Merged E-4B flying around pentagon / Norman Mineta timeline

[MikeW]

Good grief. I'll probably regret this, however:

imo, mineta got to the peoc about 0930. that way when the plane was 50 miles out, it would have taken about 5 mins to make it to the pentagon and then two more mins for the loop de loop. that would make it 0937. then from there, they learn of the explosion and then the crash. by then its 0945 and the order to land all planes is given.

Okay.

Let's assume it's true that the White House evacuation took place at 9:26.

Let's assume no-one outside noticed.

Let's forget the log times. Let's forget issues like Garvey's call to him re: Delta Airlines, before he left the office, reportedly didn't occur until after the Pentagon was hit.

Let's assume that, even though every single source describing the evacuation talks only about people pouring out of the White House and the OEOB, and moving over the Lafayette Park AFTER the Pentagon was hit, they are all wrong, every single one, and it actually happened after this initiation, and it's this that Mineta saw.

So, when did Mineta arrive? 9:26 was the "initiation", it's asking a bit much for him to arrive then, it would take time for "everyone" to be running out. And actually your source says the evacuation was "orderly", which is not what he described.

Still let's be overly generous to you again, and say he did exactly that. He's rolling up at 9:26. Then what?

Then he has to get through security and reach the Situation Room. Flaherty, his Chief of Staff at the DoS said he had trouble getting in, so this didn't happen "just like that". But we'll be kind to you, let's say he's there at 9:28.

Mineta tells us he then spends four or five minutes with Clarke. Let's be generous to you again, say it was 3. He's still there at 9:31.

Then, he must be taken to the PEOC. It's the other side of the building, down a level or two, and Mineta's not a young man. Still, lets be kind to you again, and say he reaches the PEOC at 9:32.

Except, oh dear, Mineta says it's 5 or 6 minutes after his arrival that he hears the conversation between the "young man" and Cheney. This pushes it back to 9:38, around the time the Pentagon was hit.

And, uh-oh, you've missed something: one of the big pieces of evidence supposedly supporting Mineta's original timeline is that Flight 77 was around 50 miles away at about 9:26/ 27.

ETA: yes, here's a chart referenced by achimspok:

So, even if Mineta arrived at the White House as early as 9:26 - something for which there is precisely no supporting evidence - then he was too late to hear the conversation this thread is about.

Still, I have a feeling you won't care, because ultimately you aren't after the truth - you want to prove "inside job". So, what now? Do you ditch the 9:26 evacuation time and say that was wrong, maybe it was 10 minutes earlier?

 

[Senenmut]

So, even if Mineta arrived at the White House as early as 9:26 - something for which there is precisely no supporting evidence - then he was too late to hear the conversation this thread is about.

Still, I have a feeling you won't care, because ultimately you aren't after the truth - you want to prove "inside job". So, what now? Do you ditch the 9:26 evacuation time and say that was wrong, maybe it was 10 minutes earlier?

the truth? i already showed your on page 10 when they initiated the emergency evacuation plan.
the thing is, imo, there were 2 different scenarios being played out about the same time. that is 1. the track that was latter identifed at 77 and then the one mineta describes as the down the river approach. im sure youve read it:
from a mineta interview:
And a little later on, someone said, "Mr. Vice President, there's a plane 50-miles out." So I was talking to Monte Belger, the Deputy Director of the FAA, and I said, "Monte, what do you have 50-miles out?"

He said, "Well, we have a target, bogey, on the radar, but the transponder's been turned off, so we have no identification of this aircraft. We don't know who it is. We don't know what altitude it's at, speed or anything else. All we're doing is watching with the sweep of the radar, the dot moving from position to position."

So then someone came in, the same person came in and said, "Mr. Vice President, it -- the plane's 30-miles out." So I said, "Monte, can you see it, and where is it in relationship to the ground?"

He said, "Well, that's difficult to really determine. I would guess it's somewhere between Great Falls and National Airport, coming what they call the DRA, the down river approach."



one does not call a TSD track a target or bogie? the strangest thing to me is when the e4b actually did a U-turn around the plane that was later thought to be flight 77. it started to head south when 77 was about 20 miles out??? very very strange is ya ask me. they would rather send a prop powered plane to explore instead of a multi-millon dollar jet powered plane with all sorts of electronics!! something smells fishy...

 

[Reheat]

something smells fishy...

I'd suggest you check your panties!

 

[MikeW]

the truth? i already showed your on page 10 when they initiated the emergency evacuation plan.

At 9:26. According to one document, which doesn't match with others.

But as I've just said, even if that were true, it doesn't matter. It doesn't mean Mineta arrived at exactly 9:26 - he says everyone was running out when he arrived, so we know that's vanishingly unlikely - it was later.

And even if I were to be wrong about that, it doesn't matter. Because the truther case for Mineta hearing this conversation is that it occurred at 9:26 or 27. Here's History Commons, for instance:

(9:26 a.m.) September 11, 2001: Cheney Given Updates on Unidentified Flight 77 Heading toward Washington; Says ‘Orders Still Stand’; but Accounts Differ on Timing and Identity of the Plane According to some accounts, Vice President Dick Cheney is in the Presidential Emergency Operations Center (PEOC) below the White House by this time, along with Transportation Secretary Norman Mineta and others. Mineta will recall that, while a suspicious plane is heading toward Washington, an unidentified young man comes in and says to Cheney, “The plane is 50 miles out.” Mineta confers with acting FAA Deputy Administrator Monte Belger, who is at the FAA’s Washington headquarters. Belger says to him: “We’re watching this target on the radar, but the transponder’s been turned off. So we have no identification.” According to Mineta, the young man continues updating the vice president, saying, “The plane is 30 miles out,” and when he gets down to “The plane is 10 miles out,” asks, “Do the orders still stand?” In response, Cheney “whipped his neck around and said, ‘Of course the orders still stand. Have you heard anything to the contrary?’” Mineta will say that, “just by the nature of all the events going on,” he infers that the order being referred to is a shootdown order. Nevertheless, Flight 77 continues on and hits the Pentagon.
http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a927cheneyupated#a927cheneyupated

So, even if we accept your document, and that the evacuation began at 9:26, and even that's when Mineta arrived, his timeline is STILL wrong and he could not have been in the PEOC to hear the full "50 miles out" conversation.

Also, with regard to Sliney bringing the planes down. You would like to pretend that Mineta ordered him to do that, but what does his 9/11 Commission MFR say?

Between the crash of UAL 175 and the impact of American Airlines Flight 77 (AAL 77) into the Pentagon at 9:37:45 EDT (NTSB), and after Sliney issued the National Ground Stop, he was in the process of deciding whether or not he had the authority to issue an order for all aircraft in the NAS to land regardless of destination. Sliney decided he had the authority to do so under his responsibility for the safe air use of the NAS. He issued this order immediately following reports that the Pentagon had been struck.

He had the authority. He issued the order.

But what about Mineta's recollection of events? It turns out Sliney has something to say there, too (my emphasis):

As part of the duties for staff that morning, Schuessler assigned *** to follow him and take on-going notes on his activities that morning: "to
record everything I did. and said.. .1 have asked to see those notes but apparently they are not available, or at least .they have not been made available to me.. .Ellen King told me they were not to be found."

Ellen King was instructed to collect all data related to 9/11 by Schuessler. Schuessler referenced Sliney's inquiry to King, who told him they could not be found. Sliney then asked *** where her notes went, and***Informed him she gave them to King. Upon further questioning regarding these notes, Sliney stated to Commission staff: "I thought it was curious.. .look, I practiced law for twenty-odd years.. .where are the notes? And I couldn't get a straight answer to be honest about it. I said, 'well, why can't I see the notes?'

It may have had something to do with the fact that my recollection of what transpired was not secretary Menetta's recollection of what had
transpired. It may have been the fact that my recollection of what transpired was not the same as Administrator Garvey's recollection of what had transpired in terms of their involvement in the decision making process with respect to the National Ground Stop and the order to land.

I was asked at one point by a nameless face 'why couldn't I just go along with it?'"

Sliney agreed with another Herndon CC assertion that Herndon CC personnel were asked to inaccurately represent the ground stop to match the story that Secretary Menetta ordered the ground stop: "I was asked to go along with a fiction." Sliney agreed with another Herndon CC personnel's assertion that upon analysis Herndon CC's "good story" of the day of 9/11 (Ground Stop and order to land all aircraft regardless of destination) became FAA Headquarter's "bad story", and that is why Herndon CC personnel were told to stop working on their reconstruction of the events of 9/11.

Sliney commented that an analysis of the actions of Herndon CC on 9/11 validates the importance of its creation, but instead what was presented could have been to serve "political vanity".
http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&so...puXiDw&usg=AFQjCNF9WPx8fVgamgMLZMMYMY7GlIUY2g

So agreeing that Mineta ordered the ground stop was being "asked to go along with a fiction". As Joshua Green pointed out in 2002, Mineta didn't even hear about this until at least 15 minutes after it happened:

the Washington Post's veteran transportation reporter Don Phillips let the cat out of the bag. Phillips told his audience he felt it necessary to make a "historical correction," although FAA officials had begged him to maintain the fiction. Phillips proposed, charitably, that Mineta's order was a simple misunderstanding; that the secretary was unaware that "[f]or at least 15 minutes before Mineta's conversation with the FAA, controllers were bringing the planes down ... at the nearest airport."
http://www.slate.com/?id=2063935

If he wasn't talking to the FAA until at least 10:00, then he wasn't hearing any conversations about Flight 77 or anything else, and all your speculation about what "smells fishy" is meaningless.

 

[Andy_Ross]

What does all these pages of Mineta slurry have to do with the E-4B?

 

[MikeW]

What does all these pages of Mineta slurry have to do with the E-4B?

They got moved here, it's kind of a dual-purpose thread I guess (see the new thread name).

 

[funk de fino]

I will repeat as you seem to be avoiding it.

Did Mineta state that Mrs Cheney was with Dick in the PEOC when he arrived?

Yes or no will do.

 

[BCR]

one does not call a TSD track a target or bogie? the strangest thing to me is when the e4b actually did a U-turn around the plane that was later thought to be flight 77. it started to head south when 77 was about 20 miles out??? very very strange is ya ask me. they would rather send a prop powered plane to explore instead of a multi-millon dollar jet powered plane with all sorts of electronics!! something smells fishy...

I know I am not the sharpest pencil in the box, but where did this come from? There were 2 E4B's in play as I recall. The one that circled north of the White house is the one I presume you are talking about, VENUS77. It was NOT sent out to explore as you claim, but was originally on a flight plan to Offutt AFB, taking off from Andrews which would have required a left (westward) turn once past the restricted air space. Once airborne, it was diverted to support Air Force One that was departing from Sarasota.



At some point, the decision was made to divert AF1 away from DC, so VENUS77 took up a holding pattern south of the DC area pending further instructions.

The other E4B (WORD31) departed before the Pentagon was hit and followed its flight plan to Offutt AFB without deviation as best I recall. So I don't understand your statement at all.

 

[Senenmut]

At 9:26. According to one document, which doesn't match with others.

read page 10 again about when they activated the emerency evacuation plan. it was probably before the plane was 50 miles out because he states later on page 10 the plane was 5 minutes away (that is about 40 miles out considerin one would not expect the plane to do a loop de loop before impact.)

But as I've just said, even if that were true, it doesn't matter. It doesn't mean Mineta arrived at exactly 9:26 - he says everyone was running out when he arrived, so we know that's vanishingly unlikely - it was later.

read page 10 again as to when they activated the emergency evacuation.

So, even if we accept your document, and that the evacuation began at 9:26, and even that's when Mineta arrived, his timeline is STILL wrong and he could not have been in the PEOC to hear the full "50 miles out" conversation.

makes more sense that he did hear something about the same time that the pentagon got hit. whether it was the track we know as flight 77 or the down the river track belger describes is the question.

Also, with regard to Sliney bringing the planes down. You would like to pretend that Mineta ordered him to do that, but what does his 9/11 Commission MFR say?

im not sayin mineta ordered him too but it all happened about the same time!! i guess you would like to ignore what sliney and belger had to say here:
sliney- "As to the order to land, that was the product of the men and women in the Command Center who gave me advice on that day, the supervisors and the specialists. We were searching for something more to do, and that was made and decided on, and the impetus for that of course was the crash into the Pentagon when we gave that order."

that order was about 0945

from the belger interview-

Belger learned of the crash into the Pentagon shortly after it happened. He and Garvey got on the phone with Norm Mineta who decided to bring everything down (around 9:45) which was implemented.

So agreeing that Mineta ordered the ground stop was being "asked to go along with a fiction". As Joshua Green pointed out in 2002, Mineta didn't even hear about this until at least 15 minutes after it happened:

are you talking about the ground stop or the land all planes in reggard to mineta not knowing about it until 15 mins later?

If he wasn't talking to the FAA until at least 10:00, then he wasn't hearing any conversations about Flight 77 or anything else, and all your speculation about what "smells fishy" is meaningless.

and you want mineta to be in the peoc alittle after 10?
u] Belger learned of the crash into the Pentagon shortly after it happened. He and Garvey got on the phone with Norm Mineta who decided to bring everything down (around 9:45) which was implemented.

 

[Senenmut]

I know I am not the sharpest pencil in the box, but where did this come from? There were 2 E4B's in play as I recall. The one that circled north of the White house is the one I presume you are talking about, VENUS77. It was NOT sent out to explore as you claim, but was originally on a flight plan to Offutt AFB, taking off from Andrews which would have required a left (westward) turn once past the restricted air space. Once airborne, it was diverted to support Air Force One that was departing from Sarasota.



At some point, the decision was made to divert AF1 away from DC, so VENUS77 took up a holding pattern south of the DC area pending further instructions.

The other E4B (WORD31) departed before the Pentagon was hit and followed its flight plan to Offutt AFB without deviation as best I recall. So I don't understand your statement at all.

im talkin about word31/sword31....
http://www.scribd.com/doc/14354184/...hington-National-Tower-Timeline-of-Events-037

 

[beachnut]

im talkin about word31/sword31....
http://www.scribd.com/doc/14354184/...hington-National-Tower-Timeline-of-Events-037

Do you have a point!

Do you understand flying? Are you a pilot, ATC controller, supervisor, anything to do with flying?

What are your qualifications to comment authoritatively on this subject?

What is your point? How does it support your conspiracy theory on 911; what is your scenario? 8 years, going on 9

 

[MikeW]

read page 10 again about when they activated the emerency evacuation plan. it was probably before the plane was 50 miles out because he states later on page 10 the plane was 5 minutes away (that is about 40 miles out considerin one would not expect the plane to do a loop de loop before impact.)

Irrelevant, and your "probably" is meaningless.

As I said, there are contradictory timelines here. You're just picking the earlier one.

So, you cite a timeline that says at 9:18 Truscott "learned that an aircraft had been identified en-route to the Washington area", that at 9:25 "Truscott suggested that we relocate to the shelter" and "9:26, evacuation initiated" and "Truscott departed en-route to the shelter".

And you ignore the preceding two pages, where Truscott receives a call about an incoming aircraft at 9:43, then said he would initiate the evacuation, then went to the situation room where he met Rice (who says she the burning Pentagon there on TV), then went to the shelter where he found Cheney, then went to the PEOC.

Why is that, Senenmut? Why do you choose the first timeline over the second?

makes more sense that he did hear something about the same time that the pentagon got hit. whether it was the track we know as flight 77 or the down the river track belger describes is the question.

Now you're rewriting what Mineta said even further to try and make it work. If he was wrong about the time, if his track had nothing to do with Flight 77, then why are you clinging to anything he says at all? How can you be sure he isn't talking about the projected track of Flight 93, as we've been saying all the time.

im not sayin mineta ordered him too but it all happened about the same time!! i guess you would like to ignore what sliney and belger had to say here:

Except it didn't happen at the same time. No-one saw an evacuation with "everyone" running out from the White House and the OEOB and moving over to Lafayette Park until after the Pentagon was hit. Mineta saw this when he arrived. Therefore he arrived after the Pentagon was hit. Simple.

And Mineta said Lynne Cheney was there when he arrived. The same collection of documents where you've latched on to this timeline, also includes a detailed description showing she didn't arrive until after the Pentagon was hit. Therefore he also arrived after the Pentagon was hit. Unambiguous. Simple.

"Ignoring" Sliney and Belger?

Sliney, then.

No. I accept your quote from him 100%.

I also accept this quote from him, 100%.

...my recollection of what transpired was not secretary Menetta's recollection of what had transpired. It may have been the fact that my recollection of what transpired was not the same as Administrator Garvey's recollection of what had transpired in terms of their involvement in the decision making process with respect to the National Ground Stop and the order to land.

I was asked at one point by a nameless face 'why couldn't I just go along with it?'"

Sliney agreed with another Herndon CC assertion that Herndon CC personnel were asked to inaccurately represent the ground stop to match the story that Secretary Menetta ordered the ground stop: "I was asked to go along with a fiction." Sliney agreed with another Herndon CC personnel's assertion that upon analysis Herndon CC's "good story" of the day of 9/11 (Ground Stop and order to land all aircraft regardless of destination) became FAA Headquarter's "bad story", and that is why Herndon CC personnel were told to stop working on their reconstruction of the events of 9/11.

Sliney commented that an analysis of the actions of Herndon CC on 9/11 validates the importance of its creation, but instead what was presented could have been to serve "political vanity".
http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&so...puXiDw&usg=AFQjCNF9WPx8fVgamgMLZMMYMY7GlIUY2g

Sliney clearly says it was his decision to ground all the planes. Mineta and Garvey (and Belger as her deputy, I suspect, though not named here) said they were involved. Sliney says his recollection differed from theirs, he was asked to just "go along with it", but "the story that Secretary Menetta ordered the ground stop" was "a fiction".

Re: Belger, either he was a part of maintaining that fiction, or he remembered the 9:45 time incorrectly. Either way, Mineta's own timeline gives us many more convincing reasons to show that was incorrect. And there's confirmation from, say, Eric Edelman, who relates what sounds like Mineta's story, only makes it clear this is about Flight 93:

Q I mean, just to (inaudible), the Pentagon is hit at about 9:39 a.m. Flight 93 made its turn out there at about a half an hour before it hit, so just about as the Pentagon is hit, the other plane makes its turn. So you have -- there's about a 20 to 25-minute gap in there. And you are hearing what?

MR. EDELMAN: We are hearing that it has turned, and it's headed our way, coming in our direction. That it had been hijacked.

Q Who conveys that to you? Do you remember how you heard that?

MR. EDELMAN: I believe it was from Secretary Mineta.

Q Do you remember how he, --

MR. EDELMAN: I think he was getting it from the FAA command center, that the plane had been hijacked; we knew that it was headed our way.

Q But do you remember anything about --

MR. EDELMAN: I remember someone saying it was 15 minutes out, 10 minutes out -- I can't remember exactly. (Inaudible) airspace area.
http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&so...vcCYBg&usg=AFQjCNHIm0Z4Mjhlyj0sVNSoVEO0ct5JXQ

 

[BCR]

im talkin about word31/sword31....

Then I really don't understand. He took off and followed his flight plan.

 

[Senenmut]

Then I really don't understand. He took off and followed his flight plan.

maybe ya missed it when they issused heading 190 then 360..

 

[thecritta]

So where the four E-4B's flying around the skies on 9/11 supposed to be
part of a wargames exercise is that right?

 

[Senenmut]

Irrelevant, and your "probably" is meaningless.

meaningless?? if he was talking about the track 77 made, do ya think they knew he was going to do a 3 min loop de loop. that would have put him at least 8 mins out.

As I said, there are contradictory timelines here. You're just picking the earlier one.

be sure to thread this information contained in this new document into your webpage!!

So, you cite a timeline that says at 9:18 Truscott "learned that an aircraft had been identified en-route to the Washington area", that at 9:25 "Truscott suggested that we relocate to the shelter" and "9:26, evacuation initiated" and "Truscott departed en-route to the shelter".

And you ignore the preceding two pages, where Truscott receives a call about an incoming aircraft at 9:43, then said he would initiate the evacuation, then went to the situation room where he met Rice (who says she the burning Pentagon there on TV), then went to the shelter where he found Cheney, then went to the PEOC.

truscott did not initate the earlier evacuation. there could have been two different scenarios in play. 1. the down the river track. 2. the track that made the loop de loop.

Now you're rewriting what Mineta said even further to try and make it work. If he was wrong about the time, if his track had nothing to do with Flight 77, then why are you clinging to anything he says at all? How can you be sure he isn't talking about the projected track of Flight 93, as we've been saying all the time.

from what gumboot thinks, it was a tsd track. i believe cheapshot stated that the tsd is on a different machine. and cheapshot did not answer me (as far as i recall) about if one would call a tsd a "target" or "bogie". think about it, it would make strategic sense to make something look like it coming from this direction and really come from another direction!!

Except it didn't happen at the same time. No-one saw an evacuation with "everyone" running out from the White House and the OEOB and moving over to Lafayette Park until after the Pentagon was hit. Mineta saw this when he arrived. Therefore he arrived after the Pentagon was hit. Simple.

doesnt mean some people didnt evacuate and move to lafayette park quickly!

And Mineta said Lynne Cheney was there when he arrived. The same collection of documents where you've latched on to this timeline, also includes a detailed description showing she didn't arrive until after the Pentagon was hit. Therefore he also arrived after the Pentagon was hit. Unambiguous. Simple.

considering:
Clarke later describes that Lynne Cheney is, like her husband, “a right-wing ideologue,” and is offering her advice and opinions while in the PEOC."

hummmmm yeah.....the good ole neocons!! we sure can trust them!

"Ignoring" Sliney and Belger?

Sliney clearly says it was his decision to ground all the planes. Mineta and Garvey (and Belger as her deputy, I suspect, though not named here) said they were involved. Sliney says his recollection differed from theirs, he was asked to just "go along with it", but "the story that Secretary Menetta ordered the ground stop" was "a fiction".

from your post:
Sliney agreed with another Herndon CC assertion that Herndon CC personnel were asked to inaccurately represent the ground stop to match the story that Secretary Menetta ordered the ground stop: "I was asked to go along with a fiction."

to "go along with it" from an unnamed face???? that sounds alittle strange dont ya think.

where does it say anything about the order to land all planes regardless of pilots descretion???

"Re: Belger, either he was a part of maintaining that fiction, or he remembered the 9:45 time incorrectly. Either way, Mineta's own timeline gives us many more convincing reasons to show that was incorrect. And there's confirmation from, say, Eric Edelman, who relates what sounds like Mineta's story, only makes it clear this is about Flight 93:

or it was a decision based on this:
sliney- "As to the order to land, that was the product of the men and women in the Command Center who gave me advice on that day, the supervisors and the specialists. We were searching for something more to do, and that was made and decided on, and the impetus for that of course was the crash into the Pentagon when we gave that order."

 

[beachnut]

maybe ya missed it when they issused heading 190 then 360..

You were taught before what was going on, and now your fall back to your old failed moronic delusions. Why can't you get flying straight? Is it your goal to fail for 8 more years?

What is the final end all conclusion!? What is your point, you final point?

Stop repeating your failed junk and get to your conclusion.

 

[Senenmut]

So where the four E-4B's flying around the skies on 9/11 supposed to be
part of a wargames exercise is that right?

probably, but i only know about these 2. who knows what they did earlier in the day??
sword31/word31
venus77

from history commons:

Because of Global Guardian, three special military command aircraft with sophisticated communications equipment, based at Offutt, are up in the air the morning of 9/11. These E-4B National Airborne Operations Center planes—nicknamed “Doomsday” planes during the Cold War—are intended to control nuclear forces from the air in times of crisis. They are capable of acting as alternative command posts for top government officials from where they can direct US forces, execute war orders and coordinate the actions of civil authorities in times of national emergency.

 

[Senenmut]

You were taught before what was going on, and now your fall back to your old failed moronic delusions. Why can't you get flying straight? Is it your goal to fail for 8 more years?

What is the final end all conclusion!? What is your point, you final point?

Stop repeating your failed junk and get to your conclusion.

taught or told?

my final point is, imo there was more going on during the pentagon attack than what we are led to believe.

 

[MikeW]

Okay, let's take these one at a time.

truscott did not initate the earlier evacuation. there could have been two different scenarios in play. 1. the down the river track. 2. the track that made the loop de loop.

The documents do not support the idea of two evacuations. They are clearly contradictory: one of them is incorrect.

Examples.

The first version says Truscott began a meeting in his office at 9:18. Received a call talking of an incoming plane at 9:43. He went to the Situation Room where he met Rice, went to the shelter, Cheney was there, Truscott said he advised them to move to the PEOC proper, and that the "report of the Pentagon being hit by the suspicious aircraft was announced to the VP and NSA Rice after they arrived at the PEOC".

The second version says Truscott received a call about an incoming aircraft sometime between 9:18 and 9:25, not 9:43.

It then places him "suggesting that we relocate to the shelter" at 9:25, when according to version #1 he was still in his office and had no idea of any evacuation.

At 9:26 it talks of an evacuation being initiated and Truscott heading for the shelter, again something that isn't mentioned in version #1.

At 9:30 it repeat the story of Truscott in the shelter, telling Cheney and Rice to move to the PEOC, again considerably earlier than version #1.

I don't see that this is a story of two evacuations. Which wouldn't make sense, anyway - why would Truscott evacuate all the key players once, then go back to his office, wait for 10 minutes and do it again?

No, this is plainly the same sequence of events, but one of these timelines is placed earlier or later than it should be.

So: do you accept that? If not, then what are you saying - both these documents are true?