"Get Your Flag Decal Off Your Foreign Car!"

Heh. At TAM, a bunch of us went out for sushi on Thursday. I noticed that a number of people coming into the restaurant were wearing "FreedomFest" badges. Curious, I whipped out my iPhone and looked it up. Turns out it was a Libertarian/Tea Party-style convention going on at Bally's.

Which meant that TsarBomba wound up getting some very, very dirty looks for the Hammer & Sickle Fez he was wearing. :D


You would have thought he would get partial credit for the Declaration of Independence t-shirt he was also wearing.


Oh, and "Shmingo"!
 
boah cruel.

i wonder if you would post that picture if it was your postman and not just some duck :eek:


I don't think it's very likely my postman would have been cavorting with his girlfriend in the middle of the Lochmaben-Lockerbie road, in a shallow dip, at about 4.30am.

And if he had been, I'd have seen him, as he's definitely more than 18 inches tall. ;)

Rolfe.
 
Saw this one today on a Dodge pick-em-up..... A rabid "buy American" type, I suppose.

40 hours a week, I drive a Chevrolet Impala police car. It has a little sticker on the window that says, "proudly made in Canada".
I believe the Ford Focus is currently produced in Mexico, as are a number of other models.
To add further cognitive dissonance, Honda, Toyota, and Kia (at least) all have manufacturing plants right here in the US....
And all the big "American" manufacturers are invested to some degree or another with other foreign firms.

Folks need to wake up and realize that though "Buy American" is a catchy slogan, it is after all a world economy.

I have a Mercedes-Benz ML 320 assembled in Huntsville, Alabama, USA

I wish the Deutsch founders kept better quality control.
 
Not long after the presidential election I saw a "Don't Blame Me I Voted For A Real American" sticker on a Honda. Of course, I don't know where the Honda was assembled. I have a Clash and University Of Alabama sticker on my Honda. ;)
 
I used to stick little japanese flag stickers on my driver door every time I toasted a ricer. I had to stop after getting smoked by a 10 second street supra and not having an american flag sticker to give to the owner. Now I drive a nice slow jeep (made in canada)
 
Folks need to wake up and realize that though "Buy American" is a catchy slogan, it is after all a world economy.

Ladies and gentlemen: Rep. Michelle Bachmann - (R - Mars)



If you look at the G20, what they’re trying to do is bind together the world’s economies. Look how that played out in the European Union when they bound all of those nations economies together and one of the smallest economies, Greece, when they got into trouble, that one little nation is bringing down the entire EU. Well, President Obama is trying to bind the United States into a global economy where all of our nations come together in a global economy. I don’t want the United States to be in a global economy where, where our economic future is bound to that of Zimbabwe. I can’t, we can’t necessarily trust the decisions that are being made financially in other countries.

Elected twice, by the way.


Oh! Since we're talking cars, I have a Volkswagen that was built in Mexico. Probably VASTLY not what the Deutsche Arbeitsfront envisioned, and to me there's something amusing about that.
 
Last edited:
The Teabagger I work with has Beck on the radio often and I am sure he was telling people NOT to buy any cars from companies that got money in the bailouts because they were "communist cars".
Buy American, but not cars? Does their money no longer go to America?
I have never asked my Nissan about its ideology.
 
Folks need to wake up and realize that though "Buy American" is a catchy slogan, it is after all a world economy.

I'm trying to find exact numbers, but the Big 3 employ about 10 times as many people in the US as Toyota and Honda.

Those are direct employees, GM has approximately 3.2 retirees per employee, Chrysler 2 and Ford 1.6. That boils down to about 2 per employee. I believe Toyota will begin to experience the burden of retiree benefits very soon, but as of now they are negligible.

A rough estimate suggests 20 times the Americans rely on the Big 3 to put food on the table than the foreign automakers.

On top of that the profits Toyota and Honda and the rest move out of the country and are less likely to trickle down. To what extent I'm not sure.

Before I made any determination one way or another I'd be curious to see a study on how much of a vehicle's cost goes into stimulating the North American economy, foreign vs. domestic. There's certainly more riding on the survival of the US automakers than the foreign. At the same time we've come to see that industry isn't as sustainable in this new World economy. The answer isn't as easy as buying American, but it seems a little short sighted to think it's equivalent to buying foreign simply because parts are made and vehicles assembled outside North America.
 
My own car is a Hyundai, made in Korea. However, it was imported (I presume) by an American firm, delivered by Americans, dealer prepped and set up and sold by Americans, and serviced and maintained by Americans.
I don't know what percentage of the original purchase price ever got to Korea over the 4 years it took me to pay for the thing...

Years ago, we had a local motorcycle dealer who handled all sorts of "exotics". Bultaco, Cimatti, Mondial, Ducati...
Strange little place. The guy who ran it was sort of odd too, he had a thoroughly ugly Morris Minor (I don't know if there were any good-looking Morrises... I never saw one) with a prominent bumper sticker that said "Buy American-made products!"
 
I'm trying to find exact numbers, but the Big 3 employ about 10 times as many people in the US as Toyota and Honda.

Those are direct employees, GM has approximately 3.2 retirees per employee, Chrysler 2 and Ford 1.6. That boils down to about 2 per employee. I believe Toyota will begin to experience the burden of retiree benefits very soon, but as of now they are negligible.

A rough estimate suggests 20 times the Americans rely on the Big 3 to put food on the table than the foreign automakers.

On top of that the profits Toyota and Honda and the rest move out of the country and are less likely to trickle down. To what extent I'm not sure.

Before I made any determination one way or another I'd be curious to see a study on how much of a vehicle's cost goes into stimulating the North American economy, foreign vs. domestic. There's certainly more riding on the survival of the US automakers than the foreign. At the same time we've come to see that industry isn't as sustainable in this new World economy. The answer isn't as easy as buying American, but it seems a little short sighted to think it's equivalent to buying foreign simply because parts are made and vehicles assembled outside North America.

I'd be curious to see those figures, too, if you can find a cite. Updated for 2010. Frankly, I think they're cooked. I'm sure they're talking about direct employees, and the Big Three may carry more in the components and parts world directly on their books, but how many private companies are they supporting versus the foreign makers.

I do not have the answers. I'm not being coy. I just think the 10 X figure is going to be well off, all depending on how one counts.
 
My own car is a Hyundai, made in Korea. However, it was imported (I presume) by an American firm, delivered by Americans, dealer prepped and set up and sold by Americans, and serviced and maintained by Americans.
I don't know what percentage of the original purchase price ever got to Korea over the 4 years it took me to pay for the thing...

Years ago, we had a local motorcycle dealer who handled all sorts of "exotics". Bultaco, Cimatti, Mondial, Ducati...
Strange little place. The guy who ran it was sort of odd too, he had a thoroughly ugly Morris Minor (I don't know if there were any good-looking Morrises... I never saw one) with a prominent bumper sticker that said "Buy American-made products!"

It's a net sum game isn't it? We're presumably at a crossroads in American history. The transition from a manufacturing based economy to a service based one. At least that's how its been explained to me.
I'm biased in the sense that I grew up in the Motor City(ies) , my direct known family (I don't know the proper term, but my at one time living relatives Great Grand parents on through) all gainfully employed directly or indirectly by way of the automakers. That's 3 or 4 generations depending on how you look at it, living at above average levels, with none to modest education and cultural status.
I'm no history buff, but when else in history were so many with so little able to achieve so much? I suppose their was a time early in North American history where the simple farmer was able work hard and prosper, but what has become of the farmer? That way of living is gone it would seem, and now survives only by subsidization. A striking similarity to the autoworkers of present.
As I said it would seem to be a net sum game. Can our economy sustain the change from a manufacturing based to a service based with the same quality of living accustomed to us in the last 100 years. (Some will argue that the American economy has been and will continue to be serviced based. I'm of the mind to think this is a result of the rise in manufacturing, that the service industry grew in relation to the services afforded by those employed in manufacturing. A chicken or egg, which came first so to speak) It can if the $4000 you saved buying a Hyundai is equal to or greater than the loss to the economy not buying a comparable domestic product.
I searched the internet and was unable to find an exact number. There doesn't appear to be any studies weighing the effects of purchasing a domestic car over a foreign. It seems like too complex an equation to solve for some of the reasons you've pointed out. Aside from the profits themselves, most of the associated costs between a foreign and domestic vehicle are essentially the same.
I'm inclined to believe the profits made in the automotive industry never had that much of a "trickle down effect". It's more of a concentration of wealth. The millions, or billions made reside in the hands of a select few, who never turn that wealth back over to the economy in the same concentration. In fact usually when we talk about these concentrations of wealth we associate it with exotic cars and foreign destinations, certainly the only domestic contribution of the ultra wealthy is the employment of house staff and payment of property taxes.
The profits hoarded by Toyoda and Ford have no real effect on the domestic economies in Japan and the US do they? If either were to go broke tomorrow and their accumulated wealth distributed back to citizens of each country what would it amount to for each individual? Basically nothing is my guess.
So if our economy has thrived with the concentration of wealth here, surely it can be sustained if it moved to Japan or China or Korea? I mean it really isn't that big of a deal. Is it?
I guess I'm at odds, my intuition says "Yes" but my logical mind says "No". I know some of my direct family and a few of my friends still rely on the domestic automakers for a living. 10 years ago "almost all of" them relied on the Big 3. Things have changed, and I have to say it really hasn't been for the better. Has it been better for the rest of the country that never relied on the automotive industry? I hope so, because otherwise there's a case to be made that the economy is directly related to the manufacturing and sales of domestic cars. As goes GM so does the economy.
I don't know, I'm trying to be tactful. I realize many of the people touting the "Buy American" don't know exactly what is or isn't American anymore. It's based purely on an ideology and not in fact. At the same time I'm not sure a case has been made that buying a foreign car isn't having an impact on our way of living. They may be right despite not having any clue what they are talking about.
 
I'd be curious to see those figures, too, if you can find a cite. Updated for 2010. Frankly, I think they're cooked. I'm sure they're talking about direct employees, and the Big Three may carry more in the components and parts world directly on their books, but how many private companies are they supporting versus the foreign makers.

I do not have the answers. I'm not being coy. I just think the 10 X figure is going to be well off, all depending on how one counts.

Indeed, I overestimated the number of Ford and Chrysler employees as well as underestimated Honda (Mazda? How do you do that? Ford owns a quarter of them)

A quick googling would suggest 5X is more likely. I've got 103000 for GM, 87 000 for Ford and 50 000 for Chrysler, for 240000 total. Toyota with 28000 and Honda with 27000.

I'm not sure if they lumped in the Canadian employees with some or all of these.

The retiree figures I cited are based on 2006, I can't find more recent numbers. There are more retirees now, and less employees.

So you are indeed correct, I was well off by a factor of 2. For some reason I thought Honda only had about 3000 workers in the US, not 27000. I also thought Ford had 120000 workers and not 87000.

I assumed the spin off jobs are about the same for everyone. There's really not much Japanese in an American made Toyota. There may be a case for the engineering aspect. I'm not sure what or where the Toyota and Honda equivalent to Auburn Hills is.
 
Rolfe,

If you had been going faster your grille would have sliced him neatly into tasty little hexagons of duck meat. Like a french-fry cutter with a diesel engine.


Diesel!! My beloved GTi MkVI???

I didn't realise that grille was plastic until that happened. At least it was easily replaced.

That car was built in Wolfsburg, in Germany. My last car was a Peugeot which I believe was built in Coventry or somewhere like that, but thanks to our amazingly competent governments I don't think we have a car industry any more....

Rolfe.
 
Diesel!! My beloved GTi MkVI???

I didn't realise that grille was plastic until that happened. At least it was easily replaced.

That car was built in Wolfsburg, in Germany. My last car was a Peugeot which I believe was built in Coventry or somewhere like that, but thanks to our amazingly competent governments I don't think we have a car industry any more....

Rolfe.

Sorry, I thought you said somewhere you drove a diesel.
 
Diesel!! My beloved GTi MkVI???

I didn't realise that grille was plastic until that happened. At least it was easily replaced.

That car was built in Wolfsburg, in Germany. My last car was a Peugeot which I believe was built in Coventry or somewhere like that, but thanks to our amazingly competent governments I don't think we have a car industry any more....

Rolfe.

as a vet did you at least fix the duck? :D
 
"Get Your Flag Decal Off Your Foreign Car!"

A significant proportion of the St George's crosses I saw flying on cars during the World Cup were on Mercedes and BMWs.
 
The idea that having your country's flag on your car is pointless, suggests either an extraordinarily large country, or an extraordinarily insular attitude.

Oh wait....

Here's the infamous murdered mallard photo, showing the numberplate of my VW Golf.

[qimg]http://www.b5-dark-mirror.demon.co.uk/duck2.jpg[/qimg]

Rolfe. :c1:

/punch...Blue one!

A good friend of mine is still riding a Honda CB750 I sold him over a decade ago. When the Harley types tell him to "Buy American" he replies, "I bought it from an American."

I was told a long time ago, something I've never cared enough to look up. Is it true that after 1986 Harley motors were built by Honda?
 

Back
Top Bottom