Merged Continuation - 9/11 CT subforum General Discussion Thread

[dafydd]

Yes. Quantity isnt enough Bill. Quality and credible is the key. Seems Heiwa is the fraud we all new him to be too.

Heiwa,what a jellybrain he was. I wonder what happened to him?

 

[BStrong]

WTC 7 WTC 1&2 all demolished.....all part of a master plan....come on....haters how do you explain WTC 7 falling down....no real fire...not hit by a plane...and crashes down in 6.5 seconds...something is very strange!!

Might want to read up on the subject matter before you go any farther.

 

[DeathDart]

Let me get this straight -- you accept the chemistry and thermodynamics of sulfur cooking off the drywall in a reducing-atmosphere slow fire . . . but still manage to twist it into thermite?

No the swiss cheese metal was caused by the drywall.

The people handling that material (under apparent secrecy) came up with the idea of thermite. Thermite best explained the damage to them.

So we have a bunch of people who swear it was thermite, because of the Swiss cheese metal. They are wrong but very persistent.

The FBI may have believed the worst about their boss, and thought it was some secret weapon.

Because nobody is talking to nobody, it doesn't get disproved.

 

[DeathDart]

Might want to read up on the subject matter before you go any farther.

No physical evidence remains WTC 7, get the people involved in front of a Grand Jury an ask them some questions. The insurance company bought the building so they aren't going to be too helpful, it was just business.

 

[Jrrarglblarg]

WTC 7 WTC 1&2 all demolished.....all part of a master plan....come on....haters how do you explain WTC 7 falling down....no real fire...not hit by a plane...and crashes down in 6.5 seconds...something is very strange!!

Name calling will earn you no friends. This ain't that kinda forum. Tone it down and bring a fact or two with you for the conversation and maybe people will engage with you in a constructive manner.

As for "no real fire" and "not hit by a plane" perhaps your conversation requires a new thread. At the Icke forum.

Making bold but unsupported assertions may feel good but it's not intellectual discourse.

 

[Jrrarglblarg]

No the swiss cheese metal was caused by the drywall.

The people handling that material (under apparent secrecy) came up with the idea of thermite. Thermite best explained the damage to them.

So we have a bunch of people who swear it was thermite, because of the Swiss cheese metal. They are wrong but very persistent.

The FBI may have believed the worst about their boss, and thought it was some secret weapon.

Because nobody is talking to nobody, it doesn't get disproved.

I'm very confused now. Are you asserting that drywall caused corrosion to the structural steel before the collapse? Or after the collapse, during the subsequent fire?

 

[BStrong]

No physical evidence remains WTC 7, get the people involved in front of a Grand Jury an ask them some questions. The insurance company bought the building so they aren't going to be too helpful, it was just business.

"No real fires" in WTC 7?

Our new poster isn't too well informed.

 

[Craig4]

I must apologize, I had to develop a lot of bad habits, to survive.

You tend to polarize the opposite of the people who are trying to destroy you.

So I am an anti-fascist.

And George W. Bush is a coward. What you saw at the school was him freezing up. Bush went into hiding so that they could stabilize his psyche with psychological support groups to make sure he wouldn't crack.

He knew.

I'm not sure how to tell you this nicely. You're not important enough for anyone to plotting your death over 9/11. The former Bush administration doesn't even know you exist and if they did they wouldn't care. All your talk of bringing them to justice really just shows you don't have an accurate view of your own ability. Even if they were guilty of crimes related to 9/11, you're just no good enough to be the one to bring them in. Sorry but you probably need to come to terms with this.

 

[Craig4]

The potential (evidence) was destroyed. If there was anything to find there, it is gone.

You don't waste resources on irrelevant battles. Take the war to where they are the weakest. Get them in front of Grand Juries so they have to swear to a narrative. Take that narrative and pick it apart.

Two can keep a secret, if one is dead.

A lie can work with one person, the more people that have to swear to the same lie, the more inconsistencies will surface.

Your enemy doesn't care about it and probably doesn't know you exist. I'm sure they know there is a crank lobby out there but they don't care about it.

 

[Craig4]

WTC 7 WTC 1&2 all demolished.....all part of a master plan....come on....haters how do you explain WTC 7 falling down....no real fire...not hit by a plane...and crashes down in 6.5 seconds...something is very strange!!

That's nice. Do you have some explosive residue to show us? How about someone who can place people planting explosives in the building prior to the attack? May we see a copy or even some excerpts from this master plan thing you talk about? Who planted the explosives? Who was in on your master plan?

 

[DeathDart]

I'm very confused now. Are you asserting that drywall caused corrosion to the structural steel before the collapse? Or after the collapse, during the subsequent fire?

After the collapse, but this was a rare situation. Most fires with gypsum involved, do not create a lot of sulfuric acid because the fires are usually very short. This was different, it my have only took a few days for some of the steel to look pretty bad.

Now the people removing the steel are under some sort of secrecy or legal muzzling. They see the Swiss cheese steel and they also see that the people controlling the site don't like seeing it either.

So the people collecting the steel get the impression that what ever caused the steel to look this way, is a secret.

With no actual information being given to them, they begin to think that someone is hiding something.

The people controlling the site (the FBI) aren't real sure if they are hiding something.

This is like the Lucille Balls I Love Lucy at the Nuclear Reactor Site episode.

Someone comes up with the idea it was some form of experimental thermite.
The idea is wrong but it kind of explains what they are seeing.

Neither the FBI or the people removing the steel is 100% sure what is going on, and they are not sure if they want to know.

 

[Craig4]

After the collapse, but this was a rare situation. Most fires with gypsum involved, do not create a lot of sulfuric acid because the fires are usually very short. This was different, it my have only took a few days for some of the steel to look pretty bad.

Now the people removing the steel are under some sort of secrecy or legal muzzling. They see the Swiss cheese steel and they also see that the people controlling the site don't like seeing it either.

So the people collecting the steel get the impression that what ever caused the steel to look this way, is a secret.

With no actual information being given to them, they begin to think that someone is hiding something.

The people controlling the site (the FBI) aren't real sure if they are hiding something.

This is like the Lucille Balls I Love Lucy at the Nuclear Reactor Site episode.

Someone comes up with the idea it was some form of experimental thermite.
The idea is wrong but it kind of explains what they are seeing.

Neither the FBI or the people removing the steel is 100% sure what is going on, and they are not sure if they want to know.

How do you know all this? Show your work.

 

[DeathDart]

Your enemy doesn't care about it and probably doesn't know you exist. I'm sure they know there is a crank lobby out there but they don't care about it.

I hope you are right, at least until it gets cooler, this body armor is guaranteed to give me a heat stroke.

 

[Craig4]

I hope you are right, at least until it gets cooler, this body armor is guaranteed to give me a heat stroke.

You'd have to be taken seriously to be a threat. I assure you that is not happening now nor will it in the future barring some change in both attitude and capability.

 

[Jrrarglblarg]

Now the people removing the steel are under some sort of secrecy or legal muzzling. They see the Swiss cheese steel and they also see that the people controlling the site don't like seeing it either.

Then how do we know about it?

Gypsum degrading to release sulfur in long duration reduction atmosphere fires has been known about for years. The conditions under which it happens are rare, but it's not some kinda state secret or something.

I'm sure you can provide references for me to read backing your assertion that "people controlling the site" clamped down on the information . . . so could you please? For me? Pretty please?

 

[DeathDart]

How do you know all this? Show your work.

Its a guess and you are free to pick it apart.

The basic premise is that Brush never shares information unless he has to.

The steel is starting to look bad in days, the more heat and gases, the more acid, the more hydrogen, the more heat. When the original fire material is used up And the temperature under the pile goes down then the reaction stops. Each chemical reaction uses up some of the original energy from the fuel fire as heat. Gypsum is converting energy to Sulfuric Acid. The Sulfuric Acid creates hydrogen when it contacts the steel. After the collapse I would guess that the hydrogen would increase temperatures locally. The heating creates more acid, the acid eats metal and the temperature in small areas goes to the maximum temperature of a hydrogen flame burning in air.

Because Brush hates to give out information the FBI is operating in the dark, they really don't know what to think about the steel so they cover their ass. Rule No 1.

I don't know if they discuss it or send the information upwards. They do know with 100% certainty that a wrong or embarrassing question can end their careers. This is J. Edgar Hoover's FBI, just the way he wanted it, as a tool for political control. Can you tell that I hate the FBI?

So the FBI themselves, are not sure if they are hiding something.

An information vacuum is created, the thermite does explain some of it and it fills the information vacuum. It is NOT correct but it does correlate with what they have seen, and why it is being kept a secret.

It is a feedback loop of noise.

 

[DeathDart]

Then how do we know about it?

Gypsum degrading to release sulfur in long duration reduction atmosphere fires has been known about for years. The conditions under which it happens are rare, but it's not some kinda state secret or something.

I'm sure you can provide references for me to read backing your assertion that "people controlling the site" clamped down on the information . . . so could you please? For me? Pretty please?

Most FBI agents do not have a technical background. This phenomena is rare. If you are an agent without a technical background what would you think when you saw the Swiss Cheese metal?

As far as giving, the people doing the removal an impression of clamping down, it could have been as simple as a nondisclosure agreement. Even simple nondisclosure agreements attempt to unconstitutionally prevent the agreement contents from being disclosed. If anything more intimidating happened at the site, you would have to ask the people who did the removal.

FBI agents also like the sunglasses and silence look. (Most of the FBI are cross-eyed)

 

[DeathDart]

You'd have to be taken seriously to be a threat. I assure you that is not happening now nor will it in the future barring some change in both attitude and capability.

GGRRRrrrr

 

[Jrrarglblarg]

Most FBI agents do not have a technical background. This phenomena is rare. If you are an agent without a technical background what would you think when you saw the Swiss Cheese metal?/QUOTE]

In the days after 9/11 before I took the rabbit ears off my tv to prevent exposing my small children to inappropriate visual stimuli I watched quite a bit of the news coverage of the ground zero cleanup. I don't remember there being much FBI presence. Could you point me to your sources indicating a high level of FBI presence in a heavy construction/demolition cleanup environment?

As far as giving, the people doing the removal an impression of clamping down, it could have been as simple as a nondisclosure agreement. Even simple nondisclosure agreements attempt to unconstitutionally prevent the agreement contents from being disclosed. If anything more intimidating happened at the site, you would have to ask the people who did the removal.

Prove that these cleanup workers were required to sign NDA's. Please.

FBI agents also like the sunglasses and silence look. (Most of the FBI are cross-eyed)

Oh, now I get it. I've been responding to you thinking you were serious all this time. Ha ha, joke's on me!

 

[Porkpie Hat]

Because of the underground fires and the presence of heated gypsum and carbon monoxide substantial quantities of sulfuric acid (potentially several tons) could have formed, etching or dissolving steel nearby.

The sulfuric acid also produces hydrogen which burns with a flame temperature in air of approx 2400C. This can cause steel to melt. But all of this happens AFTER the collapse.

A computer model that was very detailed (lots of samples) that ran well with un-etched steel and that would fail with etched steel would mean that the steel was intact before the collapse. All the visibly damaged (eaten up steel) steel recovered would not mean anything. Especially if the physical survey placed it near an underground fire.

But a computer model this sensitive is only possible, if enough steel is recovered from the impact and fire floors.

The people doing the steel removal probably started freaking out when they saw the acid etched steel and molten steel. They didn't let the researchers have it because they "Taught it was avidence" Say it with a New York Mob voice.

Irony.... I hate irony.

You realise that you,

1) make no sense,

and

2) base everything you say on blind assumptions?

Unless you can show that steel exhibiting the same characteristics as the "sulfidated"? samples was in fact removed and never to be seen again that your entire diatribe is nothing more than a series of disjointed words that lack any impact on real life.