How do truthers explain the phone calls?

[dannyb]

Surely, this is one of the most damning pieces of evidence against their position: witnesses giving a live account of a plane hijacking. Now I know some of them have tried to explain this with voice generation apparatus but, surely, the more sensible truthers (if that's not a contradiction of terms) will know that you can't generate characteristics, personal information etc. without significant pre-background of someone.

So, how did they manage to simulate a hijacking to which people bore witness on the 'real' planes, whilst the 'fake' planes hit the buildings? How, also, did they get the timing just right for Betty Ong's call to cut off as flight 11 hit the North Tower?

Thanks.

 

[Dash80]

Surely, this is one of the most damning pieces of evidence against their position: witnesses giving a live account of a plane hijacking. Now I know some of them have tried to explain this with voice generation apparatus but, surely, the more sensible truthers (if that's not a contradiction of terms) will know that you can't generate characteristics, personal information etc. without significant pre-background of someone.

So, how did they manage to simulate a hijacking to which people bore witness on the 'real' planes, whilst the 'fake' planes hit the buildings? How, also, did they get the timing just right for Betty Ong's call to cut off as flight 11 hit the North Tower?

Thanks.

Truthers do not care, quite simply. They will cry fake and pee on the victims, all in the name of "truth."

It's not just the plane victims who get the pissed on treatment. The voices coming from inside the towers are subjected to truthers JAQing off and quote mining them.

 

[timhau]

Hey, you can explain anything if you don't have to factor in reality.

 

[Dave Rogers]

The short answer is, they don't, because they don't recognise any obligation to construct a coherent hypothesis. The truth movement is nothing to do with trying to establish the truth about what happened on 9/11, however much they claim it is; it's about denying that the events of 9/11 happened the way they are understood to have happened. If there's an aspect of events that can only be explained in terms of our existing understanding, then that issue needs to be obscured, confused and avoided, because it disagrees with the conclusion they want to draw.

Dave

 

[Dash80]

It amazes me that truthers want us to believe the perps pulled off this attack, convincing almost everyone... but made so many silly mistakes. For example: I had a truther tell me Betty Ong's call is fake because at first she says she's on flight 12 and the perps can't get their facts right.


Ok... Clever enough to pull off this fakery but not enough to get the right flight number? Lol

Or flight 77's FDR data "is wrong"
So they're clever enough to fake a plane crash but not clever enough to make the "planted" data fit the facts? Lol

 

[sylvan8798]

Truthers believe that the government (or the illuminati/ruling elite/jews/etc.) is some group with such power that it can pull off an event requiring the participation of tens of thousands at the very least. They believe that participants and those on the periphery who may be "aware" of the plot on some level are paid, intimidated, or brainwashed into silence. In fact the existence of the conspiracy theory itself is part of the plot - a device put out there to confuse and to make the CT's seem like nuts so they can be dismissed by most of the public, who will then also dismiss any legitimate claims. Actual participants know they won't be believed even if they DO risk their lives/jobs/families by coming forward.

Given the all-powerful nature of this ruling entity, it is a small leap to believing that they can fake a few phone calls with voice morphing technology. I asked at one time whether anyone had ever examined them case-by-case to determine how long in advance of 9/11 TPTB would have known they were scheduled to fly, so they could collect the required data. The response was basically that in cases where it couldn't have been faked, they simply ordered the family member(s) to go along with the story and SAY they had been called.

Dash80 - the best one is that the "planted" plane parts in NYC and PA were from the wrong kind of plane. Sheesh!

 

[bill smith]

Truthers believe that the government (or the illuminati/ruling elite/jews/etc.) is some group with such power that it can pull off an event requiring the participation of tens of thousands at the very least. They believe that participants and those on the periphery who may be "aware" of the plot on some level are paid, intimidated, or brainwashed into silence. In fact the existence of the conspiracy theory itself is part of the plot - a device put out there to confuse and to make the CT's seem like nuts so they can be dismissed by most of the public, who will then also dismiss any legitimate claims. Actual participants know they won't be believed even if they DO risk their lives/jobs/families by coming forward.

Given the all-powerful nature of this ruling entity, it is a small leap to believing that they can fake a few phone calls with voice morphing technology. I asked at one time whether anyone had ever examined them case-by-case to determine how long in advance of 9/11 TPTB would have known they were scheduled to fly, so they could collect the required data. The response was basically that in cases where it couldn't have been faked, they simply ordered the family member(s) to go along with the story and SAY they had been called.

Dash80 - the best one is that the "planted" plane parts in NYC and PA were from the wrong kind of plane. Sheesh!

On the 'Conspiracy Roadshow' last week an audio expert demonstrated voice morphing technology. I assume his gear was nowhere near as advanced as what the military might have- yet he was still able to record a sample of one of the female participants, type in a sentence of his own choosing and play it back. You would never have known that it was not the girl herself speaking.

 

[Scott Sommers]

This phone call thing is one of the most disturbing aspects of 9/11 conspiracy thinking. Dave Rogers is generally correct when he says,

The short answer is, they don't, because they don't recognise any obligation to construct a coherent hypothesis. The truth movement is nothing to do with trying to establish the truth about what happened on 9/11, however much they claim it is; it's about denying that the events of 9/11 happened the way they are understood to have happened.

I spend a lot of time listening to Truthers talk to each other about what they think happened and many of them will talk about they think went on. As well, there are many other conspiracy theorists who would not generally be called Truthers but who incorporate ideas of a government-led 9/11 attack into their conspiratorial thinking. Inevitably, you end up with the situation that sylvan8798 mentions that,

They believe that participants and those on the periphery who may be "aware" of the plot on some level are paid, intimidated, or brainwashed into silence.

In particular, you start hearing a lot of talk about 'brainwashing' or 'mind-control techniques'. There seems to be some widespread belief in the conspiracy community that 1960s programs like MK-ULTRA were successful in developing procedures whose operators can use to make people think and do anything they want.

 

[Dash80]

The Pentagon plane is "supposed" to have the wrong parts too.

Seems like truthers want us to believe these perps have research skills just as bad as theirs!

Perp 1: "Oh my god someone planted parts from the wrong type of plane, which idiot did I assign the research to?"

Perp 2: "Uh yeah, that would be me Sir. I just picked up a few scrap parts and did what you asked, planes are all the same anyway... right Sir?"

 

[Dash80]

On the 'Conspiracy Roadshow' last week an audio expert demonstrated voice morphing technology. I assume his gear was nowhere near as advanced as what the military might have- yet he was still able to record a sample of one of the female participants, type in a sentence of his own choosing and play it back. You would never have known that it was not the girl herself speaking.

Then he explained it would be very difficult if not impossible to do in real time, in a real two-way conversation. Did you go to the bathroom during that part bill?

 

[tjlance1]

On the 'Conspiracy Roadshow' last week an audio expert demonstrated voice morphing technology. I assume his gear was nowhere near as advanced as what the military might have- yet he was still able to record a sample of one of the female participants, type in a sentence of his own choosing and play it back. You would never have known that it was not the girl herself speaking.

I would love to see you and others like you that actually believe the government faked these phone calls have to face those families who received the alleged faked calls. Maybe truthers should grow a pair and actually have the guts to tell those families to their faces that the last words they heard from their loved ones were fake...

 

[bill smith]

Then he explained it would be very difficult if not impossible to do in real time, in a real two-way conversation. Did you go to the bathroom during that part bill?

Sure....but it can be done. That is now set in stone.

 

[newton3376]

Then he explained it would be very difficult if not impossible to do in real time, in a real two-way conversation. Did you go to the bathroom during that part bill?

Especially in September of 2001.....

 

[bill smith]

I would love to see you and others like you that actually believe the government faked these phone calls have to face those families who received the alleged faked calls. Maybe truthers should grow a pair and actually have the guts to tell those families to their faces that the last words they heard from their loved ones were fake...

I'm a dispassionate researcher. I seperate myself from the emotional side of the issue and just look at the technical detail. You can wear your heart on your sleeve if you wish but don't expect me to.

 

[tjlance1]

I'm a dispassionate researcher. I seperate myself from the emotional side of the issue and just look at the technical detail. You can wear your heart on your sleeve if you wish but don't expect me to.

Oh lawdy..really?? You are supporting a charge that phone calls were faked with not one shred of proof...you should have to talk to those family members and dispassionately tell them they were duped...

 

[sylvan8798]

One particularly nasty truther on another forum had a term which I don't remember, but he claimed the parts were wrong on purpose as a message from the Illuminati to those who could read the message (and be warned, etc.). "They" wanted the public at large to believe that it was Al Qaeda, but they wanted their minions to know who was actually behind it.

 

[dannyb]

Sure....but it can be done. That is now set in stone.

Recreating a voice - yes. Having all the personal information and doing it in real time - no.

It seems you're prepared to go to great lengths in order to keep this thing going - hardly the actions of a 'dispassionate researcher'.

 

[bill smith]

Oh lawdy..really?? You are supporting a charge that phone calls were faked with not one shred of proof...you should have to talk to those family members and dispassionately tell them they were duped...

Cry me a river...

 

[Dash80]

Sure....but it can be done. That is now set in stone.

CAN does not mean DID.

 

[newton3376]

I'm a dispassionate researcher. I seperate myself from the emotional side of the issue and just look at the technical detail. You can wear your heart on your sleeve if you wish but don't expect me to.

WHAT?

Bill....you are most certainly NOT technical.

You have zero technical qualifications in terms of education or work experience......and your posts have not shown that you are adept at technical details whether the topic is physics, mathematics, technology, engineering, etc.

You are most certainly NOT technical and do not have good research skills.

Please do not insult those of us who DO have a technical background by writing such things.