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Atlanta Klansman not as clever as he thought

For reference: the DOJ (as of Gonzales, I haven't found any stats quoted from Holder) cited 60,000 rapes per year in prison. Activist organizations such as Human Rights Watch generally placed the number at twice that.
 
Rasmus said:
So what difference does that make?
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People keep saying we think he deserves to be raped. We're just saying we would find it funny.



Rasmus said:
You also seem to be unable to distinguish between "defending him for what he did" and "refusing to literally outlaw him for what he did".
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Huh? The guy raped children, he should go to prison, as sentenced. I'm just saying it would be funny if a child rapist found out what it was like to be at the receiving end of the crime.
 
Silly Green Monkey said:
I agree with you here, but I'm just not sure how to change prison environments without changing the attitudes of prisoners themselves. The attitude of 'rape is okay in prison' is widespread in the public, which means it's in the prison population too. I'm no more happy with inmates raping each other than I am with inmates beating or shanking each other, but I'm not sure the different violent acts can be separated and corrected individually.
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They can't, and you are absolutely on to the source of the issue. The idea that violence (including rape) is a fact of life in prison is not only widely accepted by the public, it's encouraged by those who think that prison should be hell for the subhuman Criminals. I'm no more certain of how to put an end to it all than you are, but I'm glad you agree with me.
 
I'm with Lamuella. The US Constitution protects all Americans, even criminals, against cruel and unusual punishment. The man under discussion has been sentenced to confinement to a prison cell for up to 20 years for his crime -- that is the extent of his punishment, delivered by the lawful justice system which the Constitution establishes. He has not been sentenced to receiving the same crime which landed him there -- namely, rape -- a crime we can all agree is loathsome, and which violates human rights.

Lamuella's first post on the matter, quoted below, says all that needs to be said IMO:

Lamuella said:
Yes, i think he deserves better than to be raped in prison. I'm not sure how this is a controversial stance.

It's not a matter of what he's done. What he has done is enough to get him removed from society, put in a small box and forgotten about for many years.

The question is what gives us the right to, essentially, sentence someone to be sexually assaulted.

Prison rape is a disgusting thing. It's a horrifying display of savagery and brutality, and taking enjoyment in its occurrence is condoning it as an acceptable aspect of the justice system. I find that sick.

We all agree that what he did was wrong and should get him taken away from society. The largest part of what he did wrong was to commit (or plan to commit) sexual assault. If we all agree that the sexual assault he perpetrated was wrong, how can we cheer on the idea of him being sexually assaulted?

Prison rape is a horribly common, deeply disgusting thing. It sickens me to see people taking enjoyment out of it.
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OrangeCatz said:
People keep saying we think he deserves to be raped. We're just saying we would find it funny.

Huh? The guy raped children, he should go to prison, as sentenced. I'm just saying it would be funny if a child rapist found out what it was like to be at the receiving end of the crime.
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in that case what I disagree with is your sense of humour rather than necessarily your sense of right and wrong. I find nothing to laugh at in any rape. That's personal preference, though.
 
A Laughing Baby said:
Michael, I think you are absolutely intelligent and empathetic enough to understand this connection, based on this post.

What this man did was reprehensible. However, by accepting the idea that he will be raped and seeing this as not a bad thing, you are by extension accepting the concept of prison rape, which is not exclusively applied to child rapists. Through acceptance of the act of prison rape in these specific conditions, you are accepting the act of prison rape in all conditions.
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I see your point, but I respectfully disagree. I don't agree with prison rape in all conditions, but against those who have also committed that crime—especially against children—I have no problem. And again, I appreciate your putting your point in a clear, concise and respectful manner. It helps me to see and consider other points of view that I may have closed off before. That's how I got to change my mind about the legalization of drugs (which I am for, although I've never tried them or want to, either.)

Michael
 
Respectfully, rape is by its very definition an act of violence and a crime. Some, like child rapists, should be subjected to it? Yes, prision rape happens, but rape is never acceptable, at least not the way I can see it. I can understand and even appreciate the irony that the old creep might be exposed to this, but I can't find it acceptable and certainly not funny -- irony and humor being different.
 
coalesce said:
He chose his path, not me, and in the absence of being sent away to a secure facility, he will now have to face the consequences of his actions and I, for one, will not feel sorry for him in the least.
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Not that you were trying to say this, but this same logic would apply to a cop that gets sent to prison. They will have a very rough time of it, but hey, they knew that when they committed whatever crime got them there. So, they have the same knowledge and yet I doubt you would feel as humored by their treatment.

And I also appreciate that in a topic as volatile as this, so far, no one has engaged in name-calling or anything else that may detract from their point of view, whether you agree with them or not.
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What do you call someone who thinks prison rape is ironically funny to denigrate them? Really, I don't think name calling will be a concern here.

And if it isn't clear, add me to the list of people who think that rape is not acceptable. No qualifiers or exceptions needed.
 
AvalonXQ said:
Yes, absolutely he does.

Every person that we as a society choose to force in a confined space, needs to be protected from violent assault and other harm in that space.

Prisons need to be safe; when they're not, we've failed an obligation we have as a society.

When we come to accept as a culture that they are not safe, to the point where being illegally assaulted and harmed in prison is seen as part of the punishment, we have lost a fair bit of our moral compass as a society.

If you think this man deserves to be raped, then get it added to his criminal sentence. Until you do that, he deserves the same treatment and protections under the law as everyone else.
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Indeed the prison rape joke are beyond pale IMHO, especially since a few people telling them do not see them as a joke, but as an additional merited punishment. You have said it very well. Human right apply to everybody, not those one think deserve, and not to the "others" one think do not deserve them.
 
3point14 said:
Fair enough. We just don't share a sense of humour, I guess.
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There was a thread on here yesterday regarding a neo-nazi dolt who repeatedly called some black guy in a bar the "n" word. He said "you're not welcome in this bar "N".... again and again.

The black guy showed a remarkable amount of restraint.

Much later, the drunk neo-nazi dolt met this black guy in the parking lot and continued the tirade. He wound up with a broken nose and in jail.

To me, THAT is funny.

(the black guy was a boxer)
 
Once again, I see no one saying he deserves to be raped. We say we would find it funny.

I don't find rape funny, I don't find rapists funny, I don't find criminals being raped in prison funny, except in the case of a child rapist being raped by someone who is not a child rapist.

Frankly, I don't know if the guy is actually guilty of child rape. But for someone who is guilty of child rape, they should get the sentence handed to them by the judge, and nothing more. If the child rapists happens to get raped by a non-child rapists, whether in prison or out, I would definitely find it funny. Of course, I think the rapist in turn should pay for the crime of raping a child rapist.
 
Dr. Keith said:
Not that you were trying to say this, but this same logic would apply to a cop that gets sent to prison. They will have a very rough time of it, but hey, they knew that when they committed whatever crime got them there. So, they have the same knowledge and yet I doubt you would feel as humored by their treatment.

What do you call someone who thinks prison rape is ironically funny to denigrate them? Really, I don't think name calling will be a concern here.

And if it isn't clear, add me to the list of people who think that rape is not acceptable. No qualifiers or exceptions needed.
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Well, I think it is a concern, simply because I've seen enough debates—especially in the Political forums—that quickly devolve into name-calling and I'm glad to see that the people who've chosen to post in it are getting their points across have done so without name-calling. Like I said, it helps to open minds to a point of view they may have previously closed.

Michael
 
J. B Stoner was a nazi white supremeist who spent a few years in prison for bombing a church in Birmingham Al during the civil rights movement. He was gay. He thought black men were built for gay sex and he was said to throughly enjoy his time in the in lockup.

He was in the general prison population and was very popular among the gay, bi or sexually frustrated straight inmates. He was an equal opportunity pervert despite his partners race color or creed.
 
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