Ed Pentagon - TruthMakesPeace

[beachnut]

So you are saying the hijackers let them talk? "Come here Captain, say a few words."

Why do you make fun of the dead by making up idiotic lies?
http://www.911myths.com/images/1/19/Aa11-calls-ong.png
She talked and then 11 impacted the WTC, she was murdered, she witnessed people die, stabbed to death by the terrorists you weakly apologize for you.

http://www.mishalov.com/wtc_flight-11-transcript.html

Why do you make fun of people who died on 911 by making up nonsense?

Seriously the time table of the calls does not show any calls within about 15 minutes of impact. That's plenty enough time to gas the crew, passengers, and hijackers, and take over the plane by remote control. For example: the theory proposes that Hani intended to land at DC Airport and demand that the USA get out of Arabia, in exchange for hostages.

FAILURE.
OOPS, UBL made the case for why we would be killed in 1997, you are not current on terrorism.
You make up lies without checking he facts.

Oh, you mean the faked CSV files released only under pressure by the FOIA? CSVs can be made with Excel. Even so, a plane DID hit the Pentagon. It was just under remote control at the time. The CSVs confirm the Gassed Occupants In Remote Controlled Plane theory.

The FDR data is verified by RADAR. The raw data is available. You are making up lies of fake data, and you don't have evidence. Now you are calling the FBI and NTSB liars, and you have no proof. The FDR debunks your moronic gassed delusion.

 

[TruthMakesPeace]

So the UA WAS a hedge!

no it wasn't. it was a put. you make false assumptions. off topic. wrong thread.
post in right thread if you want response.

 

[The Big Dog]

no it wasn't. it was a put. you make false assumptions. off topic. wrong thread.
post in right thread if you want response.

What thread?

You know, your comment that it wasn't a "hedge" it was a "put" option makes you sound like you truly have no idea what in god's name you are talking about.

pssss, the put option was part of the hedge strategy.

 

[TruthMakesPeace]

Betty Ong talked 4.5 minutes, plenty of time for the gassing

She (Betty Ong) talked and then 11 impacted the WTC, she was murdered, she witnessed people die, stabbed to death by the terrorists

Excellent question. Thanks for additional proof of the GOIRPC theory. Yes, the hijackers were doing a standard hijacking, including stabbing. Betty's talk was at 8:18:47 and was 4.5 minutes long. http://www.mishalov.com/911_ong.mp3

4.5 minutes from 8:18 would be about 8:23, plenty of time for gassing everyone, before Flight 11 impacted WTC at 8:46:26 am. Her call was allegedly 1620 seconds (27 minutes), but not independently verified. By "coincidence" the recording stopped. This would be disinfo to hide the gassing. We are looking for actual recordings within 15 minutes of any building crash that don't sound faked.

The GOIRCP theory proposes an option for Flight 93, that the gassing mechanism malfunctioned. It was no longer needed for the false flag op. It was detonated by remote control, shot down, or passengers rallied against the hijackers.

UBL made the case for why we would be killed in 1997

The GOIRPC confims there was intent to kill Americans. UBL did not say he or any terrorists would kill themselves on a plane crashing into buildings.

The FDR data is verified by RADAR. The raw data is available.

Yes, the FDR data confirms there was a plane hitting its target, and supports the Gassed Occupants (crew, passengers and duped hijackers) In Remote Controlled Plane (GOIRPC) theory. Glad you mentioned it.

To test a theory, someone has to be an "advocate" for it. So I do appreciate JREFers giving this theory the shake down. I just want to know what happened on 9/11.

 

[000063]

Excellent question. Thanks for additional proof of the GOIRPC theory. Yes, the hijackers were doing a standard hijacking, including stabbing.

It indicates they were stabbing. Doesn't necessarily mean it was "standard".

Betty's talk was at 8:18:47 and was 4.5 minutes long. http://www.mishalov.com/911_ong.mp3

4.5 minutes from 8:18 would be about 8:23, plenty of time for gassing everyone, before Flight 11 impacted WTC at 8:46:26 am. Her call was allegedly 1620 seconds (27 minutes), but not independently verified. This would be disinfo to hide the gassing. We are looking for actual recordings within 15 minutes of any building crash that don't sound faked.

So you want 1. "independently verifed" voice transcripts, that 2. "don't sound faked", because the official ones are, of course "disinfo".

Prove it.

You still haven't answered my question. How far would the planes travel in 15--whoops--a little over 8 minutes at the speed they were going, and where would they be at that point?

The GOIRCP theory proposes an option for Flight 93, that the gassing mechanism malfunctioned. It was no longer needed for the false flag op. It was detonated by remote control, shot down, or passengers rallied against the hijackers.

It's C, except for the part where the mechanism didn't exist.

Of course, this means that They would've had to find time to remove the explosives from the fourth target, whatever it was. In the middle of a nationwide terror alert. Amazing that the fact that their plan only 75% succeeded, yet didn't expose them in some way, and the only plane the passengers rebelled on was the one where the cyanide gas cans malfunctioned. Or maybe they managed to fake the "let's roll" call in real-time.

The GOIRPC confims there was intent to kill Americans. UBL did not say he or any terrorists would kill themselves on a plane crashing into buildings.

If person A threatens person B, and person B dies, and person A admits to the crime, and all of A's friends back him up...

Yes, the FDR data confirms there was a plane hitting its target, and supports the Gassed Occupants (crew, passengers and duped hijackers) In Remote Controlled Plane (GOIRPC) theory. Glad you mentioned it.

It also supports the OS just as well.

 

[Sabretooth]

Excellent question. Thanks for additional proof of the GOIRPC theory. Yes, the hijackers were doing a standard hijacking, including stabbing. Betty's talk was at 8:18:47 and was 4.5 minutes long. http://www.mishalov.com/911_ong.mp3

4.5 minutes from 8:18 would be about 8:23, plenty of time for gassing everyone, before Flight 11 impacted WTC at 8:46:26 am. Her call was allegedly 1620 seconds (27 minutes), but not independently verified. This would be disinfo to hide the gassing. We are looking for actual recordings within 15 minutes of any building crash that don't sound faked.

The GOIRCP theory proposes an option for Flight 93, that the gassing mechanism malfunctioned. It was no longer needed for the false flag op. It was detonated by remote control, shot down, or passengers rallied against the hijackers.


The GOIRPC confims there was intent to kill Americans. UBL did not say he or any terrorists would kill themselves on a plane crashing into buildings.

Yes, the FDR data confirms there was a plane hitting its target, and supports the Gassed Occupants (crew, passengers and duped hijackers) In Remote Controlled Plane (GOIRPC) theory. Glad you mentioned it.

 

[Clayton Moore]

Here's a question for Major Tom. The trusters say the maneuver to hit the Pentagon at over 500 MPH was not really that difficult. Can you develop a
maneuver/speed/target size comparison using a car?
Think "like a needle in a haystack."

 

[The Big Dog]

Here's a question for Major Tom. The trusters say the maneuver to hit the Pentagon at over 500 MPH was not really that difficult. Can you develop a
maneuver/speed/target size comparison using a car?
Think "like a needle in a haystack."

Hee hee! Hey Clayton, I'm pretty sure I could hit a haystack with a needle!

Bwhahaha!

/and you were patting yourself on the back thinking you were so clever.

 

[000063]

Hee hee! Hey Clayton, I'm pretty sure I could hit a haystack with a needle!

Bwhahaha!

/and you were patting yourself on the back thinking you were so clever.

I always love it when Truthers come up with "clever" comparisons that actually make their position worse.

 

[The Big Dog]

I always love it when Truthers come up with "clever" comparisons that actually make their position worse.

And I'm pretty sure I could hit a needle with a hay stack too!

 

[Andy_Ross]

TruthMakesPeace, Why didn't any of the groundcrew who service the aircraft spot any of the extra equipment fitted to the aircraft?
Do you know what a 'Type Certificate' is and the requirements for Type Certification?
Why do you think the engineers servicing the aircraft wouldn't notice extra unidentified systems added to a Type Certified Aircraft?

 

[Justin39640]

Of course the two 6 ton engines of a plane going over 500 MPH made nary a dent. Yet the nose, of ping pong ball strength in comparison, was durable enough to make it through all that section's E, D, C rings.

Really?? 70 years after it was built and almost 10 years after the event and you still have no clue how the Pentagon was designed???

I mean, seriously, how can you expect anyone to take you seriously when you don't even get the most obvious details correct?? You just bought a lie and went with it. Never even looked into it. SMH

 

[TruthMakesPeace]

GOIRCP theory explains more than the OCT

It indicates they were stabbing. Doesn't necessarily mean it was "standard".

OK. By "standard hijacking" I mean not a suicide flight, but a hijacking to demand some benefit in return for hostages, such as getting US military bases out of "holy lands" or $1 billion.

So you want 1. "independently verifed" voice transcripts, that 2. "don't sound faked", because the official ones are, of course "disinfo".

It is unfortunate that the Government lies so much, we can't always take their word for things.

You still haven't answered my question. How far would the planes travel in 15--whoops--a little over 8 minutes at the speed they were going, and where would they be at that point?

8 minutes = .13 hours x 400 mph (for example) = 53.3 miles

Hani Hanjur could have been closer, trying to land at DC Airport, when he and his flight got gassed. Remote Control took over, made the big loop, and hit the Pentagon.

It's C, except for the part where the mechanism didn't exist.

Tanks of cyanide exist. The theory hypothesizes a remote controlled valve to release the gas from the baggage area to spread throughout the plane. It is possible technology. Remember, NASA can remote control robotic surveyors on Mars.

Of course, this means that They would've had to find time to remove the explosives from the fourth target, whatever it was.

If the target of Flight 93 was WTC Building 7, they just pulled it. There was another flight 43 that did not take off due to mechanical problems, which may have been intended for Building 7. Flight 93 could have been planed to be the "1 victory" and had no target, unless Flight 77 missed the Pentagon.

Amazing that the fact that their plan only 75% succeeded

The script writers for 9/11 could have put in a victory to show that NORAD is not completely clueless.

If person A threatens person B, and person B dies, and person A admits to the crime, and all of A's friends back him up...

A's friends could be plants, part of the script.

It also supports the OS just as well.

There are holes in the Official Story that don't make sense, such as the smaller than expected holes in the Pentagon, North of Citgo, near free fall collapse of WTC 7, and why 19 guys would kill themselves for no benefit. The GOIRCP theory provides an answer to these questions, when the Fly Over and other theories do not. www.911Pentagon.org

 

[beachnut]

... . The GOIRCP theory provides an answer to these questions. www.911Pentagon.org

The author of that web page is insane. You can't take one of his insane claims and support it with facts.

Passengers were allowed to make some phone calls, possibly augmented by voice morphed calls, to ensure the planned story got out to the press. http://www.911pentagon.org/

Insane and stupid. Why do failed people make up lies about 911? Is he mentally ill? A moron?


A moron made up lies due to insanity, or what? Why does he hate the United States? How can someone who can't get anything right on 911 produce a web page? You found an idiot, you post his lies out of ignorance. You are a SPAM bot, posting lies without thinking.
The moronic lies you post were debunked years ago. You are over 20 years behind on events and terrorism. You are calling the FBI, the military, FAA, NTSB, American Airlines, local police, DoD personnel, and me a liar out of ignorance and failure to comprehend an event.

 

[jaydeehess]

Most had photos in the background of the 9/11 crashes into the WTC and Pentagon. Oops on you. Did you say they made these videos before, or after they died?

Its called 'green screen' and 'post production'. Concepts that have been around for decades.

Seriously, thanks for the link. It supports the theory that these hijackers were just that, hijackers. Their intent was to demand the US get out of Arabia, in return for the hostages. If they kill them, and themselves, they don't have much negotiating power left. Right?

I do not believe that any Kamikaze ever radioed demands before trying to fly into an Aircraft carrier. Why not?

Because they part of a force that was at war.


Nor has any suicide bomber in Israel ever shouted his demands prior to killing all aboard a bus or in a night club or restaurant.


Al-qada made it known many many times before Sept.11/01 that they considered themselves to be at war with the USA and western countries, that their cause was to rid the "Holy Land" of western invaders and influence and to that end they would attack, whenever, and wherever they could, targets of the countries they considered themselves at war with.

Thus the African Embassies, thus the USS Cole, the WTC towers and the Pentagon, London and Spanish train stations.

Sorry TMP, your premise is shown/demonstrated to be utterly without merit.

 

[TruthMakesPeace]

GOIRCP theory proposes Agents were in ground crew, Enhanced RC

TruthMakesPeace, Why didn't any of the groundcrew who service the aircraft spot any of the extra equipment fitted to the aircraft?

Gassed Occupants (crew, passengers, and duped hijackers) In Remote Controlled Plane theory (GOIRCP) proposes that Agents were in the ground crew, and installed enhanced RC capabilities. Boeing 757s and 767s has basic RC capabilities.
http://www.viewzone.com/911revisited.html

 

[000063]

OK. By "standard hijacking" I mean not a suicide flight, but a hijacking to demand some benefit in return for hostages, such as getting US military bases out of "holy lands" or $1 billion.

Which affects my point not one whit.

It is unfortunate that the Government lies so much, we can't always take their word for things.

You seem to have made the "Prove it." part of my post vanish. Prove it. Odd. Prove it. Don't delete inconvenient bits. Prove it.

8 minutes = .13 hours x 400 mph (for example) = 53.3 miles

Okay, now work out where it would've been in the official story, with the compromised FDR.

Hani Hanjur could have been closer, trying to land at DC Airport, when he and his flight got gassed. Remote Control took over, made the big loop, and hit the Pentagon.

Did DC airport ever confirm the receipt of any demands to land, or was HH just going to plow right in, possibly killing himself? Remember, if you hypothesize that the call was suppressed, you're adding basically everyone in the tower at the time to the conspiracy.

Tanks of cyanide exist. The theory hypothesizes a remote controlled valve to release the gas from the baggage area to spread throughout the plane. It is possible technology. Remember, NASA can remote control robotic surveyors on Mars.

With several minutes delay, yes. There's also the fact that baggage shifts during the flight.

Say, does the vent system of a 767 move air directly between the baggage compartment and the cabin? Why didn't people notice the gas knocking out everyone and mention it in their calls? It's not like gas works instantly.

If the target of Flight 93 was WTC Building 7, they just pulled it. There was another flight 43 that did not take off due to mechanical problems, which may have been intended for Building 7. Flight 93 could have been planed to be the "1 victory" and had no target, unless Flight 77 missed the Pentagon.

Who cared about WTC 7 before 9/11? The only thing there of interest was records They could easily sneak "firemen" in to destroy under cover of evacuation.

The script writers for 9/11 could have put in a victory to show that NORAD is not completely clueless.

Except it wasn't a NORAD victory they cooked up. It was just some random brave people on a plane.

A's friends could be plants, part of the script.

And you've conveniently explained away any evidence contrary to the theory, as usual. A defense attorney for A would have to prove both A and his pals were wrong, whether compromised or incorrect.

There are holes in the Official Story that don't make sense, such as the smaller than expected holes in the Pentagon,

http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/military/news/debunking-911-myths-pentagon

For some reason, the structural engineer, who is apparently In On It, was not widely contradicted by the ton of brainy folks who read PM and should be able to see through his obvious lies.

North of Citgo

http://www.911myths.com/index.php/NoC

near free fall collapse of WTC 7,

Only part of the building, and only for part of it's fall. It's like giving me a ticket for speeding despite the fact that I wasn't actually driving the car.

and why 19 guys would kill themselves for no benefit.

This has been answered several times over. Fanatics kill themselves all the time, as long as they can take their enemy with 'em. Many of them are part of the same organization the OS claims the hijackers are part of.

The GOIRCP theory provides an answer to these questions, when the Fly Over and other theories do not. www.911Pentagon.org

Which doesn't mean that it's actually correct.

 

[000063]

Sorry TMP, your premise is shown/demonstrated to be utterly without merit.

Never stopped 'im before.

 

[000063]

Gassed Occupants (crew, passengers, and duped hijackers) In Remote Controlled Plane theory (GOIRCP) proposes that Agents were in the ground crew, and installed enhanced RC capabilities.

"In"? Not the entire ground crew? Prove it. Because someone is going to talk about the new guy fiddling with the avionics program in the plane that was part of a terrorist attack. Do you know what the NASA program entailed? Prove it. The alterations made to the aircraft? Prove it. How long did it take? Prove it.

I'm betting either my "Prove it"s vanish again, or my post gets ignored.

Boeing 757s and 767s has basic RC capabilities.
http://www.viewzone.com/911revisited.html

No, NASA has made an RC plane out of a Boeing. Flying a plane would not be "basic RC", especially without installing some kind of camera for visual flying.

 

[TJM]

Gassed Occupants (crew, passengers, and duped hijackers) In Remote Controlled Plane theory (GOIRCP) proposes that Agents were in the ground crew, and installed enhanced RC capabilities. Boeing 757s and 767s has basic RC capabilities.
http://www.viewzone.com/911revisited.html

I guess you passed over this part:

A Dissenting View:

I am a retired Airline Captain, currently flying Business Jets. I have an Airline Transport Pilot Rating qualifying me to fly Captain on Boeing 707/720/727/747-400/757/767/777, Lockheed 382 and L-1011, and Dassault 20 and 2000 Aircraft. I have over 28,000 hours, several thousand of which were in command of 757/767's.

There is no provision for a 757/767 to be flown remotely. It can't be done. Period. Nothing disables the Flight or Voice Recorders, etc., except for the pulling of circuit breakers in the cockpit.

The 1.5 G limit built into the flight control system isn't there. The 757/767 does not have electronic flight controls- "fly by wire" and I don't know of any way to design these limits into the system without fly by wire. Some fly by wire aircraft- the Airbus 319/320/330/340 series and some military aircraft, for example- do have these artificial limits. The limits on the 'Busses is about 2.5 G's. Since the airplane is pulling 1 G in straight and level flight there would only be 1/2 G left for manuvering- not much.

The 757/767 cannot- repeat cannot be "programmed" to fly without a Pilot. It has a very good autopilot, capable of manipulating the controls as directed by the ON BOARD Crew in climb, cruise, descent, and- in some cases- landing. It must be disconnected for takeoff.

The 757/767 is hardly a Commuter aircraft. These are the small jets such as the Canadair and Embraer Jets and Turboprops used by Regional Airlines.

Herb Fischer

Figures.