USA torturing Bradley Manning

[marplots]

@novice

I wanted to reply, but I was distracted by your nice bust.

 

[johnny karate]

*rimshot*

 

[WildCat]

Why should a person with knowledge of classified information, in jail for sending classified information to wikileaks, be allowed to mingle with the general jail population?

 

[Thunder]

By stealing and releasing classified information, Braddley Manning showed an incredible lack of interest and concern for the safety & security of the American people.

Therefore I could care less about his comfort.

I hope he enjoys his time alone to think about the naughty things he did.

 

[Checkmite]

Why should a person with knowledge of classified information, in jail for sending classified information to wikileaks, be allowed to mingle with the general jail population?

I agree. Allowing SPC Manning access to other prisoners, and visitors especially, is a grave security risk given what he's accused of.

 

[tyr_13]

Why should a person with knowledge of classified information, in jail for sending classified information to wikileaks, be allowed to mingle with the general jail population?

I doubt he memorized much of it and he no longer as access to the computers with that information (although almost everyone else is).

Personally I wouldn't call solitary for this long 'torture' proper, but that doesn't mean I find it acceptable unless there is a strong compelling reason, such as his own protection or the fear of more information being compromised.

 

[Thunder]

but that doesn't mean I find it acceptable unless there is a strong compelling reason, such as his own protection or the fear of more information being compromised.

and there you go.

boy's got a big mouth, so we need to keep him away from other boys.

sorry.

 

[theprestige]

I doubt he memorized much of it and he no longer as access to the computers with that information (although almost everyone else is).

At the very least, he could probably give a detailed seminar on how he did what he did, as well as other security loopholes he may have observed but not exploited. Not to mention the reason he was given a security clearance the first place: His job description required him to learn substantial amounts of classified information. He doesn't have to have memorized the wikileaks data; he could simply tell people the kinds of information he worked with on a typical day at the office.

 

[tyr_13]

At the very least, he could probably give a detailed seminar on how he did what he did, as well as other security loopholes he may have observed but not exploited. Not to mention the reason he was given a security clearance the first place: His job description required him to learn substantial amounts of classified information. He doesn't have to have memorized the wikileaks data; he could simply tell people the kinds of information he worked with on a typical day at the office.

Good points.

How did we get quotes from him if he really is in 'solitary'? Perhaps it is meant in a different way that I imagine it.

 

[thaiboxerken]

Why should a person with knowledge of classified information, in jail for sending classified information to wikileaks, be allowed to mingle with the general jail population?

Because he hasn't been found guilty in a court of law?

 

[Thunder]

Because he hasn't been found guilty in a court of law?

he is not in prison. he is in jail.

we do that if there is a good reason to think the perp. may flee or do more harm.

once he faces trial and is convicted, then he will be sent to prison.

 

[theprestige]

Because he hasn't been found guilty in a court of law?

For once I think Thunder has a valid point. You do realize that suspects are often detained prior to their trial, right? Or did you think the police don't arrest anybody until after they've been proven guilty?

 

[Thunder]

For once I think Thunder has a valid point.

hey now!!!

 

[thaiboxerken]

Detained in a jail is one thing. Being treated poorly and inhumanely is totally another. He could be innocent. Because of this, he should be treated well. This is the reason I think Sheriff Joe in AZ is screwed up in the head.

 

[Thunder]

Detained in a jail is one thing. Being treated poorly and inhumanely is totally another.

is he not being fed?

is he not getting water?

is he too cold...or too warm?

is he being kept in a tiny cell, where he is unable to move around, stand up, or lay down?

is he having loud music blasted at him at all hours?

are they keeping the lights on 24/7?

are they keeping the lights off 24/7?

are they poking him with sharp sticks?

are they assaulting him?

is he being raped?

are they forcing him to watch Loose Change, again and again?



no? then he is just fine. and he will be just fine.

 

[PhantomWolf]

I get the feeling that those that what him out in the general prison population are secrectly hoping that he'll get shanked out there so that they can then blame the US for assassinating him before any trial.

 

[thaiboxerken]

is he not being fed?

is he not getting water?

is he too cold...or too warm?

is he being kept in a tiny cell, where he is unable to move around, stand up, or lay down?

is he having loud music blasted at him at all hours?

are they keeping the lights on 24/7?

are they keeping the lights off 24/7?

are they poking him with sharp sticks?

are they assaulting him?

is he being raped?

are they forcing him to watch Loose Change, again and again?



no? then he is just fine. and he will be just fine.

Allegations are that some of the answers to your questions above are no.

I have to wonder if they've allowed him to have a lawyer.

 

[thaiboxerken]

I get the feeling that those that what him out in the general prison population are secrectly hoping that he'll get shanked out there so that they can then blame the US for assassinating him before any trial.

Oh come on. I doubt the general population would hate him. It's not like he raped a child. He supposedly leaked some "classified" information that amounted to be a bunch of gossip between diplomats.

 

[FattyCatty]

By stealing and releasing classified information, Braddley Manning showed an incredible lack of interest and concern for the safety & security of the American people.

Therefore I could care less about his comfort.

I hope he enjoys his time alone to think about the naughty things he did.

I disagree. I think his actions were an attempt to help America. I also think someone who hasn't been convicted of a crime should not be treated as a criminal. Also, this isn't about his comfort, it is about whether or not he is being tortured.

Got a decent source?

Quotes from Manning were in one of the links in the OP. Didn't you read them?

Sorry they do not say what you think they say. I read one of them. Speculation and hyperbole.

I suggest you read them

In the Salon article,

Interviews with several people directly familiar with the conditions of Manning's detention, ultimately including a Quantico brig official (Lt. Brian Villiard) who confirmed much of what they conveyed, establishes that the accused leaker is subjected to detention conditions likely to create long-term psychological injuries.

The other article had quotes from Manning. How are these "Speculation and hyperbole"?

Never mind why he is in solitary.

Let's just say, for the sake of discussion, that some of you decide that solitary confinement is torture. What would you do about it? Be really angry and snippy with the ones who disagree?

"Some" of us who think that solitary confinement is torture include Charles Dickens and John McCain. Also see the following quote:

In 1890, the United States Supreme Court nearly declared the punishment unconstitutional. It is banned by the Geneva Convention, condemned by the United Nations, and either prohibited or restricted in most civilized countries. <snip>
Save for the death penalty, solitary confinement is the most extreme sanction allowed by law. Like slavery and every other form of institutionalized inhumanity, it should be banished to the dark annals of American history as an example of what happens when our humanity slumbers.

Instead, it is being used as a method of terror and coercion by the United States government upon a citizen who has not even been convicted of a crime.
<snip>
A United Nations probe is now investigating the Bradley case, and the drumbeat of outrage in the blogosphere grows louder every day. Protesters are organizing. Whatever one thinks of Manning and his involvement in the WikiLeaks release of classified information, there can never be any justification for torture.

It is not a bunch of nutcases who think solitary is horrible, it is most civilized people. Another case where the U.S. doesn't come up to standard.

Good points.

How did we get quotes from him if he really is in 'solitary'? Perhaps it is meant in a different way that I imagine it.

A few people are allowed to visit him. Here is some of the information from one of them.

In my visit to see Bradley at the Quantico brig, it became clear that the Pentagon’s public spin from last week sharply contradicts the reality of Bradley Manning’s detainment. In his five months of detention, it has become obvious to me that Manning’s physical and mental well-being are deteriorating. What Manning needs, and what his attorney has already urged, is to have the unnecessary “Prevention of Injury” order lifted that severely restricts his ability to exercise, communicate, and sleep.

My Visits to Manning in Quantico

I am one of the few people allowed to visit Bradley Manning while he is detained in the Quantico brig.

Manning is held in “maximum custody,” the military’s most severe detention policy. Manning is also confined under a longstanding Prevention of Injury (POI) order which limits his social contact, news consumption, ability to exercise, and that places restrictions on his ability to sleep.

Manning has been living under the solitary restrictions of POI for five months despite being cleared by a military psychologist earlier this year, and despite repeated calls from his attorney David Coombs to lift the severely restrictive and isolating order. POI orders are short-term restrictions that are typically implemented when a detainee changes confinement facilities and these orders are lifted after the detainee passes psychological evaluation.
<snip>
Our conversations, which take place in the presence of marines and electronic monitoring equipment, typically revolve around topics in physics, computer science, and philosophy; he recently mentioned that he hopes to one day make use of the GI Bill towards earning a graduate degree in Physics and a bachelors in Political Science. He rarely if ever talks about his conditions in the brig, and it is not unusual for him to shy away from questions about his well-being by changing the subject entirely.

When I arrived at the brig on December 18th I found him to be much more open to lines of inquiry regarding his circumstances, and in a two and a half hour conversation I learned new details about his life in confinement.
<snip>
Manning related to me on December 18 2010 that he is not allowed to view international news during his television period. He mentioned that he might theoretically be able to view local news, but his television period is typically from 7pm – 8pm such that no local news is playing in the Quantico, VA area.

Manning told me explicitly on December 18 2010 that he is not, nor has he ever been, allowed newspapers while in confinement. When I said “The Pentagon has stated that you are allowed newspapers”, his immediate reaction was surprised laughter.
<snip>
Manning stated to me on December 18 2010 that he has not been outside or into the brig yard for either recreation nor exercise in four full weeks. He related that visits to the outdoors have been infrequent and sporadic for the past several months.

Manning related to me on December 18 2010 that he does not receive any substantive exercise and cannot perform even basic exercises in his cell. When told of the Pentagon’s statement that he did indeed receive exercise, Manning’s reply was that he is able to exercise insofar as walking in chains is a form of exercise.
<snip>
Manning related to me on December 19 2010 that his blankets are similar in weight and heft to lead aprons used in X-ray laboratories, and similar in texture to coarse and stiff carpet. He stated explicitly that the blankets are not soft in the least and expressed concern that he had to lie very still at night to avoid receiving carpet burns. The problem of carpet burns was exacerbated, he related, by the stipulation that he must sleep only in his boxer shorts as part of the longstanding POI order. Manning also stated on December 19 2010 that hallway-mounted lights shine through his window at night. This constant illumination is consistent with reports from attorney David Coombs’ blog that marines must visually inspect Manning as he sleeps.

Additionally, see this article:

Interviews with several people directly familiar with the conditions of Manning's detention, ultimately including a Quantico brig official (Lt. Brian Villiard) who confirmed much of what they conveyed, establishes that the accused leaker is subjected to detention conditions likely to create long-term psychological injuries.
Since his arrest in May, Manning has been a model detainee, without any episodes of violence or disciplinary problems. He nonetheless was declared from the start to be a "Maximum Custody Detainee," the highest and most repressive level of military detention, which then became the basis for the series of inhumane measures imposed on him.

From the beginning of his detention, Manning has been held in intensive solitary confinement. For 23 out of 24 hours every day -- for seven straight months and counting -- he sits completely alone in his cell. Even inside his cell, his activities are heavily restricted; he's barred even from exercising and is under constant surveillance to enforce those restrictions. For reasons that appear completely punitive, he's being denied many of the most basic attributes of civilized imprisonment, including even a pillow or sheets for his bed (he is not and never has been on suicide watch). For the one hour per day when he is freed from this isolation, he is barred from accessing any news or current events programs. Lt. Villiard protested that the conditions are not "like jail movies where someone gets thrown into the hole," but confirmed that he is in solitary confinement, entirely alone in his cell except for the one hour per day he is taken out.

 

[thaiboxerken]

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/01/psychologists-protest-treatment-bradley-manning/

I dunno who to believe, a bunch of posters on a forum or trained psychologists.....