Evidence for why we know the New Testament writers told the truth.

[DOC]

We could argue about translations vs original texts, we could argue about how many translations (nine, I think you suggested) makes a vast majority, but you know what? Those are not the important bits.

It makes little difference whether you talk of slaves, bond-servants or servants; what matters is that your book describes and condones the ownership, beating and killing of human beings...

That was the societal norm at the time, Jesus was talking in parables that people could understand. Jesus was serious when he implied in the parable Luke 12: 47 that if you commit wrongs like the servant did in the parable and beat several men and beat several woman you will receive a punishment similar in harshness to getting some lashes.

 

[Fiona]

Well then it is has a monotheistic God that believes in the caste system (and reincarnation) whereas Christianity says all are equal before God, even the servant/slaves that existed in biblical times; and Christianity does not have a dogma of reincarnation.

[sings]The rich man in his castle, the poor man at his gate
God made them high and lowly, and ordered their estate

All things bright and beautiful....[/sings]

 

[kmortis]

Exodus 21:7.

Why does it seem that the atheists on this thread know the Bible better than you do?

'Cause we've read it?

And if a man sell his daughter to be a maidservant, she shall not go out as the menservants do.

When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she shall not go out as the male slaves do.

If a man sells his daughter as a female slave, she is not to go free as the male slaves do.

And when a man selleth his daughter for a handmaid, she doth not go out according to the going out of the men-servants;

וְכִֽי־יִמְכֹּר אִישׁ אֶת־בִּתֹּו לְאָמָה לֹא תֵצֵא כְּצֵאת הָעֲבָדִֽים׃

 

[Mister Earl]

Which Old Testament are you talking about?
Skeptics seem to never give the verse when talking about slaves or anything else that seems derogatory (when compared to our modern post industrial society norms) to us.

Which version do you consider the correct one? I'll give you which quote it is from the same book.

#EDIT: Never mind! I see Kmortis has already beaten me to the punch, so to speak.

 

[Hokulele]

That was the societal norm at the time, Jesus was talking in parables that people could understand. Jesus was serious when he implied in the parable Luke 12: 47 that if you commit wrongs like the servant did in the parable and beat several men and beat several woman you will receive a punishment similar in harshness to getting some lashes.

So Jesus wasn't any more moral than the people of his time. Got it.

 

[Resume]

So Jesus wasn't any more moral than the people of his time. Got it.

Which seems a little weak for the son of a deity, or a deity, or whatever he's alleged to be.

 

[DOC]

Verses are not important.

They are when you are talking about the NT.

There is no literary analysis that would support your contention. For the NT to be true the Natural Laws have to have been suspended. Prove that this is possible.

Easy to do, the alleged Big Bang, and the alleged life from non living materials. Neither of those can be proved in experiments, therefore they don't fit any natural laws we know of.

 

[kmortis]

They are when you are talking about the NT.



Easy to do, the alleged Big Bang, and the alleged life from non living materials. Neither of those can be proved in experiments, therefore they don't fit any natural laws we know of.

So...what's the evidence that the authors of the NT told the truth? You've given a lot of conjecture, opinion and other general discussion, any actual hard evidence?

 

[carlitos]

Favorite translation from Exodus 21 "How to properly sell your daughter to a polygamist" :

7An if cat selz hiz doter 2 b maydservint, she shall not goez out az teh menservintz duhz.8 If she sez 'iz it in yet???' to mastah, who iz maryd too her, then he shall letz her bee redeemd: noez sellin' her to strayng nashun jus cuz he cain't git it up.9 An if he iz maryn her to hiz sun, he shall deal wif her lik if she wuz a doter.10 If he take anotha wyf; her Meow Mix, her furz, an her duty to PENIS GOEZ WHERE???, shall he nawt diminsh.11 If mastah doez nawt gif 'er dese three tings, she goez free, bit wid no moneey$.

 

[DOC]

DOC, if all people are equal before your god, why aren't women allowed to teach or speak in church and why do you believe that a man should be the moral head of the household? That doesn't sound very equal, does it.

God gives the different sexes different callings, but they are still equal before him. I don't complain that God does not allow me to give birth to a baby. And most denominations do allow woman to teach and speak in church.

 

[Hokulele]

God gives the different sexes different callings, but they are still equal before him. I don't complain that God does not allow me to give birth to a baby. And most denominations do allow woman to teach and speak in church.

So you do not have a problem with churches that go against New Testament teachings? Good for you! Many denominations allow homosexuals to be church leaders, and I would hope that you support this decision as well.


Oh, and a "Yay!" for your conflation of ethical and biological realities.

 

[Twiler]

God gives the different sexes different callings, but they are still equal before him. I don't complain that God does not allow me to give birth to a baby. And most denominations do allow woman to teach and speak in church.

And what do you think about that? Do you think they should be allowed to teach and speak in church?

 

[Resume]

God gives the different sexes different callings, but they are still equal before him. I don't complain that God does not allow me to give birth to a baby. And most denominations do allow woman to teach and speak in church.

Reading this, typed in 2010, one can see how silly, demeaning, and retrograde religious beliefs are.

 

[DOC]

So Jesus wasn't any more moral than the people of his time. Got it.

But he was, which is why 4 US presidents flew 7000 miles to visit the former pope's funeral and why we are talking about him 2000 years later.

 

[Resume]

But he was, which is why 4 US presidents flew 7000 miles to visit the former pope's funeral and why we are talking about him 2000 years later.

We're still talking about Confucius and The Golden Rule as well.

 

[Fiona]

??

you got affidavits saying that is why they went?

 

[Agatha]

But he was [more moral than his time], which is why 4 US presidents flew 7000 miles to visit the former pope's funeral and why we are talking about him 2000 years later.

You are a true master of the non-sequitur.

 

[Hokulele]

But he was, which is why 4 US presidents flew 7000 miles to visit the former pope's funeral and why we are talking about him 2000 years later.

Nope. Nothing he introduced was particularly new, and even the regurgitated stuff took a long time to catch on in Christian cultures. His apparent acceptance of cultural practices pretty much made it clear that there was no such advanced morality in any of the teachings attributed to him.

If you are claiming that his teachings were something new, please indicate at least one that does not have an older equivalent in some other culture.

In fact, the only thing I can think of that was particularly unique was his insistence on thoughts being as evil as deeds, which is something that I personally find to be immoral.

 

[DOC]

So...what's the evidence that the authors of the NT told the truth? You've given a lot of conjecture, opinion and other general discussion, any actual hard evidence?

Yes, in post #13104, and I'll bring in some new evidence within 2 weeks.

 

[Zanders]

DOC, please read through this link and try your best to refute what it says. I doubt you can.

http://www.answering-christianity.com/abdullah_smith/historical_errors_in_the_gospels-3.htm