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Ron Paul activist gets sick; suddenly socialized medicine doesn't look so bad

Absent government how would you stop insurance companies from denying coverage, especially for the ever-vague "pre-existing condition?"

This is my question for the libertarian. Do you not care or do you think the magical free market will solve it?

Absent government how would you insure that everyone buy into the system to increase the risk pool and lower costs?

If everyone didn't buy into the system, what would you do with uninsured people who became ill?

See my above response.

I believe it is impossible by definition to have universal healthcare under a libertarian model which ultimately means that it will be unaffordable to some and some will be too stupid or stingy to get it. Those who wish to and can afford coverage, will be ok. However, it is my opinion that a substantial number of people would only be able to afford the most minimal coverage like teeth cleanings or a flu shot. Anything more, they are SOL.
 
I did want to clarify the FSA/HSA thing...

The reason why an FSA is a "use-it-or-lose-it" set-up is because the funds that you plan on putting into it are available to you right away, even if you haven't paid in that amount yet.

This is true of my Healthcare FSA, but not my Dependent Care FSA. I wonder why.
 
30 days is a common rule.

Although at my current job, I was covered from day one, my family was not until I had the paperwork in.

I used to work at a grocery store that was UFCW union and everything. It was 18 months before I qualified for insurance when I started there. They got it down to 6 months after another contract re-negotiation.

My current job it was a year before I qualified. After having decent insurance (for America) for about a year I got a letter saying my company ended its insurance policy, so now I am right back to being uninsured.

I'm now banking on being young and healthy until I can get a better job and hopefully insurance. If I were to incur some health costs I could just move back in with my parents and pay it off with the money now going to rent and other monthly bills I guess.

If I were to get seriously ill (cancer, etc.) i would just put a bullet in brain because there is no way I could afford it, and there is no way I would allow my family to completely bankrupt themselves trying to pay for it.

Best country ever! America! F Yeah!
 
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We're all completely devastated about the news from Prof. Yaffle. (For those not frequenting Community, that news is young healthy husband and father of two little boys, just given but months to live due to stomach cancer.)

However, we're thankful about one thing. Terrible though this is, Mr. Yaffle's treatment isn't going to cost his family a penny. If this had been a US member with this dreadful news, accompanying the sympathy and condolences there would probably have had to be a forum appeal to try to prevent Prof. Yaffle and her children going bankrupt as well.

And you guys fondly imagine people from other countries would like to live in the USA? Not on a bet.

Rolfe.
 
Give it up, Rolfe. On the subject of health care, most people in the US seem about as open to reason as the Pope.
 
We're all completely devastated about the news from Prof. Yaffle. (For those not frequenting Community, that news is young healthy husband and father of two little boys, just given but months to live due to stomach cancer.)

However, we're thankful about one thing. Terrible though this is, Mr. Yaffle's treatment isn't going to cost his family a penny. If this had been a US member with this dreadful news, accompanying the sympathy and condolences there would probably have had to be a forum appeal to try to prevent Prof. Yaffle and her children going bankrupt as well.

And you guys fondly imagine people from other countries would like to live in the USA? Not on a bet.

Rolfe.

[beerina] But the healthcare will be sub-standard since you guys have medieval healthcare systems because they're socialist and videogames and magic and stuff.

I win the thread, socialists are idiots. [/beerina]
 
In my dicussion on this subject with a radio host he said that non-US health care is ok for "stubbed toes" and the like but for real medicine the US was the way to go. Really. He implied that you could not count on quality care from non-US health care and likened it to third world care.
 
The spectre that Mr. Yaffle's situation conjures up, if translated to the USA, is pretty horrible. He's been told that his cancer is terminal, and only palliative care can be offered. I don't know how much this will actually cost, but I do know how much the Yaffle family will have to pay, and that is zero.

How does this work in the USA? Mr. Yaffle is (I believe) in his 30s, and had no health problems until this horror arose. Would he have been insured? If he was in a job offering good insurance, yes. But if he wasn't? If he'd been on one of those hiatuses before insurance comes into effect? If he's been self-employed and knew that healthy 30-something guys don't need insurance?

Would an insurance policy cover this 100% anyway? Or would the whole thing be hedged about with co-pays and deductibles so that a lot had to come out of pocket anyway? I've heard a lot about people who thought they were well-insured being faced with pretty hefty bills regardless.

And all this for nothing but palliative care.

How many US citizens, in a comparable situation, would opt for suicide rather than see their family's resources eaten up like that?

Rolfe.
 
Give it up, Rolfe. On the subject of health care, most people in the US seem about as open to reason as the Pope.

Now, now. I'm heavily in favor of UHC, but was strongly opposed when I first joined this forum. My change of opinion was due, almost entirely, to what I've learned in discussions here.

How does this work in the USA? Mr. Yaffle is (I believe) in his 30s, and had no health problems until this horror arose. Would he have been insured? If he was in a job offering good insurance, yes.

If he or his wife had a decent job, he'd likely be insured.

But if he wasn't? If he'd been on one of those hiatuses before insurance comes into effect? If he's been self-employed and knew that healthy 30-something guys don't need insurance?

They'd be royally screwed. Emergency care wouldn't be denied (but wouldn't be free, either). Other care might be covered in part by Medicaid or charity, but both would probably be many months in the future.

Would an insurance policy cover this 100% anyway? Or would the whole thing be hedged about with co-pays and deductibles so that a lot had to come out of pocket anyway? I've heard a lot about people who thought they were well-insured being faced with pretty hefty bills regardless.

I just went through "open enrollment" for next year's insurance. We have a choice of High-, Standard-, or No-Deductible plans. None of the 3 plans pays more than 80% of hospital services, but there are are yearly out-of- pocket limits. On the "standard deductible" plan, there is a $600 deductible per individual, and a $1,850 individual out-of-pocket limit. So, the total amount that a hypothetical American Mr. Yaffle, with the same plan, would pay is $2,450. Of course, this is the end of the year, and care is likely to extend into next year, so, likely that would be doubled.



Note that this coming year, for the first time -- thanks to "Obamacare" -- the "Lifetime benefit maximum" on my plan summary now says "Unlimited".
 
I've heard people bring up allowing competition across state lines as a way to reduce costs on previous occasions. I don't know if that will reduce costs, but I see no reason why we shouldn't do that.

Your credit card is run from someplace like South Dakota because that state has laws that favor lenders over consumers. Let insurance companies operate over state lines and exactly the same thing will happen. We can count on a few states to compete for insurance industry jobs by lowering consumer protections. The industry will move to those states.
 
Now, now. I'm heavily in favor of UHC, but was strongly opposed when I first joined this forum. My change of opinion was due, almost entirely, to what I've learned in discussions here.

One down, 300 million to go. At this rate, by 100,000,000 AD there should be a majority for UHC.
 
One down, 300 million to go. At this rate, by 100,000,000 AD there should be a majority for UHC.

There's a really sneaky way to convince about half of those people that health care reform is a good idea:

Tell them what's in the bill point by point.

-No discrimination based on pre-existing conditions--awesome
-Kids get to stay on their parents insurance until 27--great idea
-Create more competition in the insurance market--I'm all for that
-Grants to develop cost effective treatments--can't complain about that
-saves hundreds of billions of dollars--who's against that?
-Close the Medicare part D donut hole--about time
...etc.

How do you feel about health care reform?

GODDAMN COMMIE BASTARDS!!!!!
 
If I get cancer I'm just going to commit a crime. In prison they would have to treat it.
 

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