Split Thread What does "MIHOP" mean?

[femr2]

femr2 is suggesting that MIHOP is rather ambiguous.

Absolutely.

As I've said repeatedly, there is nothing within the acronym M.I.H.O.P. which denotes "Who". Similarly with "it". What "it" is is subjective.

Once again, femr2 is telling us that his use of the MIHOP has been rather ambiguous.

My view of the acronym is simply of the literal meaning of the words in the acronym itself, shorthand for...

Made It Happen On Purpose

Regardless of who, it or how.

He is also pointing out that MIHOP means different things "to different demographics".

Absolutely. Within your own linked document there is reference to the following...

• Cheney-Bush MIHOP
• Peak Oil MIHOP
• Mossad MIHOP
• Zionist MIHOP
• Jewish MIHOP
• New World Order MIHOP
• Rogue Network MIHOP

Making rather a mockery of those within this thread who have stated that there is one, and only one "who". And even more ridiculously telling me that I mean "The American Government" with any use of the shorthand acronym M.I.H.O.P.

Could its ambiguity and audience-dependent meaning be the reasons femr2 has been using that acronym?

No. Looks like you are a bit paranoid.

I quoted arabesque, a known truther, precisely because arabesque said the ambiguity of MIHOP has led to its misuse by "lesser researchers and rank and file activists".

He also said...
"The misleading and false MIHOP/LIHOP dichotomy is effectively used in straw-man debates in which 9/11 activists are attacked with ridiculously misleading and inaccurate labels."

But I see you preferred to use your quote to make some kind of underhand point about "lesser researchers". Funny

femr2 then accuses me of ignoring the ambiguity of MIHOP that I have accused femr2 of exploiting.

I'm exploiting nothing. Any previous use of the acronym has been simply with the words Made It Happen On Purpose condensed. Your accusation of exploitation is simply your desire to "attack" showing through.

femr2's been pretending the "MIHOP" acronym he's been using is perfectly clear

The words Make It Happen On Purpose are clear. The "Who", "what" and "how" are ambiguous, absolutely, of course.

it looks as though he's been using that acronym because his Truther audience will assume it's "shorthand for the view that elements within the U.S. government itself planned the September 11, 2001 attacks" without requiring femr2 himself to support that view.

Incorrect.

femr2's definition of MIHOP?

Where is my definition of M.I.H.O.P. ?


Interesting to note that you choose to further address me, rather than any of these...

MIHOP IS "Inside Job"

MIHOP means "government did it." That's what it is.

No! WRONG! The meaning is NOT JUST "Made It Happen On Purpose.", it is always, everywhere, consistently, clearly "Agents of the US government Made It Happen On Purpose."

WRONG! That is the one interpretation that is clearly, unequivocally, consistently ruled out by everybody who ever used the acronym "MIHOP" in 9/11 CT debates, except you!

When you say "MIHOP" - you're saying the government did it. Period.

...etc, etc, etc...

Again...

• Cheney-Bush MIHOP
• Peak Oil MIHOP
• Mossad MIHOP
• Zionist MIHOP
• Jewish MIHOP
• New World Order MIHOP
• Rogue Network MIHOP

I'm sure the list could be expanded substantially.

What does MIHOP "mean" ?

It's an acronym for the words Made It Happen On Purpose.

To interpret the application of the acronym requires clarification of each term...

prefix-M prefix-I prefix-H prefix-O prefix-P

As I said in the first place, and the reason the "call out" thread was created...

There is nothing about the acronym M.I.H.O.P. which denotes "who".

 

[femr2]

I propose from now on, any use of MIHOP is preceded by "Terrorists" or "US Govt".

That would eliminate any guessing on anybody's part. And clearly we're not afraid of a few extra keystrokes here, IMO.

If you choose to attribute your use with a specific "who", sure. Go for it.

 

[NoahFence]

No kiddo - I mean everybody. YOU included. Because YOU are the only one who refers to "MIHOP" as anything other than "US Govt".

YOU.

If you don't I (and about 99.99% of the rest of the world) will assume you mean US Govt. Sorry, that's just the facts.

 

[femr2]

No kiddo - I mean everybody. YOU included. Because YOU are the only one who refers to "MIHOP" as anything other than "US Govt".

YOU.

If you don't I (and about 99.99% of the rest of the world) will assume you mean US Govt. Sorry, that's just the facts.

I have no interest at all in "who", and I've already told you that "who" is not part of my usage. If you continue to assume otherwise, that's your problem, not mine.

If I use the acronym, I have no problem using A-MIHOP (anyone) or similar.

My ID is femr2, not "kiddo" or "F2". Take note.

Italicised section - You are clearly wrong. See posts above.

 

[Dog Town]

My ID is femr2, not "kiddo" or "F2". Take note.

Taken.

 

[W.D.Clinger]

My view of the acronym is simply of the literal meaning of the words in the acronym itself, shorthand for...

Made It Happen On Purpose

Regardless of who, it or how.

By that definition, The 9/11 Commission Report describes a MIHOP conspiracy.

If you really believe that, then your use of MIHOP to assure 9/11 Truthers that you're on their side has been dishonest.

Where is my definition of M.I.H.O.P. ?

Unless your statement quoted above counts as your definition of MIHOP, you haven't settled on a clear definition of that term.

That's sort of the point: You've been using the term as though it actually meant something, relying on your audience to interpret MIHOP in a way that's favorable to you.

Interesting to note that you choose to further address me, rather than any of these...

The more interesting thing to note is that you quoted nearly everything I wrote except for this central question:

Does the conspiracy described by The 9/11 Commission Report qualify as MIHOP under femr2's definition of MIHOP?
​

If femr2 and friends can't give us a straight answer to that question, then femr2's definition of MIHOP can't be so clear and straightforward as he and his friends would like for us to believe.

If you are now claiming that MIHOP has no accepted definition, then your history of using MIHOP as though it had an accepted definition strongly suggests intent to mislead.

 

[NoahFence]

I have no interest at all in "who", and I've already told you that "who" is not part of my usage. If you continue to assume otherwise, that's your problem, not mine.

If I use the acronym, I have no problem using A-MIHOP (anyone) or similar.

My ID is femr2, not "kiddo" or "F2". Take note.

Italicised section - You are clearly wrong. See posts above.

It doesn't matter what you think - the fact is MIHOP is used by 99.99% of people to denote US government involvement. That's all there is to it, chief.

What if I decided that the term 'truther' was indicative of people who actually know what happened? (IE - terrorists + aircraft = mess. NO US GOVERNMENT INVOLVEMENT) - would that be cool?

 

[femr2]

By that definition, The 9/11 Commission Report describes a MIHOP conspiracy.

I disagree. You are applying your own interpretation without qualifying what "it" is, or "how". As I suggested earlier "it" is also subjective. If you deem "it" to be complete destruction of WTC7 "on purpose", then your assertion is clearly incorrect.

If you really believe that, then your use of MIHOP to assure 9/11 Truthers that you're on their side has been dishonest.

You make an incorrect assertion, then ask if I really believe that ? How odd. Perhaps it's a rhetorical statement.

My use of MIHOP does not specify any singular "who", "what" or "how".

I have in the past stated that I've leaned on the MIHOP side of the fence, sure, especially with folk accusing me of being a "debunker" or "government agent". Ironic really

Unless your statement quoted above counts as your definition of MIHOP, you haven't settled on a clear definition of that term.

Good to see that you are aware that I do not imply a specific "who", "what" or "how". Yet your statements above imply otherwise.

And also, of course, that the acronym does not have a specific meaning other than the literal meaning of the words...

(somebody) made it (whatever it is) happen on purpose (by any means).

Whether you assert...

• "space aliens" made "the vaporisation of the entire building complex" happen on purpose "with their nuk-o-beams"

...or...

• "mice" made "WTC7 fall down" on purpose "by chewing on the support columns"

They both Made It Happen On Purpose.

You've been using the term as though it actually meant something

It does, just not the specific singular meaning those in this thread have been demanding that it does.

your history of using MIHOP as though it had an accepted definition strongly suggests intent to mislead.

As you can see I have no problem stating the very wide boundaries of application. Again your desire to "attack" seems to be the root cause of your assertion of "deception".

 

[NoahFence]

It does, just not the specific singular meaning those in this thread have been demanding that it does.

You see, that's where you're getting confused. It's not me, or WD, or any one JREF member at all. It's the entirety of the truth movement that uses that MIHOP Term as "us government did it" - it's been shown to you countless times, kiddo. It's the entire 'debunker' community, or basically anybody who's ever heard the term used, that knows it's truthers saying US Govt. did it.

This isn't some lynch on femr thing. We simply said what it means to everybody not named femr, and you took it as some personal insult. Perhaps a bit less paranoia and a bit more flexibility would help, no?

 

[beachnut]

MIHOP means the government made it happen, or those Satan like evildoers of Major Tom did it. Why is this what MIHOP means here in the 9/11 Conspiracy Theories sub forum? ? lol

Anyone who labels their video's "demolition", is MIHOP. If they can't specific who did it, well that is self-critiquing.

 

[femr2]

It's the entirety of the truth movement that uses that MIHOP Term as "us government did it" - it's been shown to you countless times, kiddo.

Clearly you are incorrect.

I have already informed you that my ID is "femr2", not "kiddo" or any other name.

We simply said what it means to everybody not named femr, and you took it as some personal insult.

This "call out" thread was created to argue against...

Your theory is 911 was an inside job

Incorrect.

prefix-M prefix-I prefix-H prefix-O prefix-P

 

[NoahFence]

Clearly you are incorrect.

I have already informed you that my ID is "femr2", not "kiddo" or any other name.

I'm not incorrect dude. Yours is the very first time I've EVER seen MIHOP attempted to be used in a manner other than "US Government did it". And I know I speak for virtually everybody involved in this debate.

As far as your name goes, all I can say is it kinda sucks to be talked down to, doesn't it? To be made to feel inferior? Perhaps you and your other kiddo buddy should take note, and stop doing that very thing you complain about. Check out 'hypocrite' on dictionary .com.

You might want to look up "humble" while you're there, too.

/soapbox

I've posted a question on AE911's facebook page regarding their interpretation of "MIHOP" - lets see what they say about it, mmkay?

 

[femr2]

Yours is the very first time I've EVER seen MIHOP attempted to be used in a manner other than "US Government did it".

Then clearly you have been ignoring the information presented within this thread, along with...

• Cheney-Bush MIHOP
• Peak Oil MIHOP
• Mossad MIHOP
• Zionist MIHOP
• Jewish MIHOP
• New World Order MIHOP
• Rogue Network MIHOP

...and undoubtedly many other configurations.

 

[NoahFence]

Yours is the very first time I've EVER seen MIHOP

presented within

this thread,

......

 

[000063]

Femr, you didn't claim that your definition was a meaning or MIHOP, you claimed that it was the definition. Now you're claiming that you claimed it was only a definition, and that the big mean debunkers are oppressing you. (Violence inherent in the sys., etc.) Still wrong, and dishonest too.

 

[femr2]

Femr, you didn't claim that your definition was a meaning or MIHOP, you claimed that it was the definition.

Incorrect.

I've stated that the acronym M.I.H.O.P. does not denote the "who", "what" or "how"...

There is nothing about the acronym MIHOP which denotes "who".

The acronym means exactly what it says on the tin.

Incorrect, that is AOTUSGMIHOP

How you choose to add inference to an acronym is entirely up to you.

If you are trying to attribute your interpretation onto my use of the acronym, you couldn't be more wrong.

...etc...

I haven't stated a specific subjective definition. That being the point.

As I said earlier...

And also, of course, that the acronym does not have a specific meaning other than the literal meaning of the words...

(somebody) made it (whatever it is) happen on purpose (by any means).

Whether you assert...

• "space aliens" made "the vaporisation of the entire building complex" happen on purpose "with their nuk-o-beams"

...or...

• "mice" made "WTC7 fall down" on purpose "by chewing on the support columns"

They both Made It Happen On Purpose.

Simple.

Still wrong, and dishonest too.

Incorrect, on both assertions.

 

[Hokulele]

If you are well aware the term is vague and can be misinterpreted, why the hell use it? Why not state in plain language what you really mean the first time? Anything else appears to be deliberate obfuscation (hence my comparison to creationists earlier in this thread).

 

[femr2]

If you are well aware the term is vague and can be misinterpreted, why the hell use it?

I think you are forgetting that the discussion arose (along with this entire thinly-veiled "call out" thread) as a consequence of BasqueArch quote-mining the911forum for discussion there stretching back to over two years ago.

Part of my analysis is looking for signs of M.I.H.O.P. of any kind, regardless of a specific "who", "what" or "how".

As an example, the WTC7 early motion trace data refutes M.I.H.O.P. theories reliant upon "instantaneous removal of structural support".

Different "theories" kicking around have different M.I.H.O.P. contexts.

I have used the term in a generic context as highlighted...

(somebody) made it (whatever it is) happen on purpose (by whatever means)

 

[Hokulele]

Then why even use the phrase. Without the definitions, it is absolutely meaningless, which implies the research is pointless playing with numbers. Again, a comparison to "Intelligent Design" is appropriate. If you are accommodating *all* definitions of "intelligent" and "design", simply counting the number of gaps in the fossil record can be considered research.

Even though it is a completely pointless waste of time.

 

[Sword_Of_Truth]

Incorrect. There is nothing about the acronym MIHOP which denotes "who".

Oh good lord.

MIHOP means the US government did it.

This is just childish anal retentive semantic hair-splitting. next thing you know, the twoofers will be arguing the meaning of the words "in" and "on" as if that somehow makes...

What...?

Oh @#$%!