible.

Zionists are allowed to insult at will, it's a given. They do it so often they don't even notice, it is common currency for them.

It is a tactic used to destroy any attempt at rational discussion. There are many Zionist posters who do nothing but post insult after insult. It's an effective tactic.

Occasionally if the infraction in egregious enough to be embarrassing the moderators will move it to another thread.

 

[Dogzilla]

Are you denying he was a real human being, regardless of how his story was documented?

Vladek was a real person but he wasn't a mouse. His "story" was documented as a work of fiction.

 

[Saggy]

and you have any evidence that any of the books listed are ********,

Of course I do, and it's already been presented. The publisher's blurb for 'The End of the Holohoax' says that the book contrasts the insufficiently serious tone of Hollywood's latest efforts with the solemn analysis of serious authors like "...... Elie Wiesel .....". If the author thinks Wiesel is a serious 'witness' to the hoax, then the author is obviously a complete fraud.

 

[Dogzilla]

.
A lot of them went to camps as traced by the Nazis themselves, and no trace was ever found of them going anywhere else. Nor was any trace ever found of them still living in the camps to this day.

Conclusion: the traces show that they died there.



Anything else for Captain Obvious to answer, or do you want to go back to your lame attempts at showing that there is any double standard related to the Holocaust other than your own?
.

But there's no trace of all of them dying there, which there would be if they had all died there in the way we're told they did. So they either went somewhere else, were never sent there, or they disappeared without a trace.

 

[LemmyCaution]

Of course I do, and it's already been presented. The publisher's blurb for 'The End of the Holohoax' says that the book contrasts the insufficiently serious tone of Hollywood's latest efforts with the solemn analysis of serious authors like "...... Elie Wiesel .....". If the author thinks Wiesel is a serious 'witness' to the hoax, then the author is obviously a complete fraud.

Evidence = dust jackets, promo copy, adverts, Amazon blurbs -- written by underpaid assistants not conversant in what they write about. This is Revisionism in Action . . .

 

[Dogzilla]

Are you unable to read my posts?

They were murdered. There is overwhelming evidence of that.

OK. They were murdered. That means they're dead. So, where did they go? The way they are suppose to have been murdered would have left overwhelming evidence--evidence which does not exist.

 

[TSR]

But there's no trace of all of them dying there, which there would be if they had all died there in the way we're told they did.

.
You've never been to Auschwitz, then, or spoken to anyone that told you the truth about it.

There are bone shards all over. You know, almost as if they had been cremated, and the cremains ground.

And what traces are you expecting to find of the ash that was dumped in the river?

Tell us (this ought to be good) -- what traces "ought there to be" which are missing?
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So they either went somewhere else, were never sent there, or they disappeared without a trace.

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We know that they didn't go anywhere else, there *are* traces which would be found in the form of train manifests and witness statements -- you know, like the ones that tell us that they were indeed sent there.

And since the traces *do* exist, my recommendation is that you go back to whining that those traces were handled in a different way than traces of other mass murders -- let's say, The Great Crime -- thereby demonstrating that double standard you whine about with a *valid* comparison, very much unlike those comparisons you have thus far tried to draw...
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[R.A.F.]

If the author thinks Wiesel is a serious 'witness' to the hoax, then the author is obviously a complete fraud.

Don't you get it...when you say things like this, we all laugh...

You have so poisoned the well with your irrationality, that you're "word" is LESS THAN MEANINGLESS.

If you say something is a fraud, then IT IS AN IRON CLAD GUARANTEE IT MUST BE TRUE...


That is what happens when you misrepresent historical fact...you throw away your credibility.

Ain't you proud of yourself.

 

[R.A.F.]

Zionists are allowed to insult at will, it's a given. They do it so often they don't even notice, it is common currency for them.

It is a tactic used to destroy any attempt at rational discussion. There are many Zionist posters who do nothing but post insult after insult. It's an effective tactic.

Occasionally if the infraction in egregious enough to be embarrassing the moderators will move it to another thread.

How's the shine coming on the skin head, saggy??

 

[Dogzilla]

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No, deniers tend to stay away from actually explaining the evidence.

If you want to learn about the how, I recommend actual ***scientists** such as Pressac. He, like you, really wanted the gas chambers not to have worked. He, unlike you, actually looked at the available evidence and went where that evidence lead him regarding their operation.

I knew it wouldn't take long for someone to mention that book. It might be helpful if it weren't so poorly written (or translated) and if it were actually available in print.

According to whom? The rest of us non-deniers here realize that the roughly half of Holocaust victims your heroes exterminated outside the camps by deliberate starvation, neglect or a simple bullet are still worthy of being remembered.
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That still leaves millions of people dead in gas chambers.

 

[LSSBB]

Vladek was a real person but he wasn't a mouse. His "story" was documented as a work of fiction.

It wasn't documented as fiction, it was documented via alternative media.

 

[Humanzee]

Thanks for that post Nick.

 

[Dogzilla]

Of course murdered people disappear. We know where they went. Into the ground, then into the air. We know it was possible because after the War was over, a large amount of Jews were missing.

Then they're missing. Just like there were alot of non-Jews missing after the war.

And a large amount of corroborative evidence was found. Not just Blobel's testimony.

Like what?

Why doesn't it come close to being possible that people were gassed and burned at the Reinhardt camps, Dogzilla? Because you say so? You can't just stomp your feet.

It's not gassing and burning that is impossible. It's the scale.

Or is it because a Revisionists tried to make a barbecue of his wife's pork chops in his back yard to demonstrate against cremation?

No. It's because I know how the AR camps are suppose to have worked and I have rudimentary math skills that I'm not afraid to use when I read about these camps.

 

[Dogzilla]

So, um, dead people don't disappear? Really? Any idea how BIG the world is?

So....you're saying that people do disappear without a trace? Do you guys even read each other's crap?

But let's take that first guy you said disappeared without a trace. Multiply him by 700,000 and we'll have the beginning of a meaningful comparison.

Then take the world and narrow it down to 13 acres.

Then bury that one guy and his 699,999 doppelgangers within that 13 acres.

Then dig them up and incinerate their bodies.

Then rebury the remains of the bodies and the incinerations pyres in the original holes.

Now, here's the hard part, clean up the site so it isn't obvious what you've done. Feel free to hire a Ukranian to farm the property or get a bunch of Poles to bring their old artillery shells down to the site to blow it up. Whatever you think will work.

 

[Corsair 115]

It is a tactic used to destroy any attempt at rational discussion.

Rational discussion from someone who posits a vast, worldwide conspiracy by which a select group of people control the media, academia, and everything else, would seem to be a non-starter.

Or, as Bart Simpson once observed, the ironing is delicious.

 

[Dogzilla]

It wasn't documented as fiction, it was documented via alternative media.

It was documented as a comic book and it's a work of fiction. Or do you believe Jews really are mice?

 

[Dogzilla]

There doesn't seem to be very much left of your two specious claims that

1) the Holocaust is held to a different standard of evidence to other events

and

2) that 'absence of evidence is not evidence of absence' somehow plays a role in this

Those were your claims, right? So no "sleight of hand" in continuing to address them. Since you've evidently been reduced to weaseling out of what you previously wrote and are left with little more than general poo-flinging, unless you have anything further to add on the subjects of (1) and (2) we can conclude this by saying that you were, as usual, wrong.



You're right, I forgot, you never actually say anything coherent.



Because it's funnier to watch you speculate wildly and make an idiot of yourself.



Ever heard of libraries?



David Hackett Fischer's Historians' Fallacies is a classic philosophy of history text. It's also very readable. If you were really interested in the problems you raise in this thread then you should be trying to educate yourself using such books, as they might actually answer some of your questions and show you where you are going wrong.



Yeah, me and Raul Hilberg and Christian Gerlach and Alina Skibinska and Robert Kuwalek and Ben Kiernan and Hannah Arendt and all the other people I mentioned in a previous post, sure, we collectively have had less influence than Michael Shermer and the webmaster at hdot.org.

It is clearly going to be an excruciatingly pointless waste of time watching you dredge up another tenuous example, so the end result is: two peripheral voices mentioning 'absence of blah', a zillion others not mentioning it, still no double standard proven, Dogzilla once again proven to be a mass-debater who makes stuff up then cannot justify it, even after dozens of posts.

I proved my point. I was challenged to find one example. I found twice as many examples as necessary. That didn't prove that the holocaust is held to a different standard. It was you guys and your violent reaction against my rather insignificant win that showed this double standard regarding the holocaust is far more universal.

 

[Dogzilla]

I don't need to offer anything up. The observations are self-evident. If you can link to a single news story where revisionist activism resulted in the cancellation of so much as one class on the Holocaust or a publisher turning down one book written from a mainstream perspective, then my claims would be falsified. I am quite confident you will fail to produce any such story.

Well there was that rumor going around that the United Kingdom or maybe the University of Kentucky cancelled holocaust classes for fear of offending Muslim students. Evidently there actually was one school that did modify it's holocaust education so I guess you've been falsified.

of the progression of research and the ability of historians to synthesise their findings in a variety of forms.

Why is it significant that it was Russians?

and you have any evidence that any of the books listed are ********, other than your wishful thinking? Of course you don't. You haven't read any of them, but already you know that they're wrong, because! you! say! so!.

If they support the traditional story, they're wrong.

What an utterly stupid thing to say. Since when do academic books sell millions of copies? They don't. That doesn't stop them being the first port of call for researchers and teachers aiming to study a subject.

Most authors would like their books to have some relevance. Selling millions of copies and being read by millions of students studying the holocaust is one way of measuring relevance. How many of those books on your list will be relevant? How many of them will even be the "first port of call" for researchers and teachers?

I understand, really I do, that you want the world to be dumbed down to your moronic level, but this is a skeptics' forum and we don't play it like that.

Yes, if only everybody were stupid enough to doubt a flaming pit of babies.

I'm going off to watch The Walking Dead. I will name the first zombie to be blasted 'Dogzilla', in your honour.

Another evening of high brow entertainment, eh?

 

[Matthew Ellard]

Now, here's the hard part, clean up the site so it isn't obvious what you've done. Feel free to hire a Ukranian to farm the property or get a bunch of Poles to bring their old artillery shells down to the site to blow it up. Whatever you think will work.

Lucky we have a photo then, of a bunch of Poles doing exactly that......note victim's skulls in foreground.....

http://media.photobucket.com/image/golden harvest treblinka/neugierig/Treblinka.jpg