Merged Continuation - 9/11 CT subforum General Discussion Thread

[femr2]

The funny thing is I'm not sure anyone ever actually measures the exact height of a building. I've been a builder for many years and it's always just a figure derived from the plans. There are way to many variables and frankly (unless your going for a world record)* it's not that important.


* note: even record setters are constantly being re-examined.

I'm not too fussed about exact building height, but exact metrics for roofline down to about floor 20 would be more than useful, even more so per-floor with detail from visible window top and bottom.

I've used the NIST values for now, but even though they had the plans they still state the metrics as approximate.

No idea if that's nearest inch, foot, metre, ...

Very annoying such simple detail is not available.

 

[carlitos]

Determining more accurate scaling metrics for trace data translation from pixels to real-world units.

Becomes increasingly important for underlying scaling to be as accurate as possible as derivations for velocity and acceleration are considered.

I think that you forgot that this activity of yours is pointless. No one of consequence is actually considering "derivations for velocity and acceleration" based on your work.

 

[femr2]

No one of consequence is actually considering "derivations for velocity and acceleration" based on your work.

tfk, W. D. Clinger and others may be slightly offended by that comment.

 

[beachnut]

{snip beachnut disturbing ramble}

Yup...

... edit my post, weak personal attack, against forum rules. Good for you and your outstanding research with no goals or thesis. Keep up the great edits.
Cutting the photo of a 2093 pounds of TNT KE impact is best so you can post your graph showing people being killed and great damage to the WTC tower. Is that in the graph you posted?

From thermite?... The impacts from aircraft on 911 were equal in KE to 1300 and 2093 pounds of TNT. Impressive impacts, ...

Cool, changing my post to suit your distorted view of 911.

The windows in the WTC were not blown out by explsoives set by unknown people; all the damage done the the WTC complex was a result of aircraft impacts.

Here is your best work on 911.

We are asked to believe that 2,966 gallons of jet fuel, essentially kerosene, caused the collapse of the South Tower.

A delusional statements about NIST, a lie.
All the damage to the WTC complex was due to two planes flown my terrorists. If you have evidence otherwise, present it. Good luck

 

[carlitos]

tfk, W. D. Clinger and others may be slightly offended by that comment.

They are big boys. I can live with that.

 

[twinstead]

All NIST is saying is, "here is our best estimate based on our expertise and investigation, and considering all the evidence as a whole. You have a better explanation? Let's hear it"

 

[DGM]

I'm not too fussed about exact building height, but exact metrics for roofline down to about floor 20 would be more than useful, even more so per-floor with detail from visible window top and bottom.

I've used the NIST values for now, but even though they had the plans they still state the metrics as approximate.

No idea if that's nearest inch, foot, metre, ...

Very annoying such simple detail is not available.

I can understand how it would be. Who have you contacted to get copies of the plans? Canter? The fact the original design firm went our of business a long time ago doesn't help.

 

[femr2]

Your edit of my post, a weak personal attack, against forum rules.

Not an attack at all. I responded to the portion appropriate. Your posts are becoming increasingly disturbing. Again, not an attack, no need. An observation on the content of your posts.

Cutting the photo of a 2093 pounds of TNT KE impact...

No, it was an aircraft.

...is best so you can post your graph showing people being killed and great damage to the WTC tower.

Er, disturbing. There are no *people being killed* or *great damage to the WTC tower* in the graph I posted.

Cool, changing my post to suit your distorted view of 911.

Made a direct and relevant response to the quoted portion.

Here is your best work on 911.

Resorting to quote mining of statements nearly two years old is enlightening, as is context. The statement relates to the many folk who still state that *jet fuel melted the steel*, of which, sadly, there are still a few.

 

[beachnut]

...
Resorting to quote mining of statements nearly two years old is enlightening, as is context. The statement relates to the many folk who still state that *jet fuel melted the steel*, of which, sadly, there are still a few.

That is funny. Your web site, your quote, and you can fix it.

Your post, your forum, still up. Looks like you need to revise you woo.
http://femr2.ucoz.com/forum/12-11-1

The 929 cubic feet volume of jet fuel that remained in WTC1 and 793 cubic feet in WTC2 are inconsequential amounts relative to the size of the buildings.

This contention is made even more untennable, as NIST assumes that half of that jet fuel flowed away from the impact floors and did not contribute to the fires that initiated the building collapses.
We are asked to believe that 2,966 gallons of jet fuel, essentially kerosene, caused the collapse of the South Tower. NIST apparently even has difficulty accepting its own conclusion and states “the simulations were insensitive to both the amount and distribution of the jet fuel. Sensitivity studies showed that the amount of fuel spilled in the simulation only influenced the results of the first few minutes; the long-term behavior of the simulated fires was unaffected."

Are you trying to say the fuel, with the heat energy of 315 TONS of TNT is trivial? Good luck fixing your old false implications and woo.

You still have an idiots paper with woo in it posted in your "technical paper" section. http://femr2.ucoz.com/index/0-4

He is not very good at this 911 stuff. Last time I pointed out a woo paper on your web site, you deleted it.

 

[DGM]

The question of the unavailability of the WTC 7 plans has come up many times. From my perspective I would like to know if anyone has ever contacted the owner of the plans, Silverstein Properties? Contacting NIST, FEMA, NYC or anyone else you can think of is useless. They don't own them and they have no right to give them away without the consent of the owner.

Have any interested parties contacted Silverstein?

 

[femr2]

Your post, your forum, still up. Looks like you need to revise you woo.
http://femr2.ucoz.com/forum/12-11-1

The thread is clearer about intent than your assembled quote mine. As it's 18 months old, there might be a few statements I'd update, sure.

Are you trying to say the fuel, with the heat energy of 315 TONS of TNT is trivial? Good luck fixing your old false implications and woo.

The quote is from NIST...

The jet fuel consumption estimate put forth by the FEMA team was used in the model because (1) no
evidence or analysis emerged that significantly altered the FEMA estimate, and (2) the simulations were
insensitive to both the amount and the distribution of the jet fuel. Sensitivity studies showed that the
amount of fuel spilled in the simulation only influenced the results of the first few minutes; the long-term
behavior of the simulated fires was unaffected.

NCSTAR 1-5F

You still have an idiots paper with woo in it posted in your "technical paper" section.

A pseudo-code 1D momentum model is woo ? Interesting. I've built better, but I don't think there's much there to be too critical of.

What is it about my responses to yout posts in the here-and-now that results in you resorting to (pretty petty and feeble) quote mining of external resource about 2 years ago ?

And you accused me of personal attacks ?

Will simply have to resort to reporting further instances.

Have a nice day.

 

[alienentity]

OMG! Beach, you've stumbled upon it! Truthers have been claiming that there were explosions in the towers, but this is conclusive proof! We have our answer....

 

[twinstead]

That's just a minor explosion timed to match the so-called collision of the so-called plane that had no impact on the building whatsoever. WAKE UP!

 

[tfk]

The NIST IB mechanism is physically unreasonable. Doesn't work. For details see the911forum.

A bunch of clueless amateurs convince each other that they have corrected the grievous errors of a bunch of the world's most knowledgeable, most successful structural engineers ...??



Do you guys wear capes with your jammies when mommy puts you to bed?

 

[beachnut]

...
The NIST IB mechanism is physically unreasonable. Doesn't work. For details see the911forum.
... Boring tfk fluff.

Prove it. Does the911forum have goals?

the911forum?, are they published in technical journals?
Are there differential equations, and other tough stuff to prove this?
EOM, are there EOM used to try and back in CD? Those are tough to work with. It must be complicated stuff.

NIST is physically unreasonable and the911forum has failed to publish and expose NIST? This is classic 911 truth delusions.

tfk is boring, he should stick to making statements like, "Doesn't work" and leave out the reality based junk!


Better compile that, "the911forum stuff", and publish! Take action.

 

[cantonear1968]

171 Minutes With Evan Dando and Juliana Hatfield

''....Dando uses both hands to pick up his piece of the World Trade Center. “Open the window,” he commands. “The towers were right there. That morning really ********** me up. The second plane was so close, it went shoom, right over my head.” He pauses and absentmindedly pats the pack of Marlboro Lights in his shirt pocket. “Because I was so close, I know what really happened,” he says. “I shouldn’t get into it, because I’m not a political person, but they were blown up by bombs. They were not taken out by those airplanes. Those fires were going out and then the buildings blew up. What I saw and heard that day was a crime, and not by the people they’re saying. That’s all I’ll say.” He pauses. “I’m worried about our country. But then again I’ve been worried about America my entire life.”

READ MORE:-

http://nymag.com/news/intelligencer/encounter/68806/

“You don’t want to go in there. He’s sort of living in squalor.”

"both damaged—he by drugs..."

"a pile of plastic bags filled with substances"

"telling stories inspired by items he found on the floor"

"and the postcard from his dentist reminding him that his last checkup was January 9, 2003. 'He’s a groovy guy,' Dando says. 'He looks at your teeth and is like, let’s get you high.'"

Seriously? This is who you are going with?

 

[cantonear1968]

Do you guys wear capes with your jammies when mommy puts you to bed?

Now THAT'S funny!!

 

[jaydeehess]

“You don’t want to go in there. He’s sort of living in squalor.”

"both damaged—he by drugs..."

"a pile of plastic bags filled with substances"

"telling stories inspired by items he found on the floor"

"and the postcard from his dentist reminding him that his last checkup was January 9, 2003. 'He’s a groovy guy,' Dando says. 'He looks at your teeth and is like, let’s get you high.'"

Seriously? This is who you are going with?

What's your point? That Dando fits in quite well with many in the 911 conspiracy camp?

That could work for a theme for 911 conspiracy.
" You don't believe there was a giant complex conspiracy by shadowy power brokers? Dude, let's get you high and talk about it some more!"

 

[thecritta]

OMG we have a no plane denier over at pilotsfor911truth the lowest of
the low i wish i could remember my username and password but i cant
be bothered resetting it atm and i went over my 160gb download limit
downloading the NIST cumulus database torrent and i am now limited
to crappy dial up speeds, never again will i make thesame mistake never
i say never if i could log in it would be on and probably have the thread
moved to the debate section it is piss easy debating and de bunking idiotic
no planers i wish rob balsamo would use the magic words that say BANNED i
think i am going to rip my freaken hair out and throw the computer screen out my bedroom window.

No planers are freakin moronic idiots and make me feel like i am about to vomit in my mouth and pass out.

 

[dafydd]

OMG we have a no plane denier over at pilotsfor911truth the lowest of
the low i wish i could remember my username and password but i cant
be bothered resetting it atm and i went over my 160gb download limit
downloading the NIST cumulus database torrent and i am now limited
to crappy dial up speeds, never again will i make thesame mistake never
i say never if i could log in it would be on and probably have the thread
moved to the debate section it is piss easy debating and de bunking idiotic
no planers i wish rob balsamo would use the magic words that say BANNED i
think i am going to rip my freaken hair out and throw the computer screen out my bedroom window.

No planers are freakin moronic idiots and make me feel like i am about to vomit in my mouth and pass out.

My,you said all that without even taking a breath.