Merged Apollo "hoax" discussion / Lick observatory laser saga

[Buckaroo]

I wonder: at what point does engaging this guy amount to exploiting for our own amusement someone who is clearly not well? How uncomfortable should I be with all this?

 

[Hans]

I wonder: at what point does engaging this guy amount to exploiting for our own amusement someone who is clearly not well? How uncomfortable should I be with all this?

I think this is like visting Bedlam during the Victorian age to view the madmen.

I won't put him on ignore but will stop posting in this thread

 

[Buckaroo]

I think this is like visting Bedlam during the Victorian age to view the madmen.

I won't put him on ignore but will stop posting in this thread

Yeah, I think I'm with you.

 

[nomuse]

Take a look at the 2 Armstrong shots where the earth appears in moonscapes and compare its appearance with the software representations. In the former it is blue and bright and in the latter dark. As I said, I'll move on. As I have made my points, I respectfully concede to all the excellent points you have made above with respect to the software and conditions at the time.

Oh, so the conspiracy secretly altered a 3rd-party piece of commercial software but forgot to dim the Earth in the faked surface photographs?

Who is running this conspiracy, Doctor Drakken (from Kim Possible?)

 

[TheRedWorm]

Hey, Pat, do you believe your arguments?

And

Do you think that anyone else here does?

 

[nomuse]

Note above, Lunney specifically states, "without housekeeping duties". the diarrhea story cannot be true. If it were, the flight surgeons would have the astronauts scrub the cabin, with whatever they had at their disposal, or at least discuss what they had at their disposal. Jia Ping there is a very smart gal. But then again, she deals with genuine infections all of the time.

Oh, now you are an expert in NASA-speak? You think "without housekeeping duties" means nobody cleans nothing, just throw the trash into the air and leave the seat up, too?

 

[Loss Leader]

Jia Ping's husband did the honors of translating Lunney's English to be sure she understood well. She said, "Patrick, how could they tell so fast it was not an infectious gastroenteritis. There would be no way to tell and the bacteria would be floating all over the space ship. They could even breath the bacteria in. That does not seem right to me. I do not believe that."

One way they could have decided it was space sickness: they relied on their experience with the crew of Apollo 7, as well as reports about Russians having the same problem.

Another way was that they could just wait to see if the other astronauts got sick. Apollo 8 was already in translunar flight when Borman got sick. Turning around was not recommended. They had to round the moon to come back. So, since the capsule was going around the moon anyway, the emergency plan was exactly the same as the main plan.

They also knew that Borman had been quarantined before the flight specifically to lower the risk of infectious illness. So, they may have relied on that.

Borman is still alive. I imagine you could ask him. Be careful, though. Some astronauts have been known to throw a punch.

 

[Jrrarglblarg]

Her husband is a physicist, age 52.

I don't know any adult who refers randomly to people's age. That's the sign of a child:

"Dear Santa: I want a pony and a new ipod. Signed, Patty, age 7"

Real grownups don't talk that way. This kid is a waste of time and bandwidth. He's not interested in learning and he will continue to spew his idiocy.

ZPE

 

[abaddon]

Sitting in a Shanghai Caffe' yesterday, my friend Jia Ping, a Chinese highly skilled nurse practitioner with expertise in infectious diseases, and also a woman with an awareness of my rather new interest in Apollo 11 fraudulence, asked me if I had come across anything new with respect to my personal investigation. Her husband is a physicist, age 52. He works primarily as a programmer now, but had done a great deal of aerospace work at one time. Years back, when I first met him, he and another Chinese man were going on and on about how Apollo just could not be legitimate. Their point at the time was that one would have anticipated continued progress with respect to manned space exploration, if in no other arena, than simply in the arena of continued lunar exploration, had the Apollo program been authentic. At the time, I thought the discussion was interesting, but off target, and admittedly, the details were lost given my poor command of Mandarin at the time. Even now, having studied the language better than ten years with some dedication, I would not be able to follow such a discussion very well at all.

The nurse Jia Ping, I met here in Shanghai years back doing some work and we have stayed good friends. She's found it amusing that I have come over to her husband's way of thinking. We had a good laugh. That actually would be an understatement.

During the caffe' chat, I showed Jia Ping a copy of the Mission Control flight officers' book, FROM THE TRENCHES OF MISSION CONTROL TO THE CRATERS OF THE MOON. She does not read English, but as she asked, I informed her that based on H. David Reed's testimony in chapter three, testimony backed up and fully supported by the astronauts' own accounts(scripted of course) of events, astronaut accounts in which they themselves claim not to know where the Eagle was(see my previous well referenced posts related to astronaut statements of coordinate/landing site unawareness), one could then examine the Apollo 11 Mission Report, as well as other NASA primary materials and demonstrate without any ambiguity whatsoever that the Mission Report had to have been forged/fraudulent, given it was at odds with the astronauts' own scripted accounts. She asked me to bring the book by her house to show to her husband.

And so I did, leaving it with him for the balance of my stay in Asia. His English is quite good and he was of course fascinated to say the least. Just before we parted, I flipped through the electronic version of the same book I have on my computer and showed Jia Ping the nurse this, from the long opening essay in the book by Fight Director Glynn S. Lunney. Lunney's Chapter One, THE FLIGHT DYNAMICS STORY, was Copyrighted in 2010 and the book's first edition was copyrighted 2011;

"On the tape, the crew reported the first motion type sickness in one of our astronauts, Frank Borman. This event made for much conversation with management and the flight surgeons, but in the end the crew had a three day coast period out to the moon withlight housekeeping duties. Before arrival at the moon, the symptoms had sufficiently abated."

Maurice Kennedy; Charles Deiterich III; William Stoval; William Boone III; Glynn S. Lunney; H. David Reed; Jerry C. Bostick (2011-05-13). From The Trench of Mission Control to the Craters of The Moon (ebook Locations 3977-3981).


Jia Ping's husband did the honors of translating Lunney's English to be sure she understood well. She said, "Patrick, how could they tell so fast it was not an infectious gastroenteritis. There would be no way to tell and the bacteria would be floating all over the space ship. They could even breath the bacteria in. That does not seem right to me. I do not believe that."

This is a woman who has never before voiced an opinion on Apollo authenticity before, one way or the other.

As I was just stepping out the door, Jia Ping's husband said, "Patrick, you know that you are really on to something, examining their words carefully as you do. Why didn't someone think of this before?"

I said, "I do not know. Please keep the book. i need all of the help I can get."

I leave my friends here in Shanghai in a few days, finally to arrive in Delhi at the middle of the week I imagine. Until then, I'll answer as many of your questions as I possibly can and summarize my own thoughts. Looks like I have found a couple of allies here in Shanghai. Brought a smile to my face.

You Claimed to be flying to Delhi, yet now find yourself in Shanghai?
Several thousand miles from Delhi?
Talking to a nurse, husband age 52?
And you can name the nurse repeatedly, but not the physicist?
And you are unsure when you arrive in Delhi? What, no flight booked?
Finally to arrive in the middle of the week you imagine? Do they not have flight schedules in Asia? Or are you planning to trek there?

From all the rot you post, I can only conclude you are some spotty teenager in a basement somewhere, or possibly younger, given the writing style.

 

[abaddon]

I don't know any adult who refers randomly to people's age. That's the sign of a child:

"Dear Santa: I want a pony and a new ipod. Signed, Patty, age 7"

Real grownups don't talk that way. This kid is a waste of time and bandwidth. He's not interested in learning and he will continue to spew his idiocy.

ZPE

Agree.

Likely we all once thought we knew it all, but age and experience teaches lessons. Sometimes hard ones.

Paddy1k provides no more than the ranting and fantasy of a kid.

I am not going to engage with it any more.

 

[JohnG]

Agree.

Likely we all once thought we knew it all, but age and experience teaches lessons. Sometimes hard ones.

Paddy1k provides no more than the ranting and fantasy of a kid.

I am not going to engage with it any more.

abaddon all hope

 

[Oji]

I pointed this out actually for others of my ilk, other HB types that may want to check this out, see what they think.

Has any other HB ever come along to say that the Sock Theatre is right? I suspect they are more likely to be in the background cringing in embarrassment (or maybe laughing like the rest of us).

 

[abaddon]

abaddon all hope

Yuk, yuk, yuk.

It's funny how often my handle gets misspelt as "abandon"

 

[dafydd]

I think this is like visting Bedlam during the Victorian age to view the madmen.

I won't put him on ignore but will stop posting in this thread

Me too. I find his constant stream of mendacity entertaining but no more posts.

 

[drewid]

EEEEE Gads Talk about a mountain out of a molehill!!!

You were the one that thought it important enough to start a new thread on the topic.


How's Lucinda?

 

[Kiwi9]

[Quote from Glynn Lunney]...the crew had a three day coast period out to the moon withlight housekeeping duties...

Note above, Lunney specifically states, "without housekeeping duties".

Patrick1000: Do you even read and understand your own material? First you quote Lunney saying "with light housekeeping duties" (I presume the lack of a space is a mistake on your part) and then you tell us to note that he said something else. Well done!

What exactly did Lunney say? And no, don't claim it is irrelevant, because it shows what a sloppy researcher you are.

I have now twice recommended you clear up some of your "coordinate confusion" by seeing what coordinates Lick used at least until the Preliminary Science Report was written. Are you going to do the simple little task mentioned in post 1255, or do you need me to do it for you?

Please pay attention to this because it is something that you must see and note.

Because you have ignored both posts on this matter, as you so often do, I include the first one, No. 1255, below:

Patrick1000.

As a knowledgeable Apollo person you must be completely familiar with the Apollo Lunar Surface Journal and its resources, so please go there and look up the Preliminary Science Report for Apollo 11 and report back to everyone here what it says on page 180 about the coordinates used by Lick Observatory up until the writing of the report.

Then tell us how this fits in with your claims about coordinates.

And please don't disingenuously claim that that report on the LRRR is just a whole lot of lies published by NASA, because at the end of it you will see that it was written by the following:

C. O. Alley (University of Maryland), P. L. Bender (National Bureau of Standards), B. Bopp (McDonald Observatory), R. F. Chang (University of Maryland), D. G. Currie (University of Maryland), R. H. Dicke (Princeton University), James E. Faller (Wesleyan University), Tom Johnson (NASA Goddard Space Flight Center), W. M. Kaula (University of California at Los Angeles), G. J. F. MacDonald (University of California at Santa Barbara), J. D. Mulholland (JPL), J. Mullendore (University of Maryland), H. H. Plotkin (NASA Goddard Space Flight Center), S. K. Poultney (University of Maryland), J. Rayner (University of Maryland), Harvey Richardson (McDonald Observatory), Lloyd Robinson (Lick Observatory, University of California), E. Silverberg (University of Maryland), Paul Spadin (NASA Goddard Space Flight Center), C. Steggerda (University of Maryland), E. Joseph Wampler (Lick Observatory, University of California), Brian Warner (McDonald Observatory), Donald Wieber (Lick Observatory, University of California), D. T. Wilkinson (Princeton University), W. Williams (NASA Goddard Space Flight Center), and Irvin Winer (Wesleyan University).

 

[Patrick1000]

Star phobia, lasers, coordinate confusion and hiding the bird

STAR PHOBIA, LASERS, COORDINATE CONFUSION AND HIDING THE BIRD

During the Apollo 11 post flight press conference, BBC journalist Patrick Moore asks the Apollo 11 moonwalkers;

"when you looked up at the sky, could you actually see the the stars in the solar corona in spite of the glare?"

Answering on behalf of NASA's trio of employees, Neil Armstrong responded to Patrick Moore with;

"We were never able to see the stars from the lunar surface or on the daylight side of the moon by eye, without looking through the optics. I don't recall during the period of time that we were photographing the solar corona what stars we could see."

In 1970, Neil Armstrong was interviewed in a one on one setting by BBC journalist Patrick Moore. On this occasion, Moore again asked the question about the appearance of stars from the lunar surface and elsewhere. It's only natural. Of course we'd all like to know. It's what we're all familiar with here on earth, the stars, and it wasn't surprising that Moore asked this question first. He queried;

"Mr. Armstrong…Could you tell us something about what the sky actually looks like from the moon, the sun the earth the stars if any, and so on?"

Armstrong responded;

"The sky is a deep black when viewed from the the moon, as it is when viewed from cislunar space, the space between the earth and the moon. The earth is the only visible object other than the sun that can be seen , although there have been some reports of seeing planets. I myself did not see planets from the surface, but I suspect they might be visible."

Armstrong's response to Moore's query has struck many, myself included, as simply preposterous. It is an unqualified statement as best one can tell. The absurdity of this response from the Apollo 11 Mission commander has been discussed ad nauseam, and rightly so, but heretofore it has been an absurdity in search of a rationale, an explanation. It's such a glaring lie, a risky lie really. It's so "out there", Armstrong's making this statement. There must be a rationale for telling such a risky lie, a motivation for its telling, a motivation of an insanely compelling magnitude. Must be, and well, it turns out, its both subtle and starkly obvious at the same time, this motivation.

Subtle, because the rationale for telling the lie, the dynamic of the lie, is connected to the LRRR experiment. The subtlety comes form the fact that the focus of the laser experiment was always on the ranging aspect of the experiment, the fact that successful targeting of the LRRR would be a way to study earth-moon distances and even things having to do with Einsteins particular slant on what gravity is all about. There never was any talk, not much anyway, pre launch, about how lasers were visible from the moon, at least with cameras they were. Nobody, no person, had ever been on the lunar surface before to confirm one might be able to see a laser with the naked eye. No one was talking about how the lasers could conceivable be employed in locating the astronauts on the moon, very precisely as it turns out, within the diameter of the laser beam, if they were hard to find. No one was talking prelaunch about how the astronauts might be able to see lasers as Surveyor VII did. It wasn't until the astronauts returned, and time went by, that people would point to the LRRR devices in this sort of context, the context of 3rd party, non NASA controlled, confirmation of the authenticity of Apollo.

But in real-time, on the night of the landing, the only people clued into this for the most part was a small group of scientists, technicians and a handful of journalists who realized that if the Lick Observatory laser successfully targeted the Apollo 11 LRRR, it would not only prove the astronauts were up there, but SHOW WHERE they were within an accuracy of 2 miles, the width of that Lick Observatory laser beam. Additionally, as we'll see, the astronauts, on the way out to the moon, were even being asked to visualize other lasers, not the Lick Observatory ruby red laser, but also the Texas/McDonald Observatory argon laser. The McDonald Observatory had a ruby red laser as well that was ultimately to target the LRRR. But on the night of 07/20/1969/morning 07/21/1969, and even before and after "the lunar landing" the McDonald argon laser is trying to find the eyes of the 3 astronauts, or their optical devices anyway.

Neil Armstrong, the non moon walker that he was, feared lasers because lasers were visible, at least in one sense they had proven to be "visible", photographable, amenable to documentation with a video camera, imageable from the lunar surface.

On page 166 of the NASA Missions Report book dedicated to the Surveyor program(published by Apogee) in the section, SPOTTING TWO LASER BEAMS FROM EARTH, we see the photograph of the planet earth as taken by Surveyor VII's TV CAMERA and included in that photograph are the images of 2 argon lasers, one originating from Kitt Peak in Arizona and the other from Table Mountain near Los Angeles. Professor C.O. Alley wrote of the Surveyor VII experiment;

"the blue-grean argon-ion laser beams seen within the white circle on the photograph each contained only about 1 watt of power, but appeared somewhat brighter than the brightest star Sirius. This engineering test of the aiming of the beams, a few miles wide at the Surveyor site, was conceived and coordinated by me and my fellow professor D.G. Currie, of the University of Maryland's Department of Physics and Astronomy, to gain experience for the Apollo laser-ranging retroreflector experiment for which I am principal investigator"

Surveyor VII had been launched on January 7th 1968 and successfully landed on the Tycho ejecta blanket on January 10th 1968. It found its way across cislunar space to moon coordinates 40.89 South latitude and 11.44 West longitude. Successful targeting of the Surveyor VII camera would of course be the means whereby these very precise coordinates would be confirmed.

So the fear on the part of the fraudulent Apollo 11 operatives is that someone will try and make them "take their picture", "take the laser's picture", or if the astronauts are lost, ask them too say if they can see the laser or not, or maybe even photograph or video it with one of their TV CAMERAS like Surveyor VII did. And so forth. Because the weak one watt argon-ion lasers are as bright as Sirius, the brightest star in the sky, then Armstrong et. al. have a major problem, because in one and a half years since the Surveyor VII experiment, laser technology greatly advanced. Lasers had become stronger, brighter and could be all the better aimed. If this was an "honest moon landing", assuming the astronauts were really lost, assuming Fight Dynamics Officer, H. David Reed, was really having trouble in a sense finding the Eagle to begin with at the time he began to assess his launch trajectory options, one could target Tranquility with say a strong argon beam. If they see it, see it with the eyes of a TV CAMERA, then you have the coordinates within the diameter of the beam anyway. That would be dang good. So this is the genesis of "coordinate confusion" that leads to "bird hiding". This is the motivation for, and the dynamic that drives, the humongous whopper of a lie that Armstrong MUST tell us about the stars. He has to take a huge risk with this lie because the credibility not only of his own Apollo 11 Mission, but of all subsequent missions is at risk once word got out that the best way to bust this thing, show fraud, is with a laser. That is why Bean loses his TV CAMERA.

Turning to the voice transcript, let's see where laser comes up. Search the term using an appropriate little engine and we find quite a bit. I'll comment briefly here now and save the best for later.

#1) Time 01 11 25 49

CC Roger. We got a little laser visual experiment we'd like to for you to do for us;. If you got the Earth through any of your windows or through the telescope, would you so advise? Over.


CMP Stand by one, Charlie.

CMP At this roll attitude, what should our high- gain angles be? Maybe that would help us locate you. We don't see you in the lens Stand by.

CC Hello, Apollo 11. Houston. Those high gain angles are pitch minus 70, yaw 90. We think the Earth is apparently pretty close to
plus z-axis. Over.

CMP Okay.


CMP Okay, Charlie. I got you in the telescope.

CC Roger, Apollo 11. We've got a laser that we're going to - It's a blue-green laser that we're going to flash on and off at a frequency of on for a second, off for a second. It's coming out of McDonald Observatory near E1 Pa,no, which is - should be right on the terminator --or right inside the terminator. We are going_ to activate that momentarily. Would you please take a look through the telescope and see if you can see it. Over.

CMP Telescope? Or sextant?

CC Either one. Over.

CMP Okay, I'll try it _with the telescope; and if I don't see it there, then I'll try the sextant.

CC Roger. We'll give you the word when they've_ got it turned on. Over.

CMP Okay.

CC 11, Houston. They don't have it turned on yet. We'll give_ you the word when they got it turned on. Over.

CMP Okay.

CC Hello, Apollo 11. Houston. We noticed the CR¥O pressure dropped a moment ago. Did you stir up the CRYO's? Over.

CDR Roger. We've finished our cycling operations.·_

CC Roger. Copy. Out. '

CC Hello, Apollo 11. Houston. McDonald's got_ the laser turned on, Would you take a look?, Over.

CMP Okay, Charlie.


CC It's bluish-green.

CC 11, Houston. We got some shaft and trunnion for you that might tweak it up a little bit. Shaft of 141.5, trunnion of 39.5. Over

CDR Okay. Stand by. ..

CC Apollo 11, Houston. If you see it it should be coming up - appear to be coming up, through the clouds. McDonald reports_ that there's a break inthe clouds that they're beaming this thing through. Over.

CDR Roger.

CC Hello, Apollo 11. Houston. You can terminate the exercise on the Laser. Our rates are steady
enough now for now to commence the PTC. Over.

LMP Okays Houston. Neither Neil nor Mike can see it. Incidentally_ those shafts and trunnions just missed pointing at the world.

CC Roger. Thank you.

LMP As we are looking at it through the scanning telescope, it would be about a - oh, maybe a third of an Earth radii high and to the left.

CC Roger.

LMP But, we did - but we did identify the E1 Paso area and it appeared to us to be a break in the clouds there, and we looked in that break and saw nothing.

So more than halfway to the moon, more than halfway across cislunar space, Houston tries to see if the astronauts can pick up the McDonald Observatory/El Paso blue-green argon laser, but it turns out that the astronauts cannot see it.

#2) Time 04 15 03 57

"ARMSTRONG The laser reflector has been installed and
the bubble is leveled and the alignment seems to be good."

#3) Time 04 16 34 29

"CC You might be interested in knowing, Mike, we have gotten reflections back from the laser reflector ray they deployed, and we may be able to get some information out of that a little later.

CMP/COLUMBIA Right. I need a very precise division,because I can only do a decent job of scanning maybe one of those grid squares at a time. We've been sweeping covers - 10's and 20's and 30's of them.

CAPCOM Roger. We understand this is intended
to be your last C-22. We don't want to use up too much fuel in this effort. Over."

Actually Collins doesn't need any division at all. If this was real, the successful targeting of the LRRR per the CC report to Collins would mean they knew the coordinates of Tranquility Base precisely, well within 2 miles anyway. Remember, when the Surveyor VII camera was successfully targeted, they knew the unmanned craft was sitting square on 40.89 south and 11.44 north. So this is a ruse to both pretend to not know where the Eagle is and to pretend to be doing exactly what they should be doing if this thing were real, determining the precise location of the Eagle, targeting the laser on the LRRR and so forth. The laser reference at #1 above now has a rationale. They want to deny they can see the McDonald argon laser.

If they could see it, someone would be responding back to the statement, "we don't know where the astronauts are".

Response, "Well tell the guys at McDonald to turn the argon laser(whatever laser) on to our best guess and hunt around. When the astronauts see the laser through their optics, then we know where they are within 2 miles. Why don't you tell them to point their TV CAMERA at the EARTH if they can. Tell Collins to do it too. Can they see our laser!? Should be able to, the Surveyor VII CAMERA saw it. These guys shouldn't be lost."

That's how it should go, might have gone if you really had lost your bird. How can they have a successfully targeted LRRR and be lost? AND if they are lost and haven't successfully targeted the LRRR, why isn't anybody using the laser to try and find them. If a TV CAMERA, eyes with optics, whatever, sees the light, then the lost Eagle is found! But nobody in the "fraud know" wants this because the whole thing is bogus and so THE APOLLO 11 STORY LINE, WITH RESPECT TO ITS TRANQUILITY BASE LANDING SITE DETAILS, IS INCOHERENT IN THE SENSE THAT IT IS BECAUSE THESE GUYS NEED TO EFFECTIVELY BE DODGING LASER LIGHT. So this explains to us why the story goes as it does, utterly incoherent, and why Armstrong denies the stars and indirectly the ability to see the lasers. Viewed this way, coherence is regained. But only through a prism of fraud does viewing the story line make any sense. And it only makes any sense at all if we see this as a game of laser tag. Tag avoidance is mission critical.

#3) Apollo 11 Mission Comentary, 7/21/69, CDT 12 noon, GET 123:28, 405/1

"PAO This is Apollo Control. Here in mission
control center Flight Director Glen Lunney is polling the various positions here in the control room on their readiness to go ahead with the ascent from this next pass as the command module comes around the moon, and we're some 53 minutes now away from ascent. Meanwhile back at the scientific experiment situation, another attempt is scheduled today to shoot another laser beam up to the laser retroreflector, which is the other part of the experiment package left on the moon. The seismic experiment will continue to record and send back measurements to mission control and will probably receive it's strongest signal when the ascent engine ignites and starts Eagle on it's way into lunar orbit and rendezvous with Columbia. There's considerable amount of conversation going on with the crew even though command module Columbia is behind the moon at this time. Rather than disconnect the air-ground line and be in a tape play-back mode, we'll leave a circuit up all the way through to loss of signal on the next rev when both spacecraft will go behind the moon. At 123 hours, 29 minutes, and standing by, this is Apollo Control.

CAPCOM Tranquility Base, Houston


TRANQUILITY Go ahead

CAPCOM Roger. Eagle's looking real fine to us down here. We have to a fairly high confidence that we know the position of the LM. However, it is possible that we may have a plans change, but in the worst case it would be up to 30 feet per second, all ."


This makes no sense. If they had targeted the LRRR they would know within 2 miles anyway of Tranquility Base's location. But H. David Reed said they were at least 4.5 miles off, and he was the FIDO. He didn't like the numbers he saw, so much so, he calculated his own numbers for a launch trajectory and solved for coordinates within 1200 feet of Tranquility Base.
If these guys were so confident of all this, why didn't they tell Reed? He's sitting right there, right there with the CapCom, and Reed is worried. Worried so much so, that in his describing the situation that morning in the book, FROm THE TRENCHES OF MISSION CONTROL TO THE CRATERS OF THE MOON, Reed put an exclamation point after his sentence that time was a wasting, and that the astronauts, as far as he could see, were not all that safe, wherever they were. And maybe not safe because indeed, their location was unknown. To emphasize the gravity of the situation, Reed describes the time waiting for his results, results obtained by way of using the rendezvous radar, as "AGONIZING MINUTES". Sounds scary to me. If it were real, the astronauts were in trouble here, being "lost" as they were. Here's Reed(I capitalized the relevant sentences for my own emphasis);

"After all, we knew where the CSM was and the problem was a relative one between the CSM and the LM, not actually requiring latitude and longitude. To do this we would need to have the rendezvous radar (RR) turned on in the LM one revolution earlier than planned. ONLY TWO MORE PASSES OF THE CSM REMAINED BEFORE ASCENT IGNITION, BEFORE WE HAD TO HAVE A SOLUTION TO THIS PROBLEM! I remember taking my headset off and walking up to the Flight Director, Milt Windler to explain the situation. We only used that kind of face to face communication when we had a serious problem such as this. I detailed the problem as best we knew it and the process that we’d have to follow to get the data we needed, and why we had to start a rev early to finish the calculations and then find the critical lift-off time for lunar launch. I recall the CapCom instructing Buzz Aldrin that we needed him to perform the RR check early but I don’t believe that CapCom explained why, just another check was all. Shaft & trunnion angles were passed up to aid acquisition. Right on time as the CSM cleared the horizon we began seeing data. WE COUNTED THE AGONIZING MINUTES AS THE TELEMETRY CAME FLOWING IN UNTIL THE CSM WAS RECEDING."

Maurice Kennedy; Charles Deiterich III; William Stoval; William Boone III; Glynn S. Lunney; H. David Reed; Jerry C. Bostick (2011-05-13). From The Trench of Mission Control to the Craters of The Moon (ebook Locations 5652-5667).

So Reed's story and the voice transcript story are different. Reed must be working with bogus data, all of it is bogus. Has to be. How could one possibly explain this nonsense otherwise. The telemetry itself, just based on what I have presented here, is proven to be fraudulent, and with it, all of the Apollo 11 Mission is shown to be a fraud.

#4) Time 05 05 56 26
CMP Roger, Houston, Columbia. CSI nominal; no plane change everything's going beautifully and the LM seems to be,,,your laser...

#5) Time 05 05 58 36
"EAGLE Roger. We saw you come up over the horizon and it looks like you had a laser operating. Could you confirm that?

CAPCOM _Eagle, Houston. Stand by. We'll check it."

Later on in the transcript, the astronauts confirm seeing what appeared to be a laser here operating from earth.

#6) Apollo 11 Mission Commentary, 7/21/1969, GET 128:56, CDT 17:28 425/1
"This is Apollo Control. Some 6 minutes 40 seconds remaining until Apollo 11 goes behind the moon on the 27th revolution. The signal from the passive seismometer, which was left on the moon by the crewof Eagle, was lost for 30 minutes beginning about 5 minutes before Eagle took off this morning. The signal was lost because of a equipment problem that the Canary Island tracking station. The Seismic equipment is back on line now, and is beginning to record lunar day surface temperatures. The dust detector recorded zero dust after Eagle lift off. The laser ground station have not yet acquired a return signal from the Laser Ranging Retro Reflector. Five minutes away from loss of signal with Apollo 11. We will continue to monitor the air-to-ground as the spacecraft goes over the hill. The crew now is engaged in the decontamination procedures inside the lunar module prior to transferring back into the command module."

I thought they claimed they had successfully targeted the LRRR.

#7) Time 06 07 36 58

"CAPCOM Roger. And the next question from our panel is for Buzz, We recall that he reported seeing a laser upon AOS of the Earth the first time after - the first REV after ascent, and we're wondering what color the beam was and if he could determine at the approximate location with respect to the Earth. Over.

LMP It was mostly white - perhaps a tinge of yellowish color to it, and it seemed to be, as I recall it, the terminator of the Earth was toward the horizon and seemed to be about a quarter to a third of the way down from - down towards the terminator of the Earth from the opposite horizon. That's a third to a quarter of the Earth's radii. Over.

CAPCOM Roger, and that puts it in the light side. Over.

LMP Roger. Yes, it was in the light side. The Earth was about two thirds lit - Earth, with the terminator down toward the horizon. And now,coming from 'the opposite limb of the Earth, the sunlight limb, coming down about one quarter to one third of a radius in from the limb. Generally, pensively located with respect to a line drawn perpendicular to the terminator that goes through the center. Over.

CAPCOM Roger, Buzz; we copy.

LMP And I got pictures of that. I'm sure that will show up.

CDR And I saw that too. It was a very bright of light and I confirm Buzz's observation of its position."


So both astronauts claim to have seen this "laser", and furthermore, Aldrin claims to have taken pictures of this laser or some "very bight light" coming from earth as confirmed by Armstrong.

Anyone ever seen these pictures of a laser taken from outer space by Apollo 11 astronauts?!

#8) Time 07 12 22 21

CC Roger. For your information, the laser from McDonald Observatory in West Texas will be up from about 181 hours and 30 minutes, on for 1 hour. You should be able to spot the earth out of the number 1 window every time you pass roll 357 degrees and I add, of course, you're in West Texas. Over.

#9) Time 07 14 08 09

CDR outstanding. We have been looking for their laser - but haven't had much luck yet.


CAPCOM Roger. We'll pass it on to them, Nell. Thank you.

 

[drewid]

dodge noted

 

[Kiwi9]

Check out the Apollo 12 shots. I have not looked at many, but I imagine they avoid taking pictures of the Earth as well from the lunar surface, just like 11 avoided taking moonscape/earth pictures.

Well, they did go to study the moon, so wouldn't it be logical that there might be more photos of the moon?

I don't know exactly what you mean by "moonscape/earth" pictures, but I disagree that they avoided photos that included earth. Where did you get your information about that?

Below is a list of Apollo 11 70mm Hasselblad photos that included the earth, the moon or both, plus sometimes the lunar module or command/service module. The list comes from the LPI thumbnails,
http://www.lpi.usra.edu/resources/apollo/
and you can find many of the photos in higher resolution and quality at the ALSJ and other websites.

The number of each category of photos is shown in brackets on each line.


Apollo 11 earth and moon photos

AS11-36-5293 to 5309 Earth (17)
AS11-36-5317 to 5326 Earth (10)
AS11-36-5330 to 5362 Earth (33)
AS11-36-5366 to 5381 Earth (16)
AS11-36-5400 to 5402 Earth (3)
AS11-37-5434 & 5435 Earth & LM (2)
AS11-37-5436 to 5438 LM & Moon (3)
AS11-37-5439 to 5442 LM, Earth & Moon (4)
AS11-37-5443 to 5448 CSM & Moon (6)
AS11-37-5449 to 5505 Moon outside landed LM (57)
AS11-37-5510 to 5527 Moon outside landed LM (18)
AS11-37-5535 to 5555 Moon outside landed LM (21)
AS11-38-5556 to 5683 Moon (28)
AS11-38-5684 to 5687 Earth (4)
AS11-38-5688 Moon (1)
AS11-38-5689 Earth (1)
AS11-38-5690 & 5691 Moon (2)
AS11-38-5692 & 5693 Earth (2)
AS11-38-5694 to 5696 Moon (3)
AS11-38-5697 & 5698 Earth (2)
AS11-38-5699 Moon (1)
AS11-38-5700 & 5701 Earth (2)
AS11-38-5702 Moon (1)
AS11-38-5703 Earth (1)
AS11-38-5705 Moon (1)
AS11-38-5706 to 5708 Earth (3)
AS11-38-5709 to 5711 Moon (3)
AS11-38-5712 Earth (1)
AS11-38-5713 to 5716 Moon (4)
AS11-38-5719 to 5736 Earth (18)
AS11-39-5737 to 5843 Moon outside landed LM (107)
AS11-40-5844 Moon (1)
AS11-40-5845 Earth (1)
AS11-40-5846 Moon (1)
AS11-40-5847 to 5922 Lunar surface photos (76)
AS11-40-5923 & 5924 LM & Earth from lunar surface (2)
AS11-40-5926 to 5970 Lunar surface photos (45)
AS11-41-5971 to 6013 Moon (43)
AS11-41-6014 to 6050 Moon & Earth (37)
AS11-41-6051 to 6103 Moon (53)
AS11-41-6109 to 6133 Moon (25)
AS11-41-6136 to 6159 Moon (24)
AS11-42-6204 to 6326 Moon (123)
AS11-42-6329 to 6348 Moon (20)
AS11-43-6349 to 6539 Moon (191)
AS11-44-6540 to 6543 LM & Moon (4)
AS11-44-6544 to 6546 Moon (3)
AS11-44-6547 to 6564 Earth & Moon (18)
AS11-44-6601 to 6605 Earth & Moon (5)
AS11-44-6606 to 6620 Moon (15)
AS11-44-6621 to 6631 LM & Moon (11)
AS11-44-6632 to 6643 LM, Earth & Moon (12)
AS11-44-6644 Moon (1)
AS11-44-6645 & 6646 Earth & Moon (2)
AS11-44-6647 Moon (1)
AS11-44-6648 to 6653 Earth & Moon (6)
AS11-44-6654 to 6667 Moon (14)
AS11-44-6668 to 6696 Earth (29)

 

[Kiwi9]

#3) Time 04 16 34 29

"CC You might be interested in knowing, Mike, we have gotten reflections back from the laser reflector ray they deployed, and we may be able to get some information out of that a little later.

CMP/COLUMBIA Right. I need a very precise division,because I can only do a decent job of scanning maybe one of those grid squares at a time. We've been sweeping covers - 10's and 20's and 30's of them.

CAPCOM Roger. We understand this is intended
to be your last C-22. We don't want to use up too much fuel in this effort. Over."

Actually Collins doesn't need any division at all. If this was real, the successful targeting of the LRRR per the CC report to Collins would mean they knew the coordinates of Tranquility Base precisely, well within 2 miles anyway.

You have repeatedly been told in this thread, Patrick1000, that the statement by the Capcom was a mistake due to one of the American TV networks erroneously broadcasting the message that Lick had got a return from the LRRR. In fact, you have confirmation from Lick that they had not got a return, yet you still promote this error as if it was indeed a fact.

You are being dishonest by repeating the story. Explain yourself.