Moderated WTC 1 features list, initiation model / WTC 2 features list, collapse model

Major_Tom said:
[qimg]http://www.sharpprintinginc.com/911/images/photoalbum/13/southdust1.jpeg[/qimg]


So this ejection from around the 88th fl comes out forcefully during this movement from 0 to 2 degrees.

[qimg]http://femr2.ucoz.com/CNN_Aircheck_Eric_Letvin_Cli24.gif[/qimg]


Any ideas, guys? Looks like destruction in the core earlier and lower than tilt can account for.

All 4 walls and the core had failed at less than 1 degree.
Click to expand...



You seem to be labouring under the misapprehension that the NIST report said that the tilting caused the failure of the core rather than load redistribution.
 
Tilt of one half of one degree means a descent of more than 20" at the opposite wall (mean descent of over 10" across the entire floor area) and ejection of 35,000 cubic feet of air, smoke, ash, and debris from a space previously on fire.

If that volume change of 35,000 cubic feet happened in 3/4 second, that's about the maximum flow rate of this seven-megawatt high-speed wind tunnel.

What phenomena does any additional "destruction in the core" beyond its contribution to the global tilt explain, that is not already explained by the tilt itself?

Respectfully,
Myriad
 
Wow. You have obviously put some thought into this.

And we are seing the alpha and omega of your capacity to absorb and analyze information?

Do you follow up with any reality checks to those neat ideas or does it work best if you stop thinking at that point?
 
Major_Tom said:
Wow. You have obviously put some thought into this.

And we are seing the alpha and omega of your capacity to absorb and analyze information?

Do you follow up with any reality checks to those neat ideas or does it work best if you stop thinking at that point?
Click to expand...

Your alpha and omega is.
Major_Tom said:
These are just some of the factors which, when studied in depth, show that the supposed "gravity-driven collapse" is a mere illusion to mask an intentional act so barbaric, so inhumane and morally impoverished that the fabled characteristics of Satan come to mind. ...
Click to expand...
How is your delusion coming? Any progress? When will you join reality? Who is the Satan in your fantasy?
 
Satan if a fable, Beachnut, and Hell is within ones own mind.


Myriad or any other moderator, I have a similar detailed feature and collapse initiation observations list for WTC 2. May I start a thread like this for WTC 2?


I am afraid that if I start similar thread on WTC 2 it will be merged with this one. If one building has proved so confusing for many posters, 2 buildings in one thread is sure to further boggle the mind.


May I start a new thread for WTC 2?
 
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Major_Tom said:
Satan if a fable, Beachnut, and Hell is within ones own mind.


Myriad or any other moderator, I have a similar detailed feature and collapse initiation observations list for WTC 2. May I start a thread like this for WTC 2?


I am afraid that if I start similar thread on WTC 2 it will be merged with this one. If one building has proved so confusing for many posters, 2 buildings in one thread is sure to further boggle the mind.


May I start a new thread for WTC 2?
Click to expand...

Dear Lord --- Please don't.

Three threads several pages long that don't actually say anything is a bit much.
 
It is a complete visual mapping of WTC2 through collapse initiation to collapse completion.

The only one on the planet. You aren't interested in seeing a record of how the building really moved?
 
Major_Tom said:
It is a complete visual mapping of WTC2 through collapse initiation to collapse completion.

The only one on the planet. You aren't interested in seeing a record of how the building really moved?
Click to expand...
Sure we are. Do you have a version without your editorial comments?
 
Major_Tom said:
It is a complete visual mapping of WTC2 through collapse initiation to collapse completion.

The only one on the planet. You aren't interested in seeing a record of how the building really moved?
Click to expand...

Not really. I already know how the building moved.
Down.

Really, really fast.
 
Major_Tom said:
It is a complete visual mapping of WTC2 through collapse initiation to collapse completion.

The only one on the planet. You aren't interested in seeing a record of how the building really moved?
Click to expand...
0_61_111308_twine-742982.jpg
 
Myriad said:
Tilt of one half of one degree means a descent of more than 20" at the opposite wall (mean descent of over 10" across the entire floor area) and ejection of 35,000 cubic feet of air, smoke, ash, and debris from a space previously on fire.

If that volume change of 35,000 cubic feet happened in 3/4 second, that's about the maximum flow rate of this seven-megawatt high-speed wind tunnel.

What phenomena does any additional "destruction in the core" beyond its contribution to the global tilt explain, that is not already explained by the tilt itself?

Respectfully,
Myriad
Click to expand...


Or you could use your own eyes to see how the air emerges from the 98th fl relative to the floors below during the movement.

You can see how the air moves through the smoke movement. Any evidence of wind tunnels from the 98th floor? Then why would one come out the 89th fl at this time? Lil' reality checking, please.

CNN_Aircheck_Eric_Letvin_Cli24.gif


Obviously it is ridiculous to think that a strong light grey ejection from the 89th fl south side during the observed movement is normal. You can see how the pressure builds in reality just by looking at the gif.

You can see how the 94th floor reacts to the movement. You can see the 92nd floor. There is no reason for a sharp localized 89th fl ejection that lines up with the core from the south side during these moments.
 
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Major_Tom said:
... Lil' reality checking, please.

[qimg]http://femr2.ucoz.com/CNN_Aircheck_Eric_Letvin_Cli24.gif[/qimg]

Obviously it is ridiculous to think that a strong light grey ejection from the 89th fl south side during the observed movement is normal. You can see how the pressure builds in reality just by looking at the gif.

You can see how the 94th floor reacts to the movement. You can see the 92nd floor. There is no reason for a sharp localized 89th fl ejection that lines up with the core from the south side during these moments.
Click to expand...

I can't even see in that grainy gif if that tower has floors or not.
Certainly it is impossible to see there "how the pressure builds in reality".
 
Major_Tom said:
Obviously it is ridiculous to think that a strong light grey ejection from the 89th fl south side during the observed movement is normal.
Click to expand...


Not normal.

Building is on fire and collapsing, which is very not-normal.

Building & normal --> not collapsing.

Building & collapsing --> not normal.

Building & normal --> not on fire.

Building & on fire --> not normal

I walk by a building and it's on fire and collapsing, I don't have to wonder, hmm is this building normal and on fire and collapsing, or not normal and on fire and collapsing? If it's on fire and/or collapsing at all, it's not normal.

And when I'm checking a building for normalosity, two of the things on my checklist are always "not collapsing" and "not on fire." If I can't check off the "not collapsing" and "not on fire" items, it definitely doesn't get my "this is normal" seal of approval. I think any professional building inspector would agree. "Would you certify this building as normal, if it were on fire and collapsing?" Betcha she says no. Betcha she doesn't say "as long as no light grey smoke puffs out anywhere not intuitively obvious, then sure."

Ridiculous to expect anything that happens when a building is on fire and collapses to be normal? Yeah, you got that right.

Respectfully,
Myriad
 
Myriad, can I start a WTC2 feature list thread? Or will it be merged with this thread if I do? (resulting in a big mess).


Please do not discuss moderation issues in threads. The best way to get your moderation-related questions answered is by starting a thread in the Questions area of the Forum Management section.
Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: Myriad
 
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Major_Tom said:
Myriad, can I start a WTC2 feature list thread? Or will it be merged with this thread if I do? (resulting in a big mess).
Click to expand...

You are allowed to state what you learned from Myriad's post immediately preceding yours.

Would you agree that buildings ought to generally be labelled "not normal" if they are collapsing or on fire, or would you claim an exception in case there is a dust ejection on the 89th floor?
 
Well, I think everyone can see that the WTC1 feature list is rather large and I confine all those features to this single thread.

It seems pretty clear that if I am to give WTC2 the same attention with another large list of features, I wll need a separate thread to do that.

So, in about 2 days I will start a thread for the many features of WTC2. I assume if this is not OK that somebody will inform me with the next 2 days since I know Myriad is aware of this request.

It seems clear that if we are to give WTC2 the attention it deserves I need a thread for it only. Certainly not an unreasonable request.
 
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Major_Tom said:
It is a complete visual mapping of WTC2 through collapse initiation to collapse completion.

The only one on the planet. You aren't interested in seeing a record of how the building really moved?
Click to expand...

It moved downward.
 
Major_Tom said:
Or you could use your own eyes to see how the air emerges from the 98th fl relative to the floors below during the movement.

You can see how the air moves through the smoke movement. Any evidence of wind tunnels from the 98th floor? Then why would one come out the 89th fl at this time? Lil' reality checking, please.

[qimg]http://femr2.ucoz.com/CNN_Aircheck_Eric_Letvin_Cli24.gif[/qimg]

Obviously it is ridiculous to think that a strong light grey ejection from the 89th fl south side during the observed movement is normal. You can see how the pressure builds in reality just by looking at the gif.

You can see how the 94th floor reacts to the movement. You can see the 92nd floor. There is no reason for a sharp localized 89th fl ejection that lines up with the core from the south side during these moments.
Click to expand...

Normal? You have a data base showing what's normal during a 110 story building collapse?
 
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