Split Thread SAIC, ARA and 9/11 (split from "All 43 videos...")

[Oystein]

Well posters, lurkers and victims family members,

Ridicule is one thing, namely the first stage in the process of recognition of truth;

In your dream

but Oystein's ignorance of basic principles is quite another.

Everyone who posts here knows that I do not cotton to stupid control tactics sought to be imposed by one poster over another poster, such as attempts to establish a "20 question" game or another kind of "gotcha" game process.

The basic principle im jammo-world is clear:

QUESTIONS MUST NOT BE ANSWERED. EVER.

Let's invoke Kant here: If we think of this "I will not allow any questions and tell you up-front that I will not ever answer questions" as having be arrived at on the basis of a maxime that you could wish to be a general law, then it follows that everybody should apply this maxime at all times, and no progress will ever be made anywhere in the world by anybody, since all questions will go unanswered.

I do not try to manipulate posters in that way. I do not engage in "gotcha" trap tactics and I certainly do not allow myself to be ensnared in them. Why some posters here think they have the right to ask stupid questions

The only stupid question in this thread is your question if anybody will go along with you in your delusional pursuit to find things that are 5 orders of magnitude removed from reality.

and then judge the "rightness" and, almost always, declare the "wrongness" of answers given is beyond me.

Do you deny that questions about the physical properties of objects in the real world have "right" and "wrong" answers?

Did you go to school, jammonius? Did you ever take a physics class? Were you tested in that physics class? Did you every say to your teacher
"I do not try to manipulate students in that way. I do not engage in "gotcha" trap tactics and I certainly do not allow myself to be ensnared in them. Why some teachers here think they have the right to ask stupid questions and then judge the "rightness" and, almost always, declare the "wrongness" of answers given is beyond me."
Did you, jammonius? What grade did you receive in that physics class?

 

[jammonius]

Timely Reminder:

It's the MIC; and, most recently, it is the Security Clearance process...

See: http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/defa...o_congress.pdf

Avoidance mechanisms are transparent. Please cease and desist and post up on the MIC.

Heed Eisenhower's admonition, please.

 

[Oystein]

Timely Reminder:

It's the MIC; and, most recently, it is the Security Clearance process...

...

Timely reminder: It is still basic physics: Energy: Different forms, how much was available, how much was converted.
Because we are talking here about Directed Energy Weapons.

 

[fess]

What is a security clearance?
How is one obtained?
What restrictions does it place on one's otherwise protected freedoms, such as, say, that of free speech?
How can a security clearance be taken away once granted?
What are the various degrees of clearance?
What kind of security clearance does a US president have?
Who has the highest security clearance?

I here call upon our resident "20 questions" aficionado, Oystein, to come up with more queries related, not to the issue of trying to put words into my mouth, but rather, to the issue of what does the security clearance process mean and entail.

You chastise Oystein for asking questions, and then post the above questions? (Insert laughing dog here).
But, at least you finally answered my question as to what branch of the military you were in.
At the very least, if you are going to make claims about the MIC, you could show where you have the slightest experience. So far you have exhibited that you have none.

Do better, or get a job, or just try to be a productive member of society.

 

[excaza]

Clearances really aren't that special.

 

[jammonius]

You chastise Oystein for asking questions, and then post the above questions? (Insert laughing dog here).
But, at least you finally answered my question as to what branch of the military you were in.
At the very least, if you are going to make claims about the MIC, you could show where you have the slightest experience. So far you have exhibited that you have none.

Do better, or get a job, or just try to be a productive member of society.

Fess,

Oh boy, you really missed the point badly, didn't you

Surely you can distinguish between asking questions relating to information and/or subject matter versus playing stupid 20 question games seeking to entrap, ensnare and/or tie down another poster to some sort of dumb 'gotcha' claim, can't you?

I answer a lot of questions and always have and will likely continue to do so, provided they are legitimate questions pertaining to information and not of the gotcha variety.

You do know the difference, right, Fess?

Now, with that in mind, who is in charge of federal security clearance procedures at present? Do you know, or not? Is it more than one person? Is there a hierarchy of such people? Who are some of the players in that field?

Come on posters, let's name some names here and get down to business.

 

[excaza]

How about you provide evidence that a sufficiently powerful orbital DEW existed on 9/11? That's the purpose of this thread.

 

[Disbelief]

jammo, I have 20 questions for you, just so I know what you understand and don't understand:

Here is your issue. You should have limited your list to 19 questions, since Jammy Jerry says he does not play 20 questions. Maybe you could have even gone to 21.

 

[carlitos]

1. Do you understand and agree that the main characteristic of a DEW is that it directs energy^* at its target?

He does not. Until yesterday, he didn't know what an acronym was.

 

[Oystein]

Fess,

Oh boy, you really missed the point badly, didn't you

Surely you can distinguish between asking questions relating to information and/or subject matter...

...such as questions about the Energy in Directed Energy Weapons, or the energy required to bring about the events of 9/11...

...versus playing stupid 20 question games seeking to entrap, ensnare and/or tie down another poster to some sort of dumb 'gotcha' claim...

...such as questions about subject matters totally unrealated to Energy, DEW or 9/11?

..., can't you?

Yes, jammonius, we all can.

I answer a lot of questions and always have and will likely continue to do so, ....

You never answer questions about the Energy in Directed Energy Weapons, or how your claims, assertions, delusions and questions are related to the events of 9/11

provided they are legitimate questions pertaining to information and not of the gotcha variety.

...and that is why your questions are not legitimate., They are immensely loaded with unproven assumptions, and void of any factual basis.

You do know the difference, right, Fess?

Yes, fess knows the difference, so do I, so do all others posters, so do all lurkers. One notable exception here: You, jammonius, don't know which is which.

Now, with that in mind, who is in charge of federal security clearance procedures at present? Do you know, or not? Is it more than one person? Is there a hierarchy of such people? Who are some of the players in that field?

Come on posters, let's name some names here and get down to business.

And how would that inform us about the events of 9/11, or the physics of DEW, office fires, plane crashes or building collapses?

It doesn't.

 

[sheeplesnshills]

Originally Posted by jammonius View Post
I answer a lot of questions and always have and will likely continue to do so, ....

Jammos Mom. "Jammy poppet, are you self abusing in there?"

Jammo "no mumsy........."

Jammos Mom "Liar"

 

[Andy_Ross]

What is a security clearance?

I had clearance to enter the Signals Office on the ship as part of my duties. Only 20 other crew members had that clearance. I also had clearance to enter the 'Special Weapons' (Nuclear Depth Bomb)Magazine as part of my duties. Only 12 other people had that clearance.
In Civvy Streeet I have security clearance to work on various MOD and Revenue sites as part of my work on computer repairs.


How is one obtained?

Well, I have had them granted by my Ships Captain and the Signals Officer, in Civvy Street by my employer making an application through the Police and MOD


What restrictions does it place on one's otherwise protected freedoms, such as, say, that of free speech?

Restrictions that I agreed to were to not confirming the presence or absence of 'Special Weapons' aboard ship. Agreement not to pass on the content of any signals or orders from the Signals Office and in Civvy Street they confirmed that I was who I claimed to be and had no criminal record or associates known to be 'a risk'


How can a security clearance be taken away once granted?

When I left the Ships Company I no longer had access to either the Signals Office or the SWM, this was automatic so it was taken away by default. In Civvy Street clearance is for a specific period of time depending on the project or employment terms.

What are the various degrees of clearance?

NATO
NATO RESTRICTED (NR)
NATO CONFIDENTIAL (NC)
NATO SECRET (NS)
COSMIC TOP SECRET (CTS).

National
Baseline Personnel Security Standard (BPSS)
Enhanced Baseline Standard (EBS)
Counter Terrorist Check (CTC)
Security Check (SC)
Developed Vetting (DV)

What kind of security clearance does a US president have?

Not got a clue, not American.

Who has the highest security clearance?

Where and for what?

In the UK the Prime Minister and the Joint Intelligence Commmittee.

 

[Sabretooth]

Oh boy, you really missed the point badly, didn't you

This coming from the guy who believes that cartoon physics are based in reality.

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6263520&postcount=3547

YES, in the real world, we expect what happens to Wylie Coyote in the ROADRUNNER cartoons as and for a reflection of REALITY.

 

[W.D.Clinger]

It is well understood, but not well acknowledged in this thread, as yet, that the process of compartmented information allows for things to be done inside what is correctly referred to as a "government within the government" or as, simply, the powers that be (TPTB), that exercise dominion and control over much of what happens in the US and over policy pronouncements that few of us know anything about.

Wing attack plan R is among the best-known examples of that phenomenon:

I was under the impression that I was the only one in authority to order the use of nuclear weapons.

That's right, sir, you are the only person authorized to do so. And although I hate to judge before all the facts are in, it's beginning to look like General Ripper exceeded his authority.

However, that tactic will not succeed. We will, by and by, place the focus of this thread where it belongs; namely, upon the MIC.

What about the planes, sir? Surely we must issue the recall code immediately.

I here call upon our resident "20 questions" aficionado, Oystein, to come up with more queries related, not to the issue of trying to put words into my mouth, but rather, to the issue of what does the security clearance process mean and entail.

So you want more queries like this: What level of security clearance gives access to the red telephone?

What happened is...one of our base commanders, he had a sort of...well, he went a little funny in the head. You know, just a little...funny. And, and...he went and did a silly thing...

 

[jammonius]

What is a security clearance?

I had clearance to enter the Signals Office on the ship as part of my duties. Only 20 other crew members had that clearance. I also had clearance to enter the 'Special Weapons' (Nuclear Depth Bomb)Magazine as part of my duties. Only 12 other people had that clearance.
In Civvy Streeet I have security clearance to work on various MOD and Revenue sites as part of my work on computer repairs.


How is one obtained?

Well, I have had them granted by my Ships Captain and the Signals Officer, in Civvy Street by my employer making an application through the Police and MOD


What restrictions does it place on one's otherwise protected freedoms, such as, say, that of free speech?

Restrictions that I agreed to were to not confirming the presence or absence of 'Special Weapons' aboard ship. Agreement not to pass on the content of any signals or orders from the Signals Office and in Civvy Street they confirmed that I was who I claimed to be and had no criminal record or associates known to be 'a risk'


How can a security clearance be taken away once granted?

When I left the Ships Company I no longer had access to either the Signals Office or the SWM, this was automatic so it was taken away by default. In Civvy Street clearance is for a specific period of time depending on the project or employment terms.

What are the various degrees of clearance?

NATO
NATO RESTRICTED (NR)
NATO CONFIDENTIAL (NC)
NATO SECRET (NS)
COSMIC TOP SECRET (CTS).

National
Baseline Personnel Security Standard (BPSS)
Enhanced Baseline Standard (EBS)
Counter Terrorist Check (CTC)
Security Check (SC)
Developed Vetting (DV)

What kind of security clearance does a US president have?

Not got a clue, not American.

Who has the highest security clearance?

Where and for what?

In the UK the Prime Minister and the Joint Intelligence Commmittee.

Well, lo and behold, a substantive response. Thanks Captain. Certainly you've answered some of the questions I posed based on your own personal experience. The quality of the thread is enhanced by what you've posted.

Unfortunately, the matter of fact nature of your responses does not really allow us to extrapolate much from your experience onto the nature and extent of the MIC, let alone the capacity of the MIC to engage in a wide variety of improper acts, including, potentially, direct participation in 9/11. It may be that other questions will have to be asked, or other answers provided in order to achieve some insight into how and in what manner 9/11 was carried out.

Thanks again for your post.

all the best

 

[Oystein]

...
Unfortunately, the matter of fact nature of your responses does not really allow us to extrapolate much from your experience onto the nature and extent of the MIC, let alone the capacity of the MIC to engage in a wide variety of improper acts, including, potentially, direct participation in 9/11. It may be that other questions will have to be asked, or other answers provided in order to achieve some insight into how and in what manner 9/11 was carried out.
...

That is a good post by you, jammonius.

You have noticed that, by asking questions about matters utterly unrelated to 9/11 or the capacities and capabilities (i.e. the physics) of DEW, you are very unlikely to get answers that shed light on these things.

I suggest that you either ask, or answer, questions about issues that deal either with Directed Energy Weapons (specifically focussing on Energy), or facts about 9/11, the WTC, etc.
My 20 questions abobe are actually a good starting point.
If you could only make yourself answering these 20 questions, you would notice that they are all that you need to know everything anyone needs to know about the use of DEW on 9/11. Which is:

No DEW were used to destroy anything on 9/11, because simply no DEW can possibly do these things. The idea that DEW did it is 5 orders of magnitude removed from reality.



Again, to give you an idea what "5 orders of magnitude removed from reality" means, I give you a few examples of ideas that are 5 orders of magnitude removed from reality:
- A snail that crawls from New York City to Boston in 30 minutes
- An olympic champion who lifts the entire colre of WTC1 in one go
- A moon that crashes into the Rocky Montains because its distance to earth is under 2 miles
- A football game played in front of a capacity crowd consisting of the entire population of this planet
- A nice new car for a Dime
- A DEW that dustifies a 110-story skyscraper
And no, jammonius, this is not ridicule. This is all precisely on the same level of sanity.

 

[jammonius]

That is a good post by you, jammonius.

You have noticed that, by asking questions about matters utterly unrelated to 9/11 or the capacities and capabilities (i.e. the physics) of DEW, you are very unlikely to get answers that shed light on these things.

I suggest that you either ask, or answer, questions about issues that deal either with Directed Energy Weapons (specifically focussing on Energy), or facts about 9/11, the WTC, etc.
My 20 questions abobe are actually a good starting point.
If you could only make yourself answering these 20 questions, you would notice that they are all that you need to know everything anyone needs to know about the use of DEW on 9/11. Which is:

No DEW were used to destroy anything on 9/11, because simply no DEW can possibly do these things. The idea that DEW did it is 5 orders of magnitude removed from reality.



Again, to give you an idea what "5 orders of magnitude removed from reality" means, I give you a few examples of ideas that are 5 orders of magnitude removed from reality:
- A snail that crawls from New York City to Boston in 30 minutes
- An olympic champion who lifts the entire colre of WTC1 in one go
- A moon that crashes into the Rocky Montains because its distance to earth is under 2 miles
- A football game played in front of a capacity crowd consisting of the entire population of this planet
- A nice new car for a Dime
- A DEW that dustifies a 110-story skyscraper
And no, jammonius, this is not ridicule. This is all precisely on the same level of sanity.

Oystein,

You haven't got any standing in connection with how I choose to prove claims I make.

I am not making my claims for purposes of satisfying you. You are not the judge of the adequacy of my posts or claims or bases of proof.

I do not know why you refuse to simply post up your claims and your contentions and your proof.

This whole situation is not that difficult to fathom, either in theory or in fact. You are not the judge of the adequacy of my posts, Oystein. I plan on not answering any question of yours that has any possibility, direct, indirect, near, far, remote or up close that allows you to assess whether something I have claimed is either right, wrong or indifferent.

Do you get it yet?

If you want to make a claim about my posts then do so directly. You will not be permitted to make claims about what I post via the process of asking me questions that you get to assess or judge the sufficiency of.

I am not obliged to answer questions you pose and I do not like the way you ask questions. Your posts are boring, counterproductive, insipid and lame as far as I am concerned. If you can, do better.

I will not ever take a test or quiz of any type, kind or degree posed by you.

all the best

 

[W.D.Clinger]

This whole situation is not that difficult to fathom, either in theory or in fact. You are not the judge of the adequacy of my posts, Oystein. I plan on not answering any question of yours that has any possibility, direct, indirect, near, far, remote or up close that allows you to assess whether something I have claimed is either right, wrong or indifferent.

Well I've been to one world's fair, a picnic, and a rodeo, and that's the stupidest thing I ever heard come over a set of earphones.

 

[Andy_Ross]

I plan on not answering any question of yours that has any possibility, direct, indirect, near, far, remote or up close that allows you to assess whether something I have claimed is either right, wrong or indifferent.

So what is the point of your posting anything if we can't question you?

 

[Oystein]

Oystein,

You haven't got any standing in connection with how I choose to prove claims I make.

I am not making my claims for purposes of satisfying you. You are not the judge of the adequacy of my posts or claims or bases of proof.

We all are judges of that, jammo. Except for these "bases of proof". You have not provided any bases of proof that could be judged.

I do not know why you refuse to simply post up your claims and your contentions and your proof.

You are a liar, jammonius. You know my claims very well, and you have responded to those posts that contain the proof.
Again, in case you missed it:
- Claim: The chemical energy contained in jet fuel, and the potential gravitational energy contained in each of the twintowers are all on the order of magnitude of 10¹¹ Joules. Proof has been posted in this thread
- Claim: The most advanced high-energy DEW under development today, such as the COIL, the THEL or the ADS, have a power on the order of magnitude of 1MW and can fire on the order of a few seconds. They thus can direct an amount of energy on the order of magnitude of 10⁶ Joules. They can at most melt a few ounces of steel. You have yourself posted up as proof images of the COIL doing just that: melting a bit of metal.
- Claim: Your delusions of DEW are 5 orders of magnitude removed from reality. This follows from the preceding proven claims: Weak gravity brings 100.000 times as much energy to the field as the most advanced DEW.

This whole situation is not that difficult to fathom, either in theory or in fact.

Corrrrrect. Very easy to fathom in fact. And in theory. And that is why....

You are not the judge of the adequacy of my posts, Oystein.

...this is wrong: I am the judge of the adequacy of your posts, jammonius. Every poster is. Every lurker is. It is easy to make that judgement: You post up delusions!

I plan on not answering any question of yours that has any possibility, direct, indirect, near, far, remote or up close that allows you to assess whether something I have claimed is either right, wrong or indifferent.

Do you get it yet?

Yes, jammonius, I get it. QUESTIONS MUST NOT BE ANSWERED. EVER.

If you want to make a claim about my posts then do so directly.

I'll gladly do so:

Your ideas about DEW are 5 orders removed from reality.
There is no point in following your line of inquiry for this reason.
If you don't start to address the inevitable question of Energy and assess the physical properties of DEW, you will never find out what the MIC has in store there. You will die a dumb and blind man with regards to DEW and 9/11.