Hello from a non-skeptic

[Olowkow]

Here is Charles giving his account of his visit to the JREF forum (aka "cesspool of skeptics" according to one of the moderators), starting on post #4:

http://www.childpastlives.org/vBulletin/showthread.php?t=18316

ETA: Have to add this quote from one of the admins:

Too funny!

I honestly don't understand how they can in good conscience view this thread as Charles sees it. I actually reread most of it this morning. He was treated with great respect...just a few humorous jabs for comic relief. I found him to be relatively eloquent and bright, and I think many of us thought the effort to help him see what he has never considered might be worth it.

The fact that I don't understand in no way means that all those folks are lying, so what is going on here? It means that there is something that we don't get about this whole subject, and we are not able to communicate effectively with the paranormal claimants. To some extent, it is the skeptic's problem to try to figure out how to do this. Garrette was quite good at it, but in the end even he incurred the wrath of the OP.

I wonder if any of the posters at the past lives forum has secretly tried the Ouija board experiment blindfolded. What harm could ensue?

 

[Robert Oz]

I honestly don't understand how they can in good conscience view this thread as Charles sees it. I actually reread most of it this morning. He was treated with great respect...just a few humorous jabs for comic relief. I found him to be relatively eloquent and bright, and I think many of us thought the effort to help him see what he has never considered might be worth it.

The fact that I don't understand in no way means that all those folks are lying, so what is going on here? It means that there is something that we don't get about this whole subject, and we are not able to communicate effectively with the paranormal claimants. To some extent, it is the skeptic's problem to try to figure out how to do this. Garrette was quite good at it, but in the end even he incurred the wrath of the OP.

I think the feeling is inevitable when you discuss a topic where everyone else not only disagrees with you, but thinks you are being irrational. Believers spend most of their time in groups where everyone just takes assertion as fact and anecdote as evidence and even when they are mingling with the public, I'm sure they get a portion of believers and a portion of skeptics.

They come here and no one (or maybe just one) takes anything they say too seriously. Add in the odd attaking or joking post here and there and I don't find it surprising that it comes across as a full frontal assault. Just the constant influx of posts obviously flustered Charles several times. I'm sure it can be quite overwhelming.

I think the impression would have been very different if Charles was only speaking to one or two of the posters here, but this is a skepticism forum and a paranormal claimant is going to get a lot of feedback from a lot of people whether they want it or not.

So, um, I dunno.

 

[tsig]

Well, that was predictable.

Right down to the skunk defense", throwing up a stink while running away.

 

[Christian Klippel]

Who knows, maybe it's some way to earn them bonus points amongst their believers. Pretty much like some religious people come here to get extra points in their university for the study course. After all, the posts on that other forum surely read that way. Lot's of shoulder patting going on there, for poor Charles walked into the lion's cave and came back unharmed, if not even reinforced in his beliefs.

But then, this is just speculation on my part. But one thing is for sure: reading the thread there makes him an utterly dishonest person in my eyes. To me it seems that he did not come here to gather information, but simply to poke at the people here and then have a laugh at us over there. Quite disgusting.

Greetings,

Chris

 

[tsig]

Charles Stuart or Charles Boden?

They seem to be the same person.

 

[Olowkow]

....To me it seems that he did not come here to gather information, but simply to poke at the people here and then have a laugh at us over there. Quite disgusting.

Difficult to say. I must admit though that his last post did take me by surprise.

 

[Elizabeth I]

A proud, avowed skeptic is nothing but ego relishing in its own stupor.

Relishing in?

 

[Loss Leader]

The amazing thing to me was the posters over there who talk about having to hide or moderate their beliefs while in public, for fear of a confrontation with a skeptic. And then we talk about having to hold our tongues in social settings for fear of upsetting deists or other believers. The difference in perspective is fascinating.

 

[AdMan]

I'm curious to see what the response to Gao's post over there is.

Let's see if it's true that "The people on this site are friendly, understanding, non-judgemental interesting joy to read and hear from bunch of people," as one of their members claimed in that thread.

 

[Olowkow]

Difficult to say. I must admit though that his last post did take me by surprise.

I guess it is not "difficult to say" after all. I just now noticed that the date of this post was 10-12-10, right around the time he began this thread. I mistakenly thought this post, below, was a parting shot!

Hi to both of you,

Thought I'd take a poke at those "skeptics": http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?p=6433813#post6433813Hello from a non-skeptic
Boy, they don't half have an audience, don't they? Far more non-believers than believers around I would say...

 

[Robert Oz]

I have not once claimed here to have any "special powers", so I don't know where that one came from. All that I have are personal experiences and the knowledge of some cases...

You didn't claim it here, but you do claim it:

Here I can say this: I am a medium myself, and I do know what I felt/feel during an incorporation process, enough to know that t is not some kind of "ideomotor mental conditioning reflex", but a very real and tangible phenomena.

http://www.childpastlives.org/vBulletin/showthread.php?p=199865#post199865


I don't want to bully you any further, Charles (if I am indeed bullying you by posting this), but you can prove us all wrong by testing yourself. Surround yourself with good friends and believers so there are only 'good vibes' in the room. If the test is properly controlled, I predict the messages that come through will be gibberish. Until then, you are just another person fooled by the ideomotor effect.

 

[FSM]

Do you consider it rude of me to ask that you provide some evidence that it is a spiritual law that nothing can be divulged spiritually that has not yet been divulged naturally? Who wrote the law?
And what in the name of FSM does it even mean?

Listen, don't bring me into this. I had nothing to do with Diana or with the past lives thing.

 

[FSM]

For the love of spaghetti, I googled his own posted words. Next time don't freakin' recycle.

You are blessed, my son. No worries. I find thoust googling holy in mine eyes.



I smell a new sig line for me::::::

 

[Tommytwonines]

It means that there is something that we don't get about this whole subject, and we are not able to communicate effectively with the paranormal claimants. To some extent, it is the skeptic's problem to try to figure out how to do this.

and

Just the constant influx of posts obviously flustered Charles several times. I'm sure it can be quite overwhelming.

I think the impression would have been very different if Charles was only speaking to one or two of the posters here

One or two posters at a time might alleviate the bullying perceptions.

 

[kerikiwi]

One or two posters at a time might alleviate the bullying perceptions.

It is more a misperception that being challenged and asked to substantiate claims is being bullied.

 

[Olowkow]

You are blessed, my son. No worries. I find thoust googling holy in mine eyes.



I smell a new sig line for me::::::

You might want to give credit where credit is due, it was not King Charles:
http://www.childpastlives.org/vBulletin/showthread.php?t=18316

Charles I just came from that sight and I give you credit for butting heads with them. I had to RUN... too much noise and muck. A proud, avowed skeptic is nothing but ego relishing in its own stupor. Jeepers! I think my blood pressure went up a notch or two in there!

 

[Tommytwonines]

It is more a misperception that being challenged and asked to substantiate claims is being bullied.

Sometimes the "bullying" comes more from the number of challenges (as OZ points out) and not the actual challenge.

 

[Akhenaten]

Welcome aboard, Tommy.

One or two posters at a time might alleviate the bullying perceptions.

Coming to this forum with this attitude . . .

In all honesty, my main purpose in coming into this forum was really just to give a little shake to your all-knowing pedestals.

Thought I'd take a poke at those "skeptics".

Source​

. . . and presenting a load of nonsense about past lives and psyshic predictions while claiming to have lost his former skepticism because of what he claims to be proof of the paranormal is necessarily going to generate a bit of a backlash.

If Charles wants to claim this is bullying then it's just one more thing on an ever-growing list that he's got wrong.

 

[Tommytwonines]

Welcome aboard, Tommy.

Thank you, Akhenaten! (This site has the best avatars, by the way.)

I read through (most of) the thread and do not feel that Charles was bullied. I'm just saying that I can see why he was overwhelmed, and how maybe the sheer volume of responses to his questions did not help "the cause".

 

[Akhenaten]

Thank you, Akhenaten! (This site has the best avatars, by the way.)

I like it. Maybe we should go into business together:

Akhenaten & Zax Custom Avatar Alterations
Everything from A-Z but FLAMES are our specialty.

Sing out if you want one. We're open all hours.

I read through (most of) the thread and do not feel that Charles was bullied. I'm just saying that I can see why he was overwhelmed, and how maybe the sheer volume of responses to his questions did not help "the cause".

It's the nature of the beast, I think, and can't really be helped. I almost feel sorry for the Believers in Stuff™ sometimes, but then I imagine what it would be like if one of us signed up at a place like 'Carol Bowman's Past Life Forum' and the nice warm glow of my cynicism returns.