Iran to stone adulterer who confessed after torture.

[AvalonXQ]

If they want to imigrate to another country, that means they want to try a better life for themselves.

That depends. Sometimes it means that; sometimes it means spreading their barbaric practices to other places.

 

[Ladewig]

You know, I read up on this and was disappointed to note that the media didn't mention that the two men she had supposedly had affairs with, MURDERED her husband. I think that kind of changes things a bit from being a poor victim forced to confess. .

Article 74 of the Iranian penal code requires at least four witnesses -- four men or three men and two women -- for an adulterer to receive a stoning sentence, said Ahadi, of the International Committee Against Stoning. But there were no witnesses in Ashtiani's case.

Even IF she had committed adultery, the state did not meet its burden of proof. There were not four male witnesses. Therefore, I will reject your claim that anything has been changed by your additional information.

ETA: furthermore, even if she had sex with those men it might have been non-consenual.

 

[Pardalis]

You know, I read up on this and was disappointed to note that the media didn't mention that the two men she had supposedly had affairs with, MURDERED her husband. I think that kind of changes things a bit from being a poor victim forced to confess.

And yet she was charged with adultery, not attempted murder. Funny isn't it?

I guess Islamic courts have different priorities.

 

[caniswalensis]

Man, That is some medeival crap right there.

I will go out on a limb and say that Iran's legal system would benifit from some modernization.

Improvements to consider:

• Lose the torture
• Evidence, evidence, evidence
• If you must execute someone for something, avoid using rocks, swords, clubs, wild horses, etc.

 

[Last of the Fraggles]

There is nothing wrong with executing a murderer.

In the views of some people there is nothing wrong with stoning an adulterer to death. So simply asserting things isn't really going to get us anywhere.

Also ridiculous to start claiming stories like this are a good reason to not allow Muslims to immigrate into Western countries. In fact, if anything the opposite is true. If people are being treated like this in their home land they need options to get away from it.

Stories like this are horrible, what can be done about it? It seems nobody really cares all that much about these things beyond using them as a stick to beat Islam with.

 

[Pardalis]

Man, That is some medeival crap right there.

I will go out on a limb and say that Iran's legal system would benifit from some modernization.

Improvements to consider:

• Lose the torture
• Evidence, evidence, evidence
• If you must execute someone for something, avoid using rocks, swords, clubs, wild horses, etc.

There's also the fact that they let the people do the killing. It's a form of social reinforcement.

 

[AvalonXQ]

• If you must execute someone for something, avoid using rocks, swords, clubs, wild horses, etc.

Basically, avoid using anything we have statistics for in Dungeons and Dragons.

 

[Last of the Fraggles]

That depends. Sometimes it means that; sometimes it means spreading their barbaric practices to other places.

Do you have any evidence whatsoever of an individual who emigrates with the sole intention of introducing stoning as a form of capital punishment in a Western democracy?

Surely if you want to live a society where stoning adulterers to death is A-OK you stay in the Middle East?

 

[DC]

that is what happens if some idiots decide to do justice the way it is described in a very old fantasy book......

at least the other religions have stopped this crapp, in to many Islamic countries this crap is even pushed. sick sick sick....

 

[AvalonXQ]

Do you have any evidence whatsoever of an individual who emigrates with the sole intention of introducing stoning as a form of capital punishment in a Western democracy?

I don't, and I doubt there is any.
But some immigrate and leave their cultural baggage behind, while others immigrate and bring their cultural baggage with them. In the latter case, when that baggage includes subjugating and hurting women, the effect is to propogate barbarism, whether that is their sole intention or not.

 

[Pardalis]

Stories like this are horrible, what can be done about it?

There's nothing much we can do. It's the more modern Muslims who need to do something.

 

[caniswalensis]

Basically, avoid using anything we have statistics for in Dungeons and Dragons.

LOL! Sucinctly put!

Of course, if the accused is found guilty of murdering a kolbold, we could make an exception.

 

[DC]

I don't, and I doubt there is any.
But some immigrate and leave their cultural baggage behind, while others immigrate and bring their cultural baggage with them. In the latter case, when that baggage includes subjugating and hurting women, the effect is to propogate barbarism, whether that is their sole intention or not.

it is not like we don't have men here in the western democracies that never would beat their wife....

 

[AvalonXQ]

it is not like we don't have men here in the western democracies that never would beat their wife....

I'm not sure what you were trying to say, but what you actually said is equivalent to "We have men here in western democracies that would never beat their wives." This is true, and a good thing.

 

[Sideroxylon]

Let me set the record straight about me and Muslims. I don't hate them. I have no problem carrying on a conversation with a Muslim. I do it all the time. Pakistanis, Turks, Iranians, Iraquis etc. I exchange pleasantries with them and I enjoy the conversations. I just don't always feel comfortable being in the presence of a person that comes from this sort of background. I'm leery of them.

You probably need to get to know more of them to get over the leery thing. The problem is that most people's experience is only with the extremes reported in the news and portrayed in movies. Not all Christians are raving irrational fundies, are they?

Some of the Iranians I have spoken over here are just as outraged about the actions perpetrated by the whackjobs who run their country.

 

[DC]

I'm not sure what you were trying to say, but what you actually said is equivalent to "We have men here in western democracies that would never beat their wives." This is true, and a good thing.

lol i knew something is wrong in that sentence, i meant the other way around, we have both kind of men here

but here at least here the men gets punished, in Iran propably the contrary, stone the woman......

 

[Last of the Fraggles]

I don't, and I doubt there is any.
But some immigrate and leave their cultural baggage behind, while others immigrate and bring their cultural baggage with them. In the latter case, when that baggage includes subjugating and hurting women, the effect is to propogate barbarism, whether that is their sole intention or not.

Some people in Western democracies also believe in subjugating and hurting women. We deal with them in accordance with our laws when they break them. Part of the immigration process includes the fact that you abide by the laws of the country you immigrate to so I don't really see the argument here.

Are you actually agreeing with the assertion that its a good idea not to allow Muslims into a country just on the off chance they happen to be radical nutjobs?

 

[Pardalis]

it is not like we don't have men here in the western democracies that never would beat their wife....

But in western democracies the law protects the victim.

The woman usually gets help, and the man is put in jail, prosecuted or receives a court order to keep away from the victim.

 

[DC]

But in western democracies the law protects the victim.

The woman usually gets help, and the man is put in jail, prosecuted or receives a court order to keep away from the victim.

yes i think that is mostly the case

 

[AvalonXQ]

Are you actually agreeing with the assertion that its a good idea not to allow Muslims into a country just on the off chance they happen to be radical nutjobs?

I'd be opposed to this. As I expressed in another thread, believing in religious freedom means that you can welcome each person into the country and see what they do, without a preconception about how their religious beliefs may affect their behavior.