Invitation to Derek Johnson to discuss his ideas

[aggle-rithm]

Because the Lagrangian formulation is a general technique, Derek Johnson's reference to "the Lagrangian energy theory" didn't really make any sense. For example, there doesn't have to be a dissipation term in the Lagrangian; even if there is, there are many different dissipation terms that could appear.

Before we could comment on the particular Lagrangian formulation Derek has in mind, he'd have to state that Lagrangian. Needless to say, he has refused all requests for clarification.

In other words, Derek is using the word "Lagrangian" to impress the gullible.

It reminds me of the Star Trek episode where the computer was having problems computing something, so the operator told it to "implement a recursive algorithm".

Sounds impressive, but...it wouldn't really be that helpful.

 

[TruthersLie]

I've answered them. And I'll answer them again.



He's showing me what looks like bronze or copper alloys. I've melted bronze in a cupola, but mostly steel. He's suggesting otherwise, but the two have a different appearance....dross forms differently, etc.

His problems, and the problem with the premise of the questions is contained in my question #5. Will you be brave and answer it? You better believe it is a setup.



It appears that a lot of people witnessed molten metal, many of these, including firefighters said "molten steel" and seemed sure of using the term. TFK claimed this was lead, tin, and aluminum. Others say glass. USGS has some pretty hot surface temps for a while after the fact, and the underground tunnels are not able to provide the required oxygen (in the air) to stoke the pile like you want to support your "theory". My friend Jason was there in late October, November, December...but did not access ground zero. Very few did, according to hum. Jason is one of the best welders around, and he drove one of the "recycling" trucks. We worked on the Troop Medical Facility on Ft. Hood. Anyway Jason's truck had a GPS, he was issued cell phone, given a strict route to the port, no talking to strangers, he was timed and odometer noted on each end. Jason confirmed to me in 2007 that it was common to hear people talk about the ends of beams, columns, spandrels, W shapes etc glowing/dripping or otherwise being inordinately hot when they were being pulled out. He heard 2nd hand molten steel accounts throughout his time recycling WTC steel from ground 0 to the port. The 246 retained peices (fresh kills) were hand picked, over 99% of the site steel...and 100% of WTC 7 steel was quickly shipped to Boa Steel.

TFK's basis for Al, Sn, Pb is unfounded, and #5 will make this obvious.

Now you buddy.

1. ...How did NIST ever land on "The first APPEARED to be...." (re: WTC 7 steel (so FEMA stated but NIST now denies) sample in FEMA App C)? Explain this please.

2. ...Tell me your hypothesis on the apparent (so you imply) "no energy dissipation" through this WTC 7 column steel.

3. ...How did those WTC 7 floor 13 framing beams both buckle and push the intersecting 79 to 44 girder (with or without shear studs, depending on which NIST report you read) off its seat @ column 79? How exactly?

4. ...Help me to understand why NIST is withholding the WTC 7 contract and ancillary construction docs from Ron Brookman S.E., and is denying his FOIA attempts to procure 3,370 files that include: 1. Remaining input and all results files of the ANSYS (FEA) 16-story Case B collapse initiation model. 2. Break element source code, 3. ANSYS scripts files for the break elements, 4. Custom executable ANSYS file, 5. All spreadsheets and other supporting calculations used to develop floor connection failure modes and capacities, and 6. Connection models....why withhold all this?

5. ...And what were the fractions of WTC 7 metal (example 96% Steel, 2% Aluminum, 1% Copper and so forth)? Doesn't have to be precise, ballpark will make my point very well, thank you.

So again and again.

Can you identify any molten metal by sight alone? Yes or no. It is a simple question. Why do you dodge it?

If you can, great, please do so with the pictures posted by O so we can see it. If you can't, what makes you think that firefighters or any of the spectators at ground zero could?

This leads to another simple question.

Just for ***** and giggles, lets say there was some sort of thermitic (exothermic) reaction occuring. How does it continue to burn for up to 99 days to keep the metal molten? Particularly given the chemsitry of a thermitic reaction? (as it is a fast reaction).

Do you have a new type of chemistry that most of the rest of us know nothing about?

 

[BasqueArch]

Sure, first take #1152/#1172 head on. Go on. Dive right in, and we'll be wallering in Lagrangian energy methods as applied to column buckling in no time.

You will answer these questions then?

(Heat from fire expands floor beams, push girders off seats) + (Three story unbraced column whatever buckling critical load is decreased by a factor of nine) + (Lagrangian Formulation) = Building Fell Down

 

[Disbelief]

#1152/#1172. These have been offered for a while. Who will be first to take the bait, you? Go on....

Bolding mine.

So now you are spelling out that you are trying to play a game of "Gotcha." Why not write a technical paper, have it peer reviewed and published in a reputable journal? What are you afraid of?

 

[carlitos]

1. ...How did NIST ever land on "The first APPEARED to be...." (re: WTC 7 steel (so FEMA stated but NIST now denies) sample in FEMA App C)? Explain this please.

The tendency of truth people to insert their incredulity in the form of parentheticals annoys me to no end. Here we have parentheticals within parentheticals. This is OK for math, but not so much for written English. Writing concise thoughts just seems incompatible with this mindset.

All that said, how could someone on the JREF Forums answer a question about how NIST chose a particular piece of wording in their report? Has Derek Johnson asked someone from NIST? What did they say?

 

[DGM]

Derek reminds me of our other friend, Tony Szamboti!

I wouldn't say that . He reminds me more of our old friend mjd1982 with a slightly smaller vocabulary..

(If you don't know who he is look him up, just don't bump his thread )

 

[dafydd]

Bolding mine.

So now you are spelling out that you are trying to play a game of "Gotcha." Why not write a technical paper, have it peer reviewed and published in a reputable journal? What are you afraid of?

It's all a game to these truthers,never mind the victims and their families.

 

[beachnut]

It reminds me of the Star Trek episode where the computer was having problems computing something, so the operator told it to "implement a recursive algorithm".

Sounds impressive, but...it wouldn't really be that helpful.

Big words to impress those who have not sat though EOM being derived by a PhD. He can't fill out the equations of motion for WTC 7, and he can't support a single thing in his presentations with facts or evidence. He can't derive the equations of motion for WTC 7, he was exposed to this concept, watched a PhD do magic on the caulk-board, and now tries to make it seem he is an engineer who has a secret which is super, only he and 911 truth can see, evidence of a crime on 911. But he can't tells us what it is, who did it, how it was done, or much past making the big claim, the big delusion.

Poor Derek gives Gage's presentation his own personal spin, fighting for our god, "our god wants justice", "our god wants truth". Is he talking about Gage? This is his "Why". "God gives him the strength to do the things", and he regurgitates lies about 911. The reality based facts in his presentation, his motivation to get justice for, "our god". Get those bad guys.

Derek has his talks on you-tube in 10 minute segments, he is on a mission from god, he is not a blues brother, just a faith based, how to get money to travel, scam club invented to fool the gullible, the paranoid conspiracy theorist; Gage's fraud.

The only people Derek fools for long are those who mindlessly post lies, 911 truth groupies, people who call firemen liars, and those who can't think for themselves.

 

[bill smith]

Look everyone! bill made a funny!

Both you and your buddy DJ have been playing dodgeball since this thread opened.

Here's a question for you and your friend: You say there was 20,000,000 lbs of liquid iron hanging around for months...what demolition tool caused this and how much of it?

I Told you yesterday. Do you think that I should keep telling you ? You know ?....like NIST....for reasons of the 'public safety' and all that ?

 

[excaza]

I like your airplane crashing into WTC7 amid a burst of fire and fireworks idea much more entertaining than your idea of a giant couple hundred ton pool of liquid metal hiding in the basement of the WTC that everyone failed to notice.

 

[Sabretooth]

If I were in B of NY, I would hold you to a beer for each post to miss delusion poster of 2010 for 911 truth, the masters of lies on 911.

Who would owe more? We need a virtual way to settle the issue. An on-line virtual meeting place to settle accounts. A kind of, "beachy is buying the beer again", where it shows up by UPS or FedEx; or at Apples-bees, at the bar; the bar keep logs on, Yes sir sabretooth; you are due 4 beers from beachy. Anyone work for corporate food chains? Who can set this up and get some beer from beachy? What are the rules, and who can set up the society of paying up for posting to trolls and people clearly the next phase past delusional on 911.

Beer via Mail? Brilliant! Why didn't I think of that already!

Just no Genny or Natty Light!

/derail

 

[Sabretooth]

I Told you yesterday. Do you think that I should keep telling you ? You know ?....like NIST....for reasons of the 'public safety' and all that ?

Um...you only said that it was a byproduct of nanothermite. You set your sights on the tool, now finish by hashing out the logistics...

How much nanothermite?
Where was it placed? How?
By who?

 

[Oystein]

Tom made a poor word choice: specifically. Specifically is strong enough to indicate a quote...

No. Stop lying.
Now.
Jesus would be revolting in his tomb if he knew how you break his commandments.

 

[bill smith]

I like your airplane crashing into WTC7 amid a burst of fire and fireworks idea much more entertaining than your idea of a giant couple hundred ton pool of liquid metal hiding in the basement of the WTC that everyone failed to notice.

10,000 tons of molten iron bubbling in the basements excaza- not your paltry few hundred tons.

 

[carlitos]

Beer via Mail? Brilliant! Why didn't I think of that already!

Just no Genny or Natty Light!

/derail

A couple of people are trying to do this electronically. Here's one. http://beer2buds.com/

 

[Oystein]

...
In other words, Derek is using the word "Lagrangian" to impress the gullible.

I had no idea what "Lagrangian" meant in that context, however it was immediately clear that the little arrogant kid was playing ******** bingo with us.
You explained it well. Thanks.

What a disgusting little punk that Derek-type is. Dishonest in every post.

 

[Sabretooth]

10,000 tons of molten iron bubbling in the basements excaza- not your paltry few hundred tons.

20 MILLION pounds of liquid hot magma just bubbling away! It was running through the sewers! Eating everything in it's path!

Wait...that was that "Volcano" movie.

Are you still harping on this? Do you not realize how ridiculous this sounds, bill? It really is some funny crap...

 

[bill smith]

Um...you only said that it was a byproduct of nanothermite. You set your sights on the tool, now finish by hashing out the logistics...

How much nanothermite?
Where was it placed? How?
By who?

We all lmow that nanothermite can be painted on. So if it can be painted on it can be pumped.And pumped it was- right inside the hollow core columns. Or rather a selected 30-35% of them. They were melted iin a fast sequence from bottom to top with one melted section dropping down through the hole where the columns underneath had been. All the way down into the basements.

You can see where it went wrong when the steel flowed out the window on the 82nd floor of WTC2. There was presumably a blockage or a delay there and the liquified columns above broke through the fireproofing sheath and flowed across the floor where we saw some of it pour from the window.

Hundreds of tons of nanothermite could have been pumped in broad daylight in the WTC in this way and none of the secretaries there would have noticed a darn thing.

This is just a rough sketch but you see the general idea I guess ?

 

[T.A.M.]

Beer via Mail? Brilliant! Why didn't I think of that already!

Just no Genny or Natty Light!

/derail

You want awesome beer, come to my neck of the woods, where 5% is the average, 7% not all that uncommon, and the taste...mmmmm

TAM

 

[Chuck Guiteau]

Hello Chuck. As near as I can tell this theory of mine absolutely explains a lot of the mechanics of the collapse and conforms to most if not all of the known facts. (Not the known assumptions mind ; The known facts)

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6334844&postcount=999 hyperlink

You will have to follow my posts ftom the one in the hyperlink to see the whole picture. Don't worry, they are clear and fairly short. So would you like to turn that investigator's instinct and decades of experience loose and see if together we cannot set the theory in stone ?

I looked at your post and spend the next 45 minutes back tracking and even checking “find other posts” to make sure I didn’t miss it.
I don’t think you understand the question, Bill. Before any arguments for a CD are relevant, you must first posit a technically viable method for employing a CD to begin with. One that conforms to the facts surrounding the event. Nothing in any of the posts you referred me to remotely qualifies.

Why don’t you try again, and this time simply post it right here?

Can you provide a technically viable method of performing a CD on the World Trade Center that is consistent with all the known facts?
Otherwise,I want my ¾ of an hour back.