• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

2011 Arctic Sea Ice Thread

BenBurch said:
Analysis of the PSC data by Tamino;

http://tamino.wordpress.com/2011/06/23/sea-ice-3-d/
Click to expand...

I don't like those graphics where the 0 is not a 0 and a volume is expressed in square kilometres. Tamino knows better. No matter someone counterarguments the Leprechaun Decadal Oscillation as its cause, in these sensible matters applies the adage of "Cesar's wife must be not only free from sin indeed, but from any suspicion too".
 
aleCcowaN said:
I don't like those graphics where the 0 is not a 0 and a volume is expressed in square kilometres. Tamino knows better. No matter someone counterarguments the Leprechaun Decadal Oscillation as its cause, in these sensible matters applies the adage of "Cesar's wife must be not only free from sin indeed, but from any suspicion too".
Click to expand...

An error on his part since the volume numbers he was using were km^3.
 
Skeptical Greg said:
Interesting info ... I followed one of the links to this story:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-13002706

Anyone else see the problem with this statement?

Click to expand...

Its important to recognize the difference, as well, between popular usage "ice-free" and what the researchers qualify as "icefree."

...Stephanie Pfirman, professor of oceanography at Barnard College, says “Many climate scientists use the term ‘ice-free’ in a functional way, as a shorthand to mean very little reflective surface at the end of the summer when sea ice is at its minimum.”...
Click to expand...

http://nsidc.org/icelights/2011/05/03/when-will-the-arctic-lose-its-sea-ice/
 
Ahh, journalism ...

Scientists have retracted their statement that the arctic may be ice free in summer by 2013, instead now saying it may be ice free in summer by 2013.

Those crafty scientists ...
 
Off topic

If you are just interested in tracking the sea ice extent please ignore this. The following information illustrates how the loss of sea ice will likely impact humans in the Arctic.


The following link is to a long thread full of what I consider very interesting images that document the subsistance living and fishing on the sea ice in the Arctic. The pictures span many years and hunting seasons. What amazes me the most is that the person that has been documenting this for so long doesn't yet understand the absolute upheaval that is imminent once the ice disappears.

I was so intrigued and captivated by the images, and the simplicity and hardship of life in this frozen realm, that I perused the entire thread over a period of many hours almost non-stop. Majik Image is more than a little weird near the end.

The 16 pages of pictures in this thread are posted at the Luminous Landscape photography forum, at the Landscape and Nature Photography thread.

Topic: Home Sweet Home @ 50 below zero (Read 218840 times)

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=18236.0

by Majik_Imaje

"I live in the land of ICE.. Point Hope Alaska, the oldest continually inhabited settlement or village in ALL of North America.

Life can accurately be traced back to over 2,600 years ago to this one spot of land.

800 Inupiaq Eskimo's live here! We are located 200 miles above the Arctic Circle in the Northwest portion of the state of ALASKA."

continues



What really shocked me and reason for this post was the fist post on page 13 #240. I wonder how many of the people that live in the Artic do not see what is coming.
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?topic=18236.240

- by Majik Imagae
"This comes under the heading - Stuff you just couldn't make up !!

An Inconvenient Truth for Gore
Embarrassed former VP is forced to admit his claim that the Arctic will soon be ice-free wasn't based on climate data

No kidding !! I live in the Arctic for 30 years - I live out on the frozen ocean ice pack of the Chukchi sea.

I see with my own eyes how ridiculous these fraudulent clamis are !!

SHAME SHAME SHAME

This is just a game of deception in the name of $$ and power !!

Al Gore just purchased a new home 4 feet from the water in San Fransisco !! Now that really makes a lot of sense ?? I guess he really isn't afraid of the water rising. go figure !!"



As we track the sea ice we may as well track how soon it will be before Majik Imaje and the rest of the community realize that the Arctic as they knew it will change drastically, perhaps forever altering their lifestyle. What a place to be a denier!

The researchers in Barrow Alaska tell a very different story if you are interested.

Ice Stories Dispatches from Polar Scientists
http://icestories.exploratorium.edu/dispatches/big-ideas/barrow-alaska/

And of course CO2 and Methane release from the permafrost and the Eastern Siberia Shelf (not mentioned at this site) are the 800lb gorilla in the room.
http://icestories.exploratorium.edu/dispatches/big-ideas/tundra-and-permafrost/


"In recent years, however, permafrost has been melting en masse, thanks to increases in global average temperatures. The zones where permafrost can be found year-round are creeping northward, and permafrost coverage, currently 20 percent of the earth’s land surface, is predicted to shrink drastically in coming years.

A mass-melting of permafrost would contribute significantly to rising sea levels. It might also accelerate global warming by releasing greenhouse gases into the air. Rich in organic material, the soil in the Arctic tundra will begin to decay if it thaws. As it breaks down, it will release large amounts of methane and carbon dioxide—two greenhouse gases—into the atmosphere. Thawing permafrost could thereby result in a positive feedback loop in which thawing causes faster warming, resulting in more thawing."

I hope you enjoy the images of the ice as much as I did.

Interesting times!
 
Warmer1 said:
As we track the sea ice we may as well track how soon it will be before Majik Imaje and the rest of the community realize that the Arctic as they knew it will change drastically, perhaps forever altering their lifestyle. What a place to be a denier!
Click to expand...

A pretty extreme example, I agree, but of an increasing refrain. The Mississipi Valley - what a place to be a denier! Texas. Florida. The Indus Valley.

The researchers in Barrow Alaska tell a very different story if you are interested.
Click to expand...

To nobody's surprise, I'm sure :).

Does anybody actually live on the sea ice? I know people go out on it to hunt seal and get from place to place, but do people live there year-round? It seems a little precarious. And as for the example of Gore Derangement Syndrome, I rather doubt that house exists. Just as I doubt that Majik Image, Ice-Dweller, actually exists.
 
CapelDodger said:
You may need to look at it again, it made perfect sense to me. Layout could have been clearer, perhaps :).
Click to expand...
My apologies, yes it does need to be a lot clearer in terms of layout. I was reacting to the assumed anti-Gore rhetoric without looking at the context.
 
Last edited:
BenBurch said:
Tracking just above last year right now, but the difference is small.
Click to expand...

Weather conditions will determine this year's outcome, of course, and from my recent reading I gather cloud-cover is a major factor (more cloud, less melt). Oddly enough, the negative feedback from cloud-behaviour that the likes of Lindzen and Spencer have desperately tried to conjure up in the tropics may actually emerge in the Arctic :). We should ask Randi where they got the trick wrong.

Arctic weather seems to be all over the place these last few years so it could happen. AGW will have its inexorable way in the end but it would be a comfort to Lindzen and Spencer in their autumn years.
 
Mikemcc said:
My apologies, yes it does need to be alot clearer in terms of layout. I was reacting to the assumed anti-Gore rhetoric with looking at the context.
Click to expand...

Exposed to enough Gore Derangement Syndrome, anyone can develop a tic. And it seems there's no end of it in the denier echo-chamber, where Al Gore bestrides their world like a Titan.

(As a Brit I perhaps find this even more bizarre than rational US Americans do.)

It's so old, but then the same can be said for the denier camp. Old and getting older. Some of them can remember FDR (communist) and Eisenhower (dyed-in-the-wool pinko). The 50's was when this whole AGW plot was launched, you know :cool:.
 
Does anybody actually live on the sea ice? I know people go out on it to hunt seal and get from place to place, but do people live there year-round? It seems a little precarious.
Click to expand...
You are correct that people don't live on the ice as it is constantly moving, cracking and being reshaped as evidenced in the photographs. Also,as I'm sure you know, warmer air and waves are acting on the shoreline villages as illustrated in the link below (1). The permafrost is obviously also melting buckling roads, altering huge areas of tundra and some buildings are sinking into the tundra as seen in the images linked below(2).

(1) "Village of Shishmaref, North Alaska

The village of Shishmaref in N. Alaska, inhabited for 400 years, is facing evacuation due to rising temperatures, which are causing a reduction in sea ice, thawing of permafrost along the coast. The reduced sea ice allows higher storm surges to reach shore and thawing permafrost makes the shoreline more vulnerable to erosion. The town's homes, water system and infrastructure are being undermined."
http://www.arctic.noaa.gov/detect/human-shishmaref.shtml

There are some more up to date images showing that the houses were lost.

(2) Here are some more images of the damage caused by melting permafrost and of course this is likely just the beginning.
http://www.arctic.noaa.gov/gallery_permafrost.html

Here is the main Arctic page with the links on the left side.
http://www.arctic.noaa.gov/detect/land-permafrost.shtml

What did the loss of sea ice mean for some walruses?
http://video.nationalgeographic.com/video/player/news/animals-news/us-walrus-haul-vin.html


And as for the example of Gore Derangement Syndrome, I rather doubt that house exists.
Click to expand...

He purchased a large house somewhere and as per denier custom valid data is not needed.

Just as I doubt that Majik Image, Ice-Dweller, actually exists.
Click to expand...

I believe I read that Majik was a transplant from Boston or somewhere.
"I was sent to this village in 1981, (population 420), as an electrican to wire two construction camps. A three week job. When the job finished, I quit the company and stayed.

That was 27 years ago, and I am still here!"

The pictures of the hunting out on the ice are still enjoyable and as I claimed previously things get more than a little weird near the end of the thread, so nothing would surprise me. Maybe the fat in the animals they are eating bioaccumulated the fallout from Chernobal. The guy loses it here.

"10 secret service; 30 FBI- 50 swat - 200 police - DIED trying to kill an innocent 14 year old boy that was unarmed and innocent of any wrong doing. The military was called in, using armor piercing rounds; grenades, and mines tried in VAIN to kill this kid.

THERE ARE ONLY TWO CHOICES HERE: there is absolutely no middle ground. either this is true or it is a fabricated nonsensical lie.
[snip]
When a 14 year old boy gets shot over 200 times, and is still walking with no visible wounds of any type. SOMETHING IS WRONG !!

EVERYTIIME he was shot; that bullet would just flatten on top of his skin - not one bullet ever penetrated his skin during the months of Aug- Sept."


So Monsieur Dodger, you don't believe the story above or like the assumed name Majik Imaje for a photographer? That's the wrong approach if you want to get invited into a 2012 survival bunker!
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom