Continuation - Discussion of the Amanda Knox case

[Sherlock Holmes]

By the way, here's a far more relevant video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YkKlD-mkvVY

Note that in this case the hanging venetian blind directly behind the glass actually causes the brick to rebound back outside the house, yet no visible pieces of glass are seen falling to the ground. A few larger pieces fall vertically down onto the sill. Now where have I seen that before?

Your jokeing, right?

 

[Charlie Wilkes]

What is the location of the blood spots, how near are they in relation to the shoeprints in the corridor, how many blood spots were there and was there any hypothesis as to caused the blood spots?

Those are good questions for which I don't have the answers, except that two of them were tested - Rep. 119 and Rep. 120. I haven't seen anything that shows their precise location, nor have I seen photos of the drops themselves.

 

[Charlie Wilkes]

This piece of glass caught my eye too and if it didn't occur as someone accidentally stepped on it at some point, what it could look like is glass that broke as it was tossed there as part of the supposed staging. The stagers may have surveyed their handiwork after breaking the window and figured out they needed a bit of glass further in the room to make it look like the rock was thrown from outside (not rocket science, just common sense needed) so picked up a handful and tossed it, perhaps even by picking up an item of clothing and shaking it.

The scenario presented by Fine solves the part that keeps bothering me if I think of the rock being thrown from the outside and that's the gash on the inner blind so close to the inside edge. This seems to only be able to be made if the rock was thrown from the outside and from the left of the window facing the exterior wall, but this is also where the ground slopes away and is the steepest therefore the furthest down from the window making the throw more difficult.

You might want to review some of of the thinking required to reconcile the factual evidence with the verdict.

1. Yes, it's theoretically possible that someone could break a window from the inside and then spread the glass around the room to give the appearance of that a rock was pitched through the window from the outside. But there is no real reason to think that the rock was not, in fact, pitched from the outside.

2. Recent information has shown that a TMB test was performed on the luminol stains and was negative in every case. And so people got busy looking for research to prove that a false negative was possible with TMB.

3. The motivation summarizes the digestive contents. I posted what amounts to conventional thinking as to its significance, and your response was to track down research to show that such evidence can be misleading.

Do you see the pattern here? You're systematically rejecting the most likely explanation for the evidence in favor of a theoretical possibility that favors your bias.

 

[Charlie Wilkes]

______________

Ummm. I think you'll find that most murderers are more dis-inclined to create a public disturbance after the murder, than before.

And you must be confusing me with someone else. I've never suggested than the lovebirds killed with no motive. Maybe the murder was not premeditated, but not without a motive.

///

Dare I ask what motive you think impelled the "lovebirds" to recruit Rudy Guede for an impromptu bloodbath?

 

[Chris C]

_____________________

One of my favorite topics, Chris, if only because ---at first blush--- the car would seem to be highly relevant. Wasn't this parked car sighted by the tow truck driver? The only description I've seen is that it was a "dark car." Why do you say the car was not Raffaele's car?....just because the cops found no trace of Meredith in Raffaele's car?

So........what do you make of this "fact" and why do you think it has been "ignored"? (And please don't tell me that Mignini drives a dark car.)

///

The Tag, the witness who saw the car described a different tag than Sollecito has.

 

[Supernaut]

Hi LondonJohn,
I would like to add something to this theory line that you forgot to mention, for it is kinda bugging me when I think of Rudy Guede being the 1 who stabbed Miss Kercher to her death.

After stabbing her, why the heck would Rudy have gone into the bathroom and grabbed towels to try to "save her", as he has said he did, and the evidence seems to prove?
Hmmm...
RWVBWL

PS-I am starting to really, really wonder if Rudy Guede did stab Meredith Kercher to her death.
But I do know that at some point after she was stabbed, he was inside of her house...

Giving Guede the benefit of the doubt, that he had never killed anyone before, he might have been shocked out of his fugue by the sight of all the blood that was a result of nicking a major artery (arterial blood is bright, bright red).

In fact Guede was quoted as saying (paraphrased) that "all I could see for days afterwards was red".

A scenario something like this; "Oh ****** Oh ****** - don't you worry girl, I'll get some towels, you'll be alright". Then the reality sank in and the worthless wretch fled, leaving her to a certain death..

Edited by LashL: 

To properly mask profanity. Please see Rule 10 re the auto-censor.

 

[Fine]

Dare I ask what motive you think impelled the "lovebirds" to recruit Rudy Guede for an impromptu bloodbath?

___________________

Charlie, you must be confusing me with someone else. I don't believe that Rudy was recruited by the lovebirds to mistreat Meredith. I think the violence began with a flatmate dispute, and Rudy may have been the catalyst...either by having stolen the cash from Meredith's purse or maybe by just being there in the cottage, another "strange man," with Meredith, home alone, without Laura or Filomena, and without the presence of the boys downstairs.

I see no mystery in Rudy being there. It was a holiday. So was the next day, Friday. Either Amanda had invited him or he had invited himself, as the lovebirds met him as they strolled to the cottage. Or, perhaps, he had showed up at the cottage spontaneously. If Rudy had been the catalyst for the dispute, it's easy to see why he would become allied with the lovebirds in the dispute with Meredith. No recruitment necessary.

What is problematical is how the dispute escalated from a garden-variety shouting match---even shoving match---into use of lethal force, then murder. But isn't there the same problem with a LONEWOLF scenario? If Rudy was trapped when Meredith returned home, and so---some say--- needed the keys to exit the front door....wouldn't Meredith just give Rudy the damn keys??? Or, did Meredith insist that Rudy stay while she called the police??? Even in that unlikely situation, Rudy just takes the keys, using whatever force is necessary. No murder here. Or, if you wish, if entering through the window had been such a cake walk, why wouldn't he just leave in the same manner he'd entered? Was Rudy too lazy?

Either way--- a three suspects scenario or a LONEWOLF scenario--- something emotionally turbo-charged and highly unlikely happened that night which led to Meredith's death. We can say of either scenario: it don't make no sense. And it never will.

///

 

[loverofzion]

Those are good questions for which I don't have the answers, except that two of them were tested - Rep. 119 and Rep. 120. I haven't seen anything that shows their precise location, nor have I seen photos of the drops themselves.

Er... I believe the official cause of conviction was murder by stabbing with several knives.
That would go a way in explaining the prsence of blood drops.

 

[Charlie Wilkes]

Giving Guede the benefit of the doubt, that he had never killed anyone before, he might have been shocked out of his fugue by the sight of all the blood that was a result of nicking a major artery (arterial blood is bright, bright red).

In fact Guede was quoted as saying (paraphrased) that "all I could see for days afterwards was red".

A scenario something like this; "Oh ****** Oh ****** - don't you worry girl, I'll get some towels, you'll be alright". Then the reality sank in and the worthless wretch fled, leaving her to a certain death..

I think people put too much stock in Guede's statements. Consider the situation he was in when he was arrested. The police had his fingerprints, in blood, in the room with the body. How can he explain that? He had no choice but to admit he was there, so he came up with a fable about a stranger who burst in and did the murder and he got his fingers bloody by trying to save her. Then, when his lawyers brought him up to speed on the situation, the stranger became Raffaele... oh, and yeah, he heard Amanda's voice in the hall.

The crime scene video and photos show that he moved her a few feet after cutting her throat. He put a pillow under her buttocks and used towels to soak up the blood while he assaulted her sexually.

 

[loverofzion]

I have a question for anyone that can help me, as I do not have some of my notes with me at this moment.

Meredith borrowed a history book - (to read and give back the next morning) - from 1 of her English gal pals and fellow schoolmate the night she was killed.
If I recall correctly, this book was found in her bedroom the next day, no?
If so, that would probably mean she came inside her house and put that book down in her room before the assault happened. So the assault did not take place right as she came to the door or just as she entered the house, correct?

Thanks for the help,
RWVBWL

Rudy's on record saying he heard Meredith say to amanda,. "We got to talk", meaning the assault did not occur immediately upon Meredith arriving home.

 

[loverofzion]

I think people put too much stock in Guede's statements. Consider the situation he was in when he was arrested. The police had his fingerprints, in blood, in the room with the body. How can he explain that? He had no choice but to admit he was there, so he came up with a fable about a stranger who burst in and did the murder and he got his fingers bloody by trying to save her. Then, when his lawyers brought him up to speed on the situation, the stranger became Raffaele... oh, and yeah, he heard Amanda's voice in the hall.

The crime scene video and photos show that he moved her a few feet after cutting her throat. He put a pillow under her buttocks and used towels to soak up the blood while he assaulted her sexually.

Several worthless wretches in fact.

 

[loverofzion]

Giving Guede the benefit of the doubt, that he had never killed anyone before, he might have been shocked out of his fugue by the sight of all the blood that was a result of nicking a major artery (arterial blood is bright, bright red).

In fact Guede was quoted as saying (paraphrased) that "all I could see for days afterwards was red".

A scenario something like this; "Oh ****** Oh ****** - don't you worry girl, I'll get some towels, you'll be alright". Then the reality sank in and the worthless wretch fled, leaving her to a certain death..

Several worthless wretches in fact.

 

[loverofzion]

Same here.

Hendry brings up the possibility of transfer of DNA from the forensics team into play, pointing out numerous other possibilities. The fact that Raffaele had visited there means his DNA is most likely in the flat somewhere and anyone handling an item in one room and then handling the bra clasp may be transferring the DNA.

Hendry seems to be assuming that this team hardly ever changes gloves and just does not address this fully , in my opinion.

"Hardly ever changes gloves" Rose?
Whatever are you talking about?!

There are standards which were proven to have been rigorously adhered to.
There had NEVER been a single sinstance of contamination in this lab.

Stop spouting nonsensical wishful noise and get serious.

 

[Supernaut]

Rudy's on record saying he heard Meredith say to amanda,. "We got to talk", meaning the assault did not occur immediately upon Meredith arriving home.

He was recorded about a week after the murder telling someone that Amanda and Raff weren't at the cottage when someone (not him, no sir-ee) killed Meredith

Then, many months later he (presumably) underwent hypnotic regression and the terrible memories of that night came flooding back. Which was very convenient for Mignini et al, who showed their appreciation by cutting his sentence in half.

 

[Supernaut]

"Hardly ever changes gloves" Rose?
Whatever are you talking about?!

There are standards which were proven to have been rigorously adhered to.
There had NEVER been a single sinstance of contamination in this lab.

Stop spouting nonsensical wishful noise and get serious.

The bra-clasp;

Note that surgical gloves like these absorb the fatty-acids in sweat, which makes them swell and go baggy if they're worn for an extended period - exactly as we see in these images.

You were saying?

 

[Supernaut]

This is nonsense. Rudy wasn't trying to sell the computer or anything else, where's your evidence for that?

The unemployed get housing benefit with which to pay their rent in Italy. It's the same in the UK. He also had a rich foster family.
He'd only been unemployed for a month though. He'd always worked before that (he had worked as gardener, as a barman and had been a carer to a 100 year old lady for a year) and before that, he went to technical college.

Someone (quadra-whatever) asked for an example of your support for Guede.

I realise that you are an "expert" on the case, but perhaps you could indulge us and provide some corroboration for the above claims, not least the hilted bit about his "rich foster family"?

 

[Supernaut]

By the way, here's a far more relevant video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YkKlD-mkvVY

Note that in this case the hanging venetian blind directly behind the glass actually causes the brick to rebound back outside the house, yet no visible pieces of glass are seen falling to the ground. A few larger pieces fall vertically down onto the sill. Now where have I seen that before?

Your jokeing, right?

Excuse me? What is it, specifically, about the video or LJ's comments that leaves you incredulous?

 

[Amazer]

By the way, here's a far more relevant video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YkKlD-mkvVY

Note that in this case the hanging venetian blind directly behind the glass actually causes the brick to rebound back outside the house, yet no visible pieces of glass are seen falling to the ground. A few larger pieces fall vertically down onto the sill. Now where have I seen that before?

I think this video is less relevant then you believe it is. To me it seems that it's the metal bar that is struck first, absorbing almost all of the forward momentum.

Clearly this is at odds with the scenario at Philomena's window, where the rock had to go through the glass pane before impacting the inner shutter.

 

[loverofzion]

Same here.

Hendry brings up the possibility of transfer of DNA from the forensics team into play, pointing out numerous other possibilities. The fact that Raffaele had visited there means his DNA is most likely in the flat somewhere and anyone handling an item in one room and then handling the bra clasp may be transferring the DNA.

Hendry seems to be assuming that this team hardly ever changes gloves and just does not address this fully , in my opinion.

Wait...Raffaelo's DNA flew onto Meredith's bra in Filomena's room?
Which serious forensic scientist ever possibly suggested such a far fetched scenario?

 

[loverofzion]

The bra-clasp;

[qimg]http://i55.tinypic.com/14vigbb.jpg[/qimg] [qimg]http://i56.tinypic.com/aakgf9.jpg[/qimg]

Note that surgical gloves like these absorb the fatty-acids in sweat, which makes them swell and go baggy if they're worn for an extended period - exactly as we see in these images.

You were saying?

And that proves what exactly?