Continuation Part 2 - Discussion of the Amanda Knox case

[RoseMontague]

I don't think so since you can see the smears of dirt on the photo and the buildup of dirt in the indentation where the handle joins the blade. It looks like a fairly new knife which has been perfunctorily cleaned, not an old knife which has been heavily used.

Stainless steel knives aren't made by plating chromium on top of steel. Chromium is highly poisonous. They are made with an alloy of chromium and steel and the blade is of the same composition all the way through. If you've noticed discolouration on such knives it's not due to some outer coating wearing off.

The resistance of stainless steel to corrosion is due to the thin passive film covering the surface and is basically chromium monoxide. A breakdown of the film occurs by machining, hand or machine polishing, fabrication work or atmospheric influences, causing some form of localised corrosion such as pitting, crevice corrosion, intergranula corrosion and the modern form of tea-staining.

http://www.metaglo.com.au/technical.htm

 

[Withnail1969]

http://www.metaglo.com.au/technical.htm

I stand corrected on the chromium issue - it seems i was thinking of hexavalent chromium which is highly toxic but the type used in kitchenware is safe.

From the article you posted it does in fact seem possible that in certain cases an outer layer of chromium could be breached resulting in discolouration or rusting, but that's not the case with this knife. It's just dirt.

 

[Matthew Best]

I guess I'm not quite as au fait with the vagaries of dirt on knives as the rest of you, because I can't tell what it is.

 

[Onofarar]

I don't know about US bra design, but I looked at three M&S* bras today, and in all three there is a distinctly separate piece of material on the hook side of the clasp, which is stitched to the back strap. In other words, the material on which the hook is mounted is totally different from the material of the main back strap - it's not merely a loop-and-stitch reinforcement of the back strap. There is a clear stitching joint.

From the photos, Meredith's bra clearly looks to have a similar design. To me, therefore, it's entirely possible that the hook material was torn free from the main back strap at the point of stitching, rather than cut free.

* M&S (Marks & Spencer) is by a massive distance the major retailer of underwear (men's and women's) in the UK.

LJ - I agree. My wife and I were looking for a dres for her for son's upcoming wdding and I had time to check design of 4 USA bra brands - Wacoal, Maidenform, Bali, & Warner. All had the same design you described. The designs with more hooks and larger separate pieces. I think it has to do with the fit - most had an elastic band at the top or bottom except where the bra clasp was.

 

[RoseMontague]

I stand corrected on the chromium issue - it seems i was thinking of hexavalent chromium which is highly toxic but the type used in kitchenware is safe.

From the article you posted it does in fact seem possible that in certain cases an outer layer of chromium could be breached resulting in discolouration or rusting, but that's not the case with this knife. It's just dirt.

There is another possibility other than corrosion/tea-staining and dirt. It appears localized close to the handle and in the enlarged pictures I have viewed it appears the stain on the handle is getting lighter while the luster on the blade is getting darker. Cheap knife. A different kind of "bleeding" may be occurring depending on the makeup of the handle.

 

[Withnail1969]

I guess I'm not quite as au fait with the vagaries of dirt on knives as the rest of you, because I can't tell what it is.

Somebody's wiped the blade but hasn't gone all the way up to the handle. There's also material stuck in the gap between handle and blade.

Last time I checked, rust was brown. That doesn't seem to be the case here.

 

[Alt+F4]

This pretty much confirms my belief that Raf was saying the knife incident happened at the cottage, not his place, and makes the story in his diary seem much less a lie.

Why would he bring that knife to the women's apartment to use when they had knives there already?

RS's father also said that his son's DNA on the bra clasp may be there since the women shared bras. I don't believe anything he says.

 

[Matthew Best]

Somebody's wiped the blade but hasn't gone all the way up to the handle. There's also material stuck in the gap between handle and blade.

You may be right, but as I said, I can't tell. No doubt we will find out in due course.

 

[Withnail1969]

Why would he bring that knife to the women's apartment to use when they had knives there already?

We've been asking that question since the knife was first said to be the murder weapon. Glad you've seen the light.

 

[Alt+F4]

We've been asking that question since the knife was first said to be the murder weapon. Glad you've seen the light.

What I'm saying is that RS's father is lying when he says that the pricking of Meredith (to explain her DNA on the knife) happened in the women's apartment.

 

[RoseMontague]

Somebody's wiped the blade but hasn't gone all the way up to the handle. There's also material stuck in the gap between handle and blade.

Last time I checked, rust was brown. That doesn't seem to be the case here.

There is another possibility other than corrosion/tea-staining and dirt. It appears localized close to the handle and in the enlarged pictures I have viewed it appears the stain on the handle is getting lighter while the luster on the blade is getting darker. Cheap knife. A different kind of "bleeding" may be occurring depending on the makeup of the handle.

Yes. I tend to give this second possibility some credence because of the dark color.

ETA: I am not convinced it is dirt at this point. I don't think that is a safe assumption to make.

 

[Withnail1969]

What I'm saying is that RS's father is lying when he says that the pricking of Meredith (to explain her DNA on the knife) happened in the women's apartment.

You still made the point though. It's ludicrous to imagine them transporting such a crappy knife around Perugia. It never left Raffaele's drawer.

 

[Withnail1969]

Yes. I tend to give this second possibility some credence because of the dark color.

ETA: I am not convinced it is dirt at this point. I don't think that is a safe assumption to make.

It seems clear as day to me, but I'm sure we'll find out.

 

[CDHost]

As for the part I excerpted, is it just me or does it seem a fair number of articles we see from Italian sources seem unnaturally interested in Amanda's and Raffaeles' hair, their clothes and demeanor? It's like everyone wants to be a fashion critic there. Is that just Italian culture, or is it just every other article is from the Italian equivalent of Cosmo?

So I can't blame the Italian too much. If there is some genuine news, I'm sure they would rather cover that. Remember not much actually happened.

I don't know Italy but "True crime" is a female genre in The States, 70/30 in general. Now add in:
-- primarily human interest story about the perps, since nothing much happened unless you are Kercher murder junkie
-- female victim, sex crime angle (much higher percentage of women)

Amanda, the international angle and the prosecutorial misconduct are good if you were aiming for male viewership. But there is no movement there. Think back to true crime coverage in the US like the OJ trial and fashion played a big part. We knew a lot about where Marcia Clark bought her clothes.

As another example, remember the US network most interested in it is Lifetime. I think that's great for AK/RS since Lifetime's brand when it comes to crime is "watch women get screwed over by men" which means its likely that either Rudy or Mignini is going to be the villain. But their old moniker is "television for women" or their new one "the source for women's entertainment". According to the producers they haven't worked out a consistent theory of the events, but you can see they did match Amanda's clothing pretty well.

Always remember the purpose of television is to fill the space between commercials.

 

[RoseMontague]

London Fog

So I can't blame the Italian too much. If there is some genuine news, I'm sure they would rather cover that. Remember not much actually happened.

I don't know Italy but "True crime" is a female genre in The States, 70/30 in general. Now add in:
-- primarily human interest story about the perps, since nothing much happened unless you are Kercher murder junkie
-- female victim, sex crime angle (much higher percentage of women)

Amanda, the international angle and the prosecutorial misconduct are good if you were aiming for male viewership. But there is no movement there. Think back to true crime coverage in the US like the OJ trial and fashion played a big part. We knew a lot about where Marcia Clark bought her clothes.

As another example, remember the US network most interested in it is Lifetime. I think that's great for AK/RS since Lifetime's brand when it comes to crime is "watch women get screwed over by men" which means its likely that either Rudy or Mignini is going to be the villain. But their old moniker is "television for women" or their new one "the source for women's entertainment". According to the producers they haven't worked out a consistent theory of the events, but you can see they did match Amanda's clothing pretty well.

Always remember the purpose of television is to fill the space between commercials.

Gee,
I was going to remark on the fashionable coats. Never mind.

http://www.daylife.com/photo/06VobNfdbhaGU?q=Amanda+Knox

http://www.daylife.com/photo/01Z666t6AMeT3?q=Amanda+Knox

 

[RoseMontague]

Greg Hampikian interview last night (starts about 19 minutes into the podcast).

http://www.mynorthwest.com/?nid=577&a=25064&p=10&n=Northwest

 

[Alt+F4]

Gee,
I was going to remark on the fashionable coats. Never mind.

Well at least she's dropped that horrible, disrespectful "all you need is love" Beatles tee-shirt.

 

[Dan O.]

You still made the point though. It's ludicrous to imagine them transporting such a crappy knife around Perugia. It never left Raffaele's drawer.

If Raffaele had gone to Amanda and Meredith's cottage to prepare a meal for them, it would be reasonable for him to take a knife that he knows the condition of so he doesn't end up facing a drawer full of utensils that can barely cut butter.

The story however would be more credible if there were some more details such as which night this occurred or what was prepared.

 

[Matthew Best]

Well at least she's dropped that horrible, disrespectful "all you need is love" Beatles tee-shirt.

I rather liked that t-shirt, though I'm not sure it was appropriate court wear.

 

[Withnail1969]

If Raffaele had gone to Amanda and Meredith's cottage to prepare a meal for them, it would be reasonable for him to take a knife that he knows the condition of so he doesn't end up facing a drawer full of utensils that can barely cut butter.

The story however would be more credible if there were some more details such as which night this occurred or what was prepared.

I think the knife never left the drawer and if there is any of Meredith's DNA on the knife it's due to contamination - but having seen Meredith's DNA profile with the profile found on the knife overlayed, it looks like Stefanoni did a lot of banging to make that square peg fit the round hole.