Reasonable doubt...All truthers(and whoever esle) please read

[George 152]

Why are you so utterly obsessed with video?

Because any books on the related subjects have real big words and no pictures...

 

[dafydd]

Why are you so utterly obsessed with video?

That's the younger generation for you. If it's not on youtube,it doesn't exist. And books are like full of stuff! Let's paaaaaaarty!!

 

[WildCat]

I'm curious why you insist on a video. Does a video carry more weight for you? Are you incapable of absorbing information unless it's in video format?

must be on teh youtube

 

[deeper]

Oh we understand fully. You have none and are embarrassed about it.

You are possibly jumping the gun here, what if his qualifications are so many and of such a high level that he must be one of only three people in the world.


On a serious note tmd_2, I once believed that 9-11 was an inside job (plus loads of other crazy conspiracy BS), though it never became part of my identity and I had little emotional investment in it, mostly because I knew ultimately that it was just something someone else had told me. I had not even heard of debunking (I'd only seen pro-conspiracy propaganda and not the counter-postion) and was only vaguely aware of skepticism.

The way I managed to dig myself out of that hole was by utilising one skill, knowing a good point when I see it. It was about the only tool I had, I'm an arts graduate and I'm certainly no maths whiz.

I know your angry at your government for unnecessary wars and the deaths of innocents, anything they can do to prop up the status quo and dodge the need for using true leadership and imagination. And you know what, I am too. But I also think my lack of scientific background and disillusionment with politics made me ripe-for-the-picking with regard to believing conspiracy theories.

However, bad governments doesn't mean 9-11 was as inside job. If you read without prejudice (I think maybe you've got too much emotional investment in this. You need to step back... less posting, more reading) as many 9-11 Debunking sites and JREF threads as you can, you will see every 9-11 inside-job argument destroyed (maybe there are good arguements but I've yet to see one). And like me you might look at yourself as having been a little foolish and endeavour to do better in the future. Good luck.

And I'll take this opportunity to thank my fellow JREFers, there's so many good points made on this site, I'm like a kid in a candy shop.

 

[dafydd]

And I'll take this opportunity to thank my fellow JREFers, there's so many good points made on this site, I'm like a kid in a candy shop.

A person can learn a lot here if their mind is open.

 

[tmd2_1]

You don't get it do you? People who perform scientific experiments do not video themselves doing the experiments and then put the video on youtube. You don't even seem to understand why? You seem to have some sort of fixation with video. I know of no-one that would make a video instead of producing a paper or publishing results.

Just because you don't have the attention span, the patience or the knowledge to digest even the simplest of publications doesn't mean that everyone else should dumb themselves down to your level.

Secondly it is up to the claimant to provide evidence. You are making the claims for thermite, it is up to you to present your evidence. So far you have none, nada,. zilch. zip, sweet felicity arkwright.

You are also showing your immaturity. I suspect that you don't have any qualifications because you are still at school. You haven't got them yet.

Do whatever you think you need to...just do it by experiment. As for thermite..Cole showed it could be done. I've shown what was coming out of the tower looks a lile like steel could not have been aluminum. Showed many witnesses of molten steel..some very qualified...what else do you need. I mean look at what cole did compare to what's coming out of the south tower...looks exactly the same. All you do is sit there and talk about how what they did is stupid..etc etc yet you have produced nothing. You are doing nothing more then trying to paint a picture of what is on youtube should how be ignored. That only if it's in some magic scientic journal..only then is it correct. These people are doing something what have you done?...Greening and Mackey both said there should be more Tests (no tests)...NIST says they based there fires not on observed observation (WTC 7) and that's science?

 

[Jrrarglblarg]

Listen I like you, you seem like a reasonably guy,

Thanks, I try hard to seem like a reasonable guy.

and if that picture is, I have a tremendous amount of respect soldiers.

Yes, this avatar is the "real me," in "one-weekend-a-month" mode.

It's been pretty much agreed upon that, that is molten metal

a) agreed by whom?
b) what kind of metal? How was this determined?
c) If molten metal, could it not carry debris from elsewhere in the flaming skyscraper along with it? If not, why not? Could you determine, using strictly visual information available as low-res clips on youtube exactly what this material could be?

...that guy is showing what aluminum looks like at the temperatures the fires got to. Nothing like what we see there.

Maybe I missed the part of his video where he shows someone pouring molten aluminum across a piece of office carpet. Please tell me the time code to look at for this test.

AS far as the column..I'm not sure maybe I copied the wrong link..I didn't mean to send you anything about a column. Just to show what aluminum looks like.

The video opens with fnord music and scary zoom in on the infamous "Cut Column." This informs the viewer of what the filmmaker wants to say and why. Among the things I studied in college was film making, with an eye toward documentary and propaganda and understanding the difference between them. The opening shot turns your link into propaganda, not documentary.

Take a look around...really do...look at what most of the people here say, it's like dealing with little children. Just yesterday someone said when someone says go look at a youtube video..it is like saying pull my finger..and lot's of people thought that was funny. Whether you think I'm wrong or right...do you really want to associate with people who act like that when it comes to a subject like this?

Admittedly, most of the posters at jref are snarky and dismissive, and some are outright jerks. Even some of the mods. But consider - these guys with 5-digit post counts have been debunking for "more than a minute" and have seen every single claim repeatedly.

 

[tmd2_1]

You are possibly jumping the gun here, what if his qualifications are so many and of such a high level that he must be one of only three people in the world.


On a serious note tmd_2, I once believed that 9-11 was an inside job (plus loads of other crazy conspiracy BS), though it never became part of my identity and I had little emotional investment in it, mostly because I knew ultimately that it was just something someone else had told me. I had not even heard of debunking (I'd only seen pro-conspiracy propaganda and not the counter-postion) and was only vaguely aware of skepticism.

The way I managed to dig myself out of that hole was by utilising one skill, knowing a good point when I see it. It was about the only tool I had, I'm an arts graduate and I'm certainly no maths whiz.

I know your angry at your government for unnecessary wars and the deaths of innocents, anything they can do to prop up the status quo and dodge the need for using true leadership and imagination. And you know what, I am too. But I also think my lack of scientific background and disillusionment with politics made me ripe-for-the-picking with regard to believing conspiracy theories.

However, bad governments doesn't mean 9-11 was as inside job. If you read without prejudice (I think maybe you've got too much emotional investment in this. You need to step back... less posting, more reading) as many 9-11 Debunking sites and JREF threads as you can, you will see every 9-11 inside-job argument destroyed (maybe there are good arguements but I've yet to see one). And like me you might look at yourself as having been a little foolish and endeavour to do better in the future. Good luck.

And I'll take this opportunity to thank my fellow JREFers, there's so many good points made on this site, I'm like a kid in a candy shop.

I don't think it was the 'government' per say..a relativily small cabal inside of it...trying to get cart blanh hatred for muslims, as well as bring in a police state.

 

[WildCat]

Refer to Cole about the thermite. Landfill fires that lasted for months, despite millions of gallons of water and several rainfalls being dumped on...yeah that's normal.

Man, it's so easy to refute your arguments from ignorance:

Whoever set fire to the huge Heyope tyre dump near Knighton, Powys, in 1989 could have had little idea that the action would enter the record books. Almost 13 years later, Britain's longest burning tyre fire smoulders gently on.
The tyres - all 10m of them - lie in a deep wooded valley in the Welsh borders. They are packed too densely for firefighters to extinguish and there are no flames, but temperature readings confirm the intense heat generated below the surface. Wisps of acrid black smoke occasionally drift up from the mass of rubber.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2002/may/15/environment.waste

 

[deeper]

I don't think it was the 'government' per say..a relativily small cabal inside of it...trying to get cart blanh hatred for muslims, as well as bring in a police state.

Yeah I know, that's what I thought too.

 

[WildCat]

I told you see Cole...un-reacted thermite..continuing to react.

Stundie material!

Yes given the situation in the South tower aluminum and steel are really the only options. It's funny with you guys (I don't mean you in particular per say) but you jump up and down it's aluminum it's aluminum, presented with evidence that contradicts it...now it could be any one of many metals.

You admit that every metal in the WTC with a melting point lower than steel would necessarily be molten long before the steel was, yes? And that steel could not exist in molten form without all those other metals also existing in molten form?

 

[tmd2_1]

Yeah I know, that's what I thought.

If you really are reasonable...look through this whole thread starting with my initial post...see how many points were "totally destroyed"

 

[NoahFence]

tmd.

We've told you what the flow exiting the building very likely is.

Why do you ignore the answer, then post 2 seconds later that nobody has provided an alternative to steel?

 

[dafydd]

Do whatever you think you need to...just do it by experiment. As for thermite..Cole showed it could be done. I've shown what was coming out of the tower looks a lile like steel could not have been aluminum. Showed many witnesses of molten steel..some very qualified...what else do you need. I mean look at what cole did compare to what's coming out of the south tower...looks exactly the same. All you do is sit there and talk about how what they did is stupid..etc etc yet you have produced nothing. You are doing nothing more then trying to paint a picture of what is on youtube should how be ignored. That only if it's in some magic scientic journal..only then is it correct. These people are doing something what have you done?...Greening and Mackey both said there should be more Tests (no tests)...NIST says they based there fires not on observed observation (WTC 7) and that's science?

Why are you still here? I thought that you had claimed victory? The highlighted words are worthy of a stundie. How old are you? I would say fourteen.

 

[WildCat]

The challenge is not a fair one and you know that. Different temperatures different colors.

And yet you still claim others can identify molten metals by sight alone?

 

[dafydd]

If you really are reasonable...look through this whole thread starting with my initial post...see how many points were "totally destroyed"

All of them.

 

[WildCat]

If you actually looked at his videos you would see how little he used to have a melting affect. You clearly did not watch his videos.

But a minute ago you claimed there was so much thermite that it continued to react for months after 9/11.

This is a big problem with you truthers, none of you can formulate a theory that doesn't contradict itself.

So which is it, was there a little or a lot?

 

[NoahFence]

But a minute ago you claimed there was so much thermite that it continued to react for months after 9/11.

This is a big problem with you truthers, none of you can formulate a theory that doesn't contradict itself.

So which is it, was there a little or a lot?

A little caused the towers to collapse.

After they collapsed, workers went underneath the rubble, through the subway system with pallets of thermite and planted them in the rubble, and remotely detonating them one after another for 99 days, just to piss off the firefighters who didn't die that day.


/twoffermode off

 

[WildCat]

I never said any such thing about rivers of steel for weeks...yes shaped charges. I was saying fires lasted for weeks...un reacted thermite could be causing the fires..

Now we're back to lots of thermite... and shaped charges! How the hell do you make a shaped charge for thermite, which isn't an explosive?

 

[dafydd]

So which is it, was there a little or a lot?

Both,according to him.