Merged DDWFTTW in a “Real” Wind

[spork]

Nope, Tire power losses is mostly through rolling resistance which he calculated. The rest is through bearing losses and that is minimal on a vehicle like this one.

This whole line of argument is entertaining as hell. Clearly the transmission and prop efficiency were high enough; the rolling resistance and aero drag were low enough, etc. There is documented, witnessed evidence of the cart doing what it was designed to do - in fact more than it was designed to do.

Is the object now to prove that it must not have done it because the engineering was too poor!?

 

[Llyricist]

This whole line of argument is entertaining as hell. Clearly the transmission and prop efficiency were high enough; the rolling resistance and aero drag were low enough, etc. There is documented, witnessed evidence of the cart doing what it was designed to do - in fact more than it was designed to do.

Is the object now to prove that it must not have done it because the engineering was too poor!?

Yeah here I am having to increase the efficiency from conservative assumptions in order to make the math match the real life results.

 

[Dr. Keith]

Is the object now to prove that it must not have done it because the engineering was too poor!?

Well, working on the report takes a lot of time so don't expect a lot of creativity around here until it is done. He's just one man. Or two socks, or whatever.

 

[Dr. Keith]

Yeah here I am having to increase the efficiency from conservative assumptions in order to make the math match the real life results.

Ahh see, there is no way the chain drive is 90% efficient, so you dial it back a bit to show it will work even if the chain drive is 80% efficient and the rest of the cart was less efficient overall, but then that doesn't match the great performance during the test, thus you are a liar.

I really like that line of reasoning a lot.

 

[CORed]

Well, working on the report takes a lot of time so don't expect a lot of creativity around here until it is done. He's just one man. Or two socks, or whatever.

Well yes, and the cart that moves against the treadmill without a prop. It almost works, just a few more tweaks and he'll have it.

 

[humber]

Wrong.

Lie.

JB

It is on record that you claimed the cart was weighed by NALSA. That is a direct lie. I am not going to bother to find it, because history speaks for me.

 

[CORed]

I note that you have understood the difference between a tacking boat and the cart in the wind, so I need not bother to address your remarks at all.

You've got nothing. I know.

 

[humber]

This whole line of argument is entertaining as hell. Clearly the transmission and prop efficiency were high enough; the rolling resistance and aero drag were low enough, etc. There is documented, witnessed evidence of the cart doing what it was designed to do - in fact more than it was designed to do.

Is the object now to prove that it must not have done it because the engineering was too poor!?

The theory is in tatters, and appeals to a flawed trial only serve to expose that. Dr Hepperle, the author of the programme that you or Steve Morris used to "design" the prop, trenchantly disagrees with the barefoot notion of a screwing prop.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Any reasoning that the cart can't work is valid according to the deniers, regardless of what reality has to say. I have seen Harold subtract off the thrust instead of adding it to the forces on the cart to explain why the cart can't go faster than the wind. humber of course agreed.

Now for a serious question to spork. Has there been any work done to make it an UWFTTW cart yet? I know it is not nearly as big of a project as the Blackbird was . I am merely curious since the big argument has been settled long ago.

 

[humber]

Well yes, and the cart that moves against the treadmill without a prop. It almost works, just a few more tweaks and he'll have it.

It works like a charm, and can tow a prop cart.

And you fell very short of backing your assertion with money, whereas I encourage you to do so.

As if there were One True TM Cart. The method of operation has already been spelled out in as simple terms as is possible, so one wonders why you still deny its possible existence, let alone a physical embodiment. Even the glaringly obvious sham of the trial has not dented your faith, so I have no expectation of convincing you, but that won't prevent a wider audience from accepting the facts.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Oooh, humber's serious. He has posted this same claim on Talk Rational. Now we only have to wait until he posts his video.......

tick

tick

tick

tick.

Or perhaps the better sound effect would be that of calendar pages flipping.

 

[humber]

Oooh, humber's serious. He has posted this same claim on Talk Rational. Now we only have to wait until he posts his video.......

tick

tick

tick

tick.

Or perhaps the better sound effect would be that of calendar pages flipping.

I can dial in numbers as LLyricist does, but I am waiting on some validated numbers from NALSA. That is the way it is done, and it all takes time to assemble reams of data into a report that will be read. It is well known that most have a limited enthusiasm for reading long reports, and brevity facilitates redistribution.

The number of posts created by the mere threat, speaks of a house of cards trying to wish away the big bad wolf.

 

[Subduction Zone]

humber, you should not lie about your ability to do any sort of physics. Your total lack of understanding has by demonstrated by you time after time. Sadly your prejudice has made it impossible for you to learn even the most basic of physics.

 

[windgrins]

Counting Sheep!

It also seems that the last few pages have laid to rest humber's "the carteers haven't provided any math" complaint.

You must be dreaming?

WindGrins

 

[CORed]

It works like a charm, and can tow a prop cart.

Now I get it. You're just a little confused about what is towing what.

And you fell very short of backing your assertion with money, whereas I encourage you to do so.

Okay. I will wager $1000 US against your $100.
Send me the cart and the $100, and an engineer that I choose will determine the winner. I will send you $1100 if you win. I will return the cart regardless of the winner.

As if there were One True TM Cart. The method of operation has already been spelled out in as simple terms as is possible, so one wonders why you still deny its possible existence, let alone a physical embodiment. Even the glaringly obvious sham of the trial has not dented your faith, so I have no expectation of convincing you, but that won't prevent a wider audience from accepting the facts.

So far you've got one convert. Good luck.

 

[ThinAirDesigns]

It is on record that you claimed the cart was weighed by NALSA.

Lie

I am not going to bother to find it, ...

That's right you're not.

JB

 

[spork]

Now for a serious question to spork. Has there been any work done to make it an UWFTTW cart yet?

We have a turbine design and the carbon masts to build the turbine blades on. I'm trying to decide how we're going to shape the foam this time. We'd like to have it CNC hot-wire cut, or even CNC machined. Hopefully will know soon.

Oooh, humber's serious. He has posted this same claim on Talk Rational. Now we only have to wait until he posts his video.......

tick

tick

tick

tick.

Or perhaps the better sound effect would be that of calendar pages flipping.

Or maybe the sound of stone eroding in the wind?

 

[humber]

Now I get it. You're just a little confused about what is towing what.

Okay. I will wager $1000 US against your $100.
Send me the cart and the $100, and an engineer that I choose will determine the winner. I will send you $1100 if you win. I will return the cart regardless of the winner.

Oh, sure. What happened to the $100K? It is not worth the effort.
Give it up. You will be shown it when I decide, and at no other time.

 

[humber]

Lie




That's right you're not.

JB

That is quite right, I am not. There are more than enough holes in your claim to sink it for good, and that one is a minnow.
There is the trail data, the TM cart, and the obvious failure of the theory.

 

[69dodge]

I think I read somewhere that the pitch of the Blackbird's propeller can be adjusted on the fly?

How would that affect calculations based on these figures?