Continuation - Discussion of the Amanda Knox case

[Chris C]

_________________________________________________________________

Hi LondonJohn,
Didn't Amanda and Raffaele show the Postal Police what they thought was odd that day?

I wonder if it is also possible that Postal Police Officer Battistelli might have tracked the glass shard from Filomena's room when he went inside Miss Kercher's room to see if she was still alive.

Or wait a sec, he said in court that he didn't go in the room to check on her well being though, didn't he? So I guess that he couldn't have done this.
Hmmm...
RWVBWL

So what are you saying?
I interpret it to mean that either, the person that climbed in the window killed Meredith, or that the Police have lied on the witness stand, or both.

 

[Katody Matrass]

Thats the way I understood Massei when he talked about the broken window. I took it to mean that Knox/Sollecito, staged the broken window to make it look like the rock was thrown from outside.

Its funny how, the body was staged to look like rape. The window was staged to look like the rock was thrown from outside and there was a break in. They used 2 knives instead of 1. Oh wait no they used 1 knife, they just barely stabbed her twice. They cleaned up the scene to make it look like 1 person attacked and killed Meredith. Meredith didn't want to have sex with Rudy, so Amanda jumped in and helped Rudy rape Meredith while Sollecito watched. Then knox killed Meredith and staged every aspect of this crime while Rudy was dancing at a night club.

So basicly from start to finish, the prosecution theory. Knox and Sollecito rushed over to Amanda's/Meredith's apartment. On their way the met up with Rudy. Went into the apartment and all 3 sat down. Knox and Sollecito decide to get stoned and Rudy decides to go rape Meredith while Knox/Sollecito are getting stoned. Meredith fights back and knox rushes in to helps Rudy rape her. Sollecito decides to watch while Rudy has his way. Then suddenly knox decides shes wants to kill meredith and stabs her 2 times, switches knives and has Rudy and Sollecito hold Meredith while Knox cuts her throat. The Rudy takes a crap, drinks some OJ and leaves to go clubbing. Meanwhile Knox and Sollecito are left to stage a crime scene while they are still stoned out of their mind. That is the prosecution theory of how this crime happened.

Of course they didn't do this whole crime at once. They decided to go play basketball in the middle of the night in between rape and murder.

spot on!

 

[katy_did]

I wonder if it is also possible that Postal Police Officer Battistelli might have tracked the glass shard from Filomena's room when he went inside Miss Kercher's room to see if she was still alive.

You know RWVBWL, that's a very good point. After all, he's the only one we know probably went directly from Filomena's room where the broken window was to Meredith's room...

 

[piktor]

piktor, your post accidentally gives the mistaken impression that Steve Moore made that comment about Rudy. He did not. He said that if Amanda and Raffaele were in the room where the murder took place, then they were "hovering."

Mr. Moore's observation applies to Filomena's room.

The scaling intruder had to hover over Filomena's room to leave zero traces of himself as he broke and entered, ransacked and took... nothing.

We are talking ZERO physical evidence of any sort from the scaling intruder in Filomena's room. Is that simply amazing or what.

 

[Katody Matrass]

Hi piktor, I'm sure that if the intruder cut a throat or two, had a bloody fight and handled some dead bodies in that room he would leave enough traces there to satisfy you

 

[RWVBWL]

Originally Posted by Fulcanelli
Ha...it's not as if we've been drowning in cites from you lately, is it?

What exactly is it you'd like citing, Fulcanelli? I provided a quote for the 10:29 phone call Amanda made from the police station, so it can't be that... The testimony from Anna Donnino comes from PMF, more specifically from StewartHome who attended the trial:

Quote:
The next witness, Anna Donnino, another interpreter, testified that she was called at her home around 11:00-11:30pm 4th/5th(?) and asked to come in to the police station as her expertise were needed. She lives about 1/2 hour away and testified that after she arrived she spent the entire night in the same room as AK and acted as the interpreter. It was shortly after she arrived and started working with AK and the police that AK was shown the text message by Lumumba...

Was there anything else? I think it might just be your turn.

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Hi katy_did,
Though I am a bit late for this discussion, I wonder of something and maybe you can help me out.

The date above seems to be wrong, shouldn't this have occurred on the 5th/6th?
Is this a typo, or is the interpreter lying?
I only ask for it often seems to be said that AK and RS are lying if they have the dates and/or times wrong.

This interpreter says that she spent the entire night in the same room as Amanda Knox. But I was under the impression after what I had read from Fulcanelli that Miss Knox, becoming a "suspect" at 1:45am, was put in a jail cell until 5:45am, when she gave the police "her gift".
Was interpreter Anna Donnino with Amanda Knox the entire night in the same room or just until 1:45?
Hmmm...
RWVBWL

 

[piktor]

Hi piktor, I'm sure that if the intruder cut a throat or two, had a bloody fight and handled some dead bodies in that room he would leave enough traces there to satisfy you

It sounds like Mr. Lone Intruder had a
mystical , hovering , limpid entrance
into, through and out Filomena's room.​

 

[el buscador]

piktor sure loves his cartoons.

 

[katy_did]

Hi katy_did,
Though I am a bit late for this discussion, I wonder of something and maybe you can help me out.

The date above seems to be wrong, shouldn't this have occurred on the 5th/6th?
Is this a typo, or is the interpreter lying?
I only ask for it often seems to be said that AK and RS are lying if they have the dates and/or times wrong.

This interpreter says that she spent the entire night in the same room as Amanda Knox. But I was under the impression after what I had read from Fulcanelli that Miss Knox, becoming a "suspect" at 1:45am, was put in a jail cell until 5:45am, when she gave the police "her gift".
Was interpreter Anna Donnino with Amanda Knox the entire night in the same room or just until 1:45?
Hmmm...
RWVBWL

Hey RWVBWL,

With the first point, I think it must just have been an error or typo in the original (it was from a poster on PMF who was in court), since the bit that follows about the text message makes it clear it was the night of 5/6 November that was being referred to.

Very interesting second point, though. Yes, you wouldn't expect the interpreter would've said she spent the 'entire night' with Knox if it was really only a couple hours up until 1:45, then 30 minutes later on. I haven't seen any evidence suggesting, as Fulcanelli said, that nothing happened between 1:45 and 5:45. Personally I think it's completely implausible that Mignini wouldn't have wanted to question Amanda himself soon after he arrived at the police station, so I can't see there having been much of a break between interrogations. Or at any rate, I've seen no evidence to suggest there was.

I'm not sure where Fulcanelli gets his information from (I'm also keen to know where he found out about Amanda 'demanding' to speak to a reluctant Mignini who was dragged grumbling from a warm bed just to speak to her...). We may need to wait until he gets back for him to tell us his source. Or perhaps a little longer.

 

[Chris C]

Mr. Moore's observation applies to Filomena's room.

The scaling intruder had to hover over Filomena's room to leave zero traces of himself as he broke and entered, ransacked and took... nothing.

We are talking ZERO physical evidence of any sort from the scaling intruder in Filomena's room. Is that simply amazing or what.

The real question is how much of Filomena's dna was found in her own room? The only place I have heard they checked outside of the bathrooms or bedroom for dna was in luminol footprints. Since they didn't believe it was a break in, they didn't bother checking for dna. They didn't collect evidence everywhere. They didn't bother collecting control samples.

 

[LondonJohn]

It sounds like Mr. Lone Intruder had a
mystical, hovering, limpid entrance
into, through and out Filomena's room.​

If you wear gloves, you're not going to leave fingerprints, palm prints or DNA.

If you only touch things wearing smooth gloves (e.g. non-uncommon leather gloves), you're not going to leave fibre evidence.

If you have dry, dust-free soles on your shoes, and the floor is also dry and dust-free, you're not going to leave shoeprints.

What would be hard to understand about that?

 

[RWVBWL]

So what are you saying?
I interpret it to mean that either, the person that climbed in the window killed Meredith, or that the Police have lied on the witness stand,(?) or both.

_________________________________________________________________

Hi Chris C,
It seems that Postal Police Officer Battistelli MIGHT NOT have the best memory.
I wonder if he too is 1 who recieved a "medal" for a job "well done"?

From Perugia Shock:
"Paola and Luca saw Battistelli entering the room. He denies.
Paola's testimony at the end is not very effective because she can't say she really sees him in the room, and gets reduced to the sole deduction that the inspector must have entered.
(And who wouldn't enter a room when there's a girl under a duvet?)
But Luca saw him very clearly. And doesn't have any problem in recalling again, quiet and easy, those 3 steps towards Meredith. What's more simple than that? He saw him stepping inside and going to lift the end of the duvet.

Link here:
http://perugia-shock.blogspot.com/2009/02/stranger.html

And this too from Perugia Shock:
Paola and Luca see Battistelli stepping in the room. Paola goes out and Luca stays some seconds just in time to see Battistelli lifting the duvet to see Meredith's face. In that moment Luca turns around and goes to the others in the garden, where the other policeman had already blocked the entrance.
Battistelli said not to have entered the room at all, that he just looks from outside and then goes reach the others in the garden, calls the Police and asks for medical aid and a volante patrol.

As we can see, here we are again: once more Battistelli's version doesn't coincide with the one of boys and girls. If the officer is right, first Amanda and Raffaele are lying about his arrival time, now Luca and Paola are lying about he entering the room or not. What is going on? A conspiracy of all Perugia youth against him? Not only murderers have decided to discredit him, even friends of the friends of the murderers, not involved at all in that crime scene, like Luca and Paola?... Or maybe we should believe boys and girls this time?

Link here:
http://perugia-shock.blogspot.com/2009/02/falling-legends.html

I find it interesting strange to read that this police officer's memory is not that great while testifying in a murder trial that was garnering huge media interest.
Hmmm...
RWVBWL

 

[Pardalis]

Meh, I think I'll just wait for the movie.

 

[LondonJohn]

Meh, I think I'll just wait for the movie.

Yeah, I did that with "Pearl Harbor"

 

[RWVBWL]

Hey RWVBWL,

With the first point, I think it must just have been an error or typo in the original (it was from a poster on PMF who was in court), since the bit that follows about the text message makes it clear it was the night of 5/6 November that was being referred to.

_________________________________________________________________

Hi katy_did,
That's probably true, as I so thought.
BUT it reminds me of when Raffaele Sollecito mentions that he thought Amamda Knox went out to Le Chic to hang out with friends the night Meredith Kercher was murdered, but you and I know that he has to be confusing Halloween night instead with that night, and so that statement is usually construed wrongly, if you get my drift...

Headin' back to the beach,
have a great rest of your day,
RWVBWL

 

[Jungle Jim]

Nevermind

 

[piktor]

If you wear gloves, you're not going to leave fingerprints, palm prints or DNA.

If you only touch things wearing smooth gloves (e.g. non-uncommon leather gloves), you're not going to leave fibre evidence.

If you have dry, dust-free soles on your shoes, and the floor is also dry and dust-free, you're not going to leave shoeprints.

What would be hard to understand about that?

Mr. Intruder has a fastidious, Swiss-watchmaker-like attention to detail as he enters the flat's first bedroom, which he proceeds to ransack- keenly aware of no traces left behind...

The next moment he poops and does not flush, leaves bloody shoe prints on the corridor on his way out, leaves a bloody foot print on the bathmat, etc.

Yes, I'd buy that.

 

[LondonJohn]

Mr. Intruder has a fastidious, Swiss-watchmaker-like attention to detail as he enters the flat's first bedroom, which he proceeds to ransack- keenly aware of no traces left behind...

The next moment he poops and does not flush, leaves bloody shoe prints on the corridor on his way out, leaves a bloody foot print on the bathmat, etc.

Yes, I'd buy that.

Wearing gloves and dry shoes to break into a house through a window is indicative of an extraordinary attention to detail? Really?

As for the rest, what if....what if..... the intruder entered the flat believing that he would be able to look for valuables undisturbed for at least, say, half an hour, given that it was a public holiday and there was nobody at home.

What if he then decided to use the toilet - possibly as a result of having eaten a kebab earlier that evening, possibly as a reaction to the adrenaline rush of the entry into the house, possibly as a subliminal form of territory marking?

What if one of the occupants of the house unexpectedly arrived back while the intruder was sitting on the toilet?

What if the intruder decided not to flush so as not to alert the newly-returned occupant to his presence?

What if the intruder tried to sneak quietly out of the front door, but found that it had been locked shut by the returning occupant?

What if a confrontation between the intruder and the occupant then took place, perhaps triggered by the intruder's demands for a key to be able to unlock the front door?

What if this confrontation then quickly escalated into a violent sexual assault, with the intruder wielding a knife and stabbing the occupant in the neck when she resisted?

What if this new turn of events completely changed the mindset of the intruder? What if he was now far less concerned with undertaking a methodical search of the cottage for valuables and cash? What if he was now chiefly concerned with cleaning his murder victim's blood from himself and getting away from the scene?

What if the intruder had blood on his hands, arms and clothes, and went to the small bathroom to wash himself? What if he removed a shoe to wash his trouser leg, then stepped in a blood/water mix pooling in the bowl of the bidet and then stepped onto the bathmat?

What if he then replaced his shoe(s) and returned to the murder room to take the phones, keys and credit cards? What if he then inadvertently stepped in the victim's blood on his way out, but was too focussed on getting away from the house to stop to clean up any more?

 

[quadraginta]

Mr. Intruder has a fastidious, Swiss-watchmaker-like attention to detail as he enters the flat's first bedroom, which he proceeds to ransack- keenly aware of no traces left behind...

The next moment he poops and does not flush, leaves bloody shoe prints on the corridor on his way out, leaves a bloody foot print on the bathmat, etc.

Yes, I'd buy that.

"A foolish consistency ... etc., etc."

In the KnoxIsInnocentNoMatterWhat Universe all instances of everything are totally isolated in both time and space, and the only legitimate way to evaluate any one thing is with an adamant refusal to concede that it might somehow relate to something else.

 

[Chris C]

Mr. Intruder has a fastidious, Swiss-watchmaker-like attention to detail as he enters the flat's first bedroom, which he proceeds to ransack- keenly aware of no traces left behind...

The next moment he poops and does not flush, leaves bloody shoe prints on the corridor on his way out, leaves a bloody foot print on the bathmat, etc.

Yes, I'd buy that.

Unless you think knox pooped Rudy's feces, then it must have been Rudy who pooped it.