Merged Israel Attacks Palestinian Aid Flotilla, According To Reports

[Pardalis]

And furtively on their end, Hamas is trying to stop the entry of the aid that is waiting at the port, and is being accused of closing down charities.

http://www.haaretz.com/news/diploma...king-entry-of-flotilla-aid-into-gaza-1.293943
http://edition.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/meast/06/03/gaza.un/index.html

It looks like Hamas wants to be the sole purveyor of aid in the territory, which to me shows even more obviously that they are using their own people for their own political end.

 

[Thunder]

the activists are going home, so Hamas' little political game won't last long.

 

[JediKnight2.01]

No, they have noticed that the Israeli military is operating by tried and tested propaganda protocols - set the press agenda, get your narrative in first and control what information enters the media for the critical period when the story is initially being implanted in the public consciousness and for as long as possible after that.

If true, how is that different from Palestinian propaganda protocols?

Nice of you to work the word "protocols" in there, no?

 

[portlandatheist]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FOGG_osOoVg

That 'bout sums it up.

Brilliant! Two thumbs up!

 

[portlandatheist]

Yup, it's true. HAMAS is not letting any aid in until the activists are set free, thus essentially using its civilian population as pawns. Again.

Collective punishment?

 

[Thunder]

http://gisha.org/UserFiles/File/HiddenMessages/ItemsGazaStrip060510.pdf

Here is a list of goods that are allowed in, and banned by Israel, as of this present day.

Banned goods include such dangerous items as:

sage
cardamom
cumin
coriander
ginger
jam
halva
vinegar
nutmeg
chocolate ​

fruit preserves

seeds and nuts
biscuits and sweets
potato chips
gas for soft drinks
dried fruit​

fresh meat

horses
donkeys
goats
cattle​

chicks

...wow...that's some serious weapons of mass destruction they are keeping out of the hands of Hamas.

 

[Cleon]

http://gisha.org/UserFiles/File/HiddenMessages/ItemsGazaStrip060510.pdf

Here is a list of goods that are allowed in, and banned by Israel, as of this present day.

Banned goods include such dangerous items as:

sage
cardamom
cumin
coriander
ginger
jam
halva
vinegar
nutmeg
chocolate​

fruit preserves

...wow...that's some serious weapons of mass destruction they are keeping out of the hands of Hamas.

In fairness, have you ever tried Halva? It tastes like desert.

(No...That's not a typo.)

 

[a_unique_person]

And furtively on their end, Hamas is trying to stop the entry of the aid that is waiting at the port, and is being accused of closing down charities.

http://www.haaretz.com/news/diploma...king-entry-of-flotilla-aid-into-gaza-1.293943
http://edition.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/meast/06/03/gaza.un/index.html

It looks like Hamas wants to be the sole purveyor of aid in the territory, which to me shows even more obviously that they are using their own people for their own political end.

So you don't like Hams either. What do we do about people suffering malnutrition?

 

[Thunder]

You know, when people claim that the embargo is to keep Iranian missiles from getting into the hands of Hamas terrorists, and then we read that Israel is keeping out ginger and nutmeg, I can't help but have a lack of respect for the embargo.

Just call me insensitive to Israel's security needs.

I mean honestly, who can keep a straight face after reading this list?

 

[Skeptic]

A relevant article from the Jerusalem Post:

"Liberal zioinists must choose: Hamas or Israel?"

But for some “liberal Zionists” this reality [about the constant Arab attempt to destroy Israel and Hamas' nature] is too unpleasant to contemplate. So they ignore it and stick to the myth of Israeli intransigence that allows them to assume the pose of judges forced “more in sorrow than in anger” to distance themselves from this illiberal Jewish state.

Some had chosen. See my .sig file.

 

[Skeptic]

As for killing Americans: the PLO killed many Americans -- not in a firefight when attacked by one, but deliberately. Yet the PLO is praised by the same folks who are outraged at "the death of a fellow citizen" as "moderate".

But of course, they were only Jewish Americans, so it doesn't really count.

 

[BeAChooser]

Ahhhh yessss, here's a picture of the "peace" "activists" that JREF's leftists chose to defend:

http://www.jpost.com/Israel/Article.aspx?id=177445

Based on preliminary results of its investigation into the navy’s takeover of the Mavi Marmara, which ended with nine dead passengers and more than 30 wounded, the IDF said on Thursday that the commandos were attacked by a well-trained group of mercenaries, most of whom were found without IDs but with thousands of dollars in their pockets.

The group was well trained and was split into a number of squads of about 20 mercenaries each distributed throughout the upper deck, the IDF said. All of the mercenaries wore gas masks and ceramic bulletproof vests and were armed with either bats, slingshots, metal bars, knives or stun grenades.

The IDF’s understanding is that the mercenaries mainly chose dual-purpose items of this sort rather than guns, since opening fire would have made it blatantly clear that they were terrorists and not so-called peace activists.

Nevertheless, the IDF suspects that the group did have some guns of its own. Israeli forensic experts who examined the ship found casings belonging to a weapon that was not used by the commandos, and the Turkish captain of the ship later told the IDF that the “mercenaries” threw their weapons overboard after the commandos took control of the vessel.

T. said he realized the group they were facing was well-trained and likely ex-military after the commandos threw a number of stun grenades and fired warning shots before rappelling down onto the deck. “They didn’t even flinch,” he said. “Regular people would move.”

Each squad of the “mercenaries” was equipped with a Motorola communication device, the IDF said, so they could pass information to one another. Assessments in the defense establishment are that members of the group were affiliated with international global jihad elements and had undergone training in places like Afghanistan and Pakistan.

 

[BeAChooser]

More details …

http://www.haaretz.com/print-editio...ps-hostage-during-gaza-flotilla-raid-1.294114

During Israel's takeover of a Turkish ship in the Gaza-bound aid flotilla this week, some passengers tried to take captive three commandos who lost consciousness as a result of the activists' blows, according to early findings of a navy investigation. The three were dragged into one of the passenger halls below deck and were held there for several minutes.

… snip ...

As seen on a video documenting the takeover, the first four commandos to rappel onto the deck were attacked by activists with bars, axes and knives. The fourth commando, K., saw his team leader on the deck, with a Turkish activist holding the pistol he had grabbed from him and pointing it to his head. K. jumped from the rope and managed to shoot the activist holding the gun. This happened 20 seconds after the first soldier landed on the deck.

… snip …

At this stage, six minutes into the operation, another force landed from a second helicopter, led by a major. At that point they realized that three commandos were missing and they began looking for them. A short while later the naval commando chief landed along with dozens more soldiers, some of whom climbed from boats. Others landed from a third helicopter.

The search involved limited shooting, in the bridge and on the lower deck, until the three men were recovered. The head of the naval commandos gave orders by radio to use live fire, two minutes after the incident had begun.

… snip …

The soldiers reported that the activists had fired on them during the confrontation and that at least two commandos suffered gunshot wounds. After the incident, 9mm bullet casings were found - a kind not used by the naval commandos.
The Israel Defense Forces says that during the operation a number of pistols and an M-4 rifle were taken from soldiers, but they believe that the Turkish activists had other weapons. The captain of the ship told the naval commando chief that the guns were thrown overboard before the ship was completely taken over.

… snip …

Post-operation assessments have the number of hard-core activists involved in the fighting at between 60 and 100. It appears that they were well trained and experienced, especially in view of the arsenal found and code books used to pass on orders from group leaders. Among the rioters, in addition to Turks, were Yemenis, Afghans and one person from Eritrea. All were apparently experienced in hand-to-hand fighting. Some of them did not retreat when shots were fired.

… snip …

According to a senior officer, "Under the circumstances, and I do not like the result, I think we did the best we could. We took care of five ships without injuries. On the sixth ship, we faced a harsh attack and killed nine saboteurs.

"No real peace activist was injured. No soldier was killed, even though it came pretty close. In the end the ships are docked at Ashdod. It was very complicated and the result is near perfect."

 

[Cleon]

Some had chosen. See my .sig file.

Pathetic. Truly, truly pathetic.

 

[preptic]

come on my ship, in international waters, in violation of international law, and I'll beat your ass too.

This is similar to saying that if you break the law and the police come to arrest you, you'll beat their asses too. I suppose it feels good to say it, but unfortunately, they are going to come get you no matter what you do.

But guess what, you would not have beat their asses if you were trying to breach their blockade and they boarded your ship. You would have accepted defeat. Just like dozens of other ships, including five of the six ships this time around, for as long as the blockade has existed.

It was just one out of dozens of ships where violence actually erupted. This was not because the passengers defended themselves, but because they had already prepared well in advance for using violence.

Are you saying that you are a violent islamist with a death wish who willfully violates international law?

there are consequences to thinking you can do whatever you want, wherever you want, whenever you want.

I agree wholeheartedly. The consequence of viciously attacking people who are legally boarding your ship, whose captain has explicitly made it clear that its intention was to illegally violate a military blockade, are what they are. You will escalate the situation, as opposed to all the dozens of other times where the ships did not illegally and violently resist legal arrest.

 

[preptic]

The Israelis have already said that the people of Gaza= Hamas.

Is that why hundreds of Palestinians from Gaza are brought to Israeli hospitals every week for treatment? Is that why Israel keeps bringing huge amounts of food, water, and other supplies to Gaza? Is that why Israel aborted attacks when Hamas used their own civilians as shields during the Gaza invasion?

Israel is afraid of Iran shipping missiles to Hamas, so they stop a boat filled with....cement and LEGO bricks.

The fact is that there is a blockade in effect, and Israel had no idea what was on those boats. Israel know now what was on those boats (mostly things that were not in short supply in Gaza). They did not know before they were able to investigate the cargo.

 

[preptic]

witnessgaza.com/images/freedomflotilla.jpg

I'm not sure what that picture is supposed to show. Is it showing the aggressors on the ship beating and stabbing Israeli soldiers on the ground while the ones on the right are using their painball guns in a desperate attempt to save their mates? Because that's the only interpretation that makes sense. But I'm guessing that's not what it's supposed to show. I'm guessing it's supposed to further the lie that the Israeli soldies came on board the ship and started gunning down people just like that.

Gee, wonder why they didn't just shoot everyone on the dozens of other ships they had boarded in the past...

[obama]The Israelis acted....stupidly[obama]

Hindsight is 20/20. Israel had carried out this kind of operation numerous times with numerous ships in the past. Now that we know what was on the last ship, it's easy to say "you should have done differently". But Israel had had great success using this exact method in the past. They simply did not expect the violent mob on the last ship.

 

[preptic]

Here is a list of goods that are allowed in, and banned by Israel, as of this present day.

Do you have an independent source verifying that list?

Also, do you know the actual reason for why they are banned? You can always ridicule things by misrepresenting them. I'm guessing there's a reason for these things being banned other than being "dangerous". If those things are indeed banned.

 

[Sword_Of_Truth]

So you don't like Hams either. What do we do about people suffering malnutrition?

What malnutrition?

 

[bigjelmapro]

The only reason there is a flotilla is because Israel is not allowing sufficient nutrition through by land. So stop making stupid assumptions about what I think and why I think it. You keep breaking forum rules here by attacking individuals.

Did I post a reply about this earlier in full? What steps should be taken and pretty much stating that you yourself haven't read the two articles you posted earlier?

Pulling a Parky?