The media conspiracy to suppress information about Jews

[Foolmewunz]

<snip>

Now, have you seen any mention of this in the US media? On the television news? In your local newspaper. In any mainstream news publication whatever? You have not. There is a demonstrable conspiracy in the media to suppress information detrimental to the image of Jews.

Okay, to actually give this a real answer....

It is common knowledge that the more psychotic and fervent "true believers" in Israel are like, well, most true believers everywhere. They've been hawking up lungies on Christians, crosses, crucifixes, church steps, et al, for years. And it's common knowledge and it's been covered all over the place.

It is not a confirmed lesson from the Talmud, though. It's what it is, a supreme act of contempt/hatred, and almost all secular Jews and many conservative and ultra-orthodox CONDEMN THE PRACTICE! It is, however, known to be a popular act, almost a rite of passage, amongst Yeshiva students, and their rabbis/teachers seem to want to do nothing about it, or at least simply ignore it.

Admittedly, it's covered more in the Jewish and other religious pressess, but that's to be expected, isn't it? If an Irish Protestant spits on a Catholic church and a little fracas ensues, do you think it makes the CBS Evening News. I know for a fact, though, that the issue has been covered in the MSM. For those of us who don't get our news from Stormfront, it's not a shocking story. There are idiots everywhere in every religion, culture, and sub-culture. (Why there are even idiots in the White Power movement, I've heard. Yeah, it's true. )

Why look, Saggy. Here's the Jew-controlled NY Times not covering Jewish spitting.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpa...AA25753C1A9629C8B63&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=all

That's back in 2004. I find articles from 2005 to 2009 in all sorts of publications. How come you can't? Oh, that's because you don't actually look for source material, but you get handed it by other bigots from their blogs and websites.

 

[Foolmewunz]

This reminds me of the teaparty people calling democratic lawmakers ******* and faggots and spitting on them during their photo-op. There was no evidence for it even though there were dozens of cameras shooting at them, but still people treat the story as fact. In this case we have someone saying they were spit at by a group of people, but posters take a very different stance. Interesting would you not say? I think its pretty safe to say that tea party people are todays folk devils.

I haven't noticed jews spitting on me by the way.

You'd be wrong, though. Like a lot of anti-semitic crap, this story has some basis in actual fact. As I said above, though, it's generally Yeshiva students trying to "make their bones" or out-radical their buddies by performing nasty gestures.

The sort of unique thing about this reporter's story is that it was the older men not students, but it's been speculated that they could have even thought that she was a Yid. It wasn't anti-christian, it was anti-anyonewhoisn'tme. As I mentioned above, it's what fanatics do.

 

[cwalner]

I don't think anybody is really stating that such incidents never happened or are even isolated to the two events in the one article.

However, the point is that this is clearly limited to the more fringe elements of orthodox ultra-conservative groups in Israel. Saggy's extrapolation from that to all Jews globally, however, is laughable (hence my parody and mockery of his position) and clearly based in bigotry and antisemitism, not in reason and critical thinking.

As you point out most Jews see that behavior as repugnant. And the thought that one Rabbi speaks for all Jews can only be presented by somebody who has no clue whatsoever about what Jews and Jewery is like in the real world. There are even jokes about how a single Jew will rarely agree with himself, much less other Jews. An obvious exaggeration, but clearly indicative that Jews, in general, are not of one mind on any topic.

Therefore, assuming that one fringe rabbi, who spews hate, speaks for all Jews, is akin to assuming that one fringe Christian (say somebody with known affiliation to the KKK, like David Duke) speaks for all Christians. It just ain't so.

 

[Foolmewunz]

I don't think anybody is really stating that such incidents never happened or are even isolated to the two events in the one article.

However, the point is that this is clearly limited to the more fringe elements of orthodox ultra-conservative groups in Israel. Saggy's extrapolation from that to all Jews globally, however, is laughable (hence my parody and mockery of his position) and clearly based in bigotry and antisemitism, not in reason and critical thinking.

As you point out most Jews see that behavior as repugnant. And the thought that one Rabbi speaks for all Jews can only be presented by somebody who has no clue whatsoever about what Jews and Jewery is like in the real world. There are even jokes about how a single Jew will rarely agree with himself, much less other Jews. An obvious exaggeration, but clearly indicative that Jews, in general, are not of one mind on any topic.

Therefore, assuming that one fringe rabbi, who spews hate, speaks for all Jews, is akin to assuming that one fringe Christian (say somebody with known affiliation to the KKK, like David Duke) speaks for all Christians. It just ain't so.

Old saying in my community.... If you ever want eleven good opinions just ask ten jews for advice. Each will have a different opinion and no one will admit that the other guys' ideas are as good and one smug bastage will have two opinions.


ETA: Oh, yeah.... I believe we concur.

 

[Klimax]

absolutely. probably a lot more.

do you know how many backwards, dumb-ass, Christian Jew-haters there are in Eastern Europe/Russia? Latin America?

Evidence for E.Europe?

(Of course it depends what countries are included there.)

 

[Brainache]

So, does Fred Phelps speak for all Christians?

 

[Chaos]

And 10% would be 150 million people.

Am I to understand that you believe that 15 million Christians believe the Holocaust to be a hoax?

I´m not sure he would be wrong... if you added up all those Nazis and their ilk in various European countries, and of course the Nazis, Klan, and other White Supremacists in the US, the overwhelming majority of which I assume see themselves as Christians, that should add up to quite a few millions. Then add all the conspiracy theorists who aren´t affiliated with the Nazis... I wouldn´t be surprised if the 1% estimated ended up being way too low.

To paraphrase Reagan (?), a million here, a million there, and pretty soon you´re talking about a serious crowd.

 

[Elizabeth I]

I´m not sure he would be wrong... if you added up all those Nazis and their ilk in various European countries, and of course the Nazis, Klan, and other White Supremacists in the US, the overwhelming majority of which I assume see themselves as Christians, that should add up to quite a few millions. Then add all the conspiracy theorists who aren´t affiliated with the Nazis... I wouldn´t be surprised if the 1% estimated ended up being way too low.

To paraphrase Reagan (?), a million here, a million there, and pretty soon you´re talking about a serious crowd.

Close - it was Everett Dirksen (possibly apocryphal) and it was "a billion here, a billion there..."

 

[cwalner]

Old saying in my community.... If you ever want eleven good opinions just ask ten jews for advice. Each will have a different opinion and no one will admit that the other guys' ideas are as good and one smug bastage will have two opinions.

That is actually very similar to one of the jokes I was thinking of when I made my post

The other was about a Jew stranded on a desert island for 5 years. When finally rescued they found two synagogues built. One on the west side of the island, the other on the east side. When asked about it, the Jew pointed to the west side building and explained how he goes there to commune with god and seek peace. When asked about the other, he exclaimed "That place! I won't set foot in there!".

 

[Saggy]

However, the point is that this is clearly limited to the more fringe elements of orthodox ultra-conservative groups in Israel. Saggy's extrapolation from that to all Jews globally, however, is laughable .....

I don't extrapolate to anyplace in the world outside of Israel. The Jews only spit only in Israel, and only on clergymen and women. The ultra-orthodox are not fringe elements, they are the essence of true Judaism.

Continuing the Shahak article he writes, still in reference to spitting ....

The increasing strength of the Jewish state has caused these customs to become more open again but there should be no mistake: The spitting on the cross for converts from Christianity to Judaism , organized in Kibbutz Sa’ad and financed by the Israeli government is a an act of traditional Jewish piety.

That is, it's an official part of the conversion process from Christianity to Judaism to spit on the cross.

But, spitting sometimes just isn't enough .... get this .. (not from Shahak)

From AD 200 to the early 1800’s, a religious European Jew was required to spit in the direction of any church he walked past. On Christian holidays in Europe, a Jew was required to pray for Jesus to suffer in Hell. Even recently, the ceremony to convert to Judaism in Israel, given over to the ultra-Orthodox of Kibbutz Sa’ad and financed by the Israeli government, required spitting on the cross.

And, apparently the usual + symbol for mathematics addition has been replaced in all Israeli elementary schools as being an inducement to Christianity. Shahak again ...

Until the early 1970s two different sets of arithmetic books were used in Israel. One for the secular schools, employing an inverted “T” sign.. In the early ’70’s the religious fanatics “converted” the Labour Party to the great danger of the cross in arithmetic, and from that time, in all Hebrew elementary schools (and now many high schools as well) the international plus sign has been forbidden. Similar development is visible in other areas of education.

 

[cwalner]

I don't extrapolate to anyplace in the world outside of Israel. The Jews only spit only in Israel, and only on clergymen and women. The ultra-orthodox are not fringe elements, they are the essence of true Judaism.

Ach, Laddie, I beleive yae haf commited a fallicy. Yae ken which one?

Unfortunately this fallicy is lost on you, because claiming that ultra-orthodox jews are the essence of true Judaism is the equivalent of claiming that the KKK is the essence of true Christianity. Unfortunately, you are receiving your information from David Duke, so I imagine that argument may be somewhat lost on you.

But, spitting sometimes just isn't enough .... get this .. (not from Shahak)

From AD 200 to the early 1800’s, a religious European Jew was required to spit in the direction of any church he walked past. On Christian holidays in Europe, a Jew was required to pray for Jesus to suffer in Hell. Even recently, the ceremony to convert to Judaism in Israel, given over to the ultra-Orthodox of Kibbutz Sa’ad and financed by the Israeli government, required spitting on the cross.

I rolled an 18 on my will save, so I succesfully disbelieve. You care to cite that

 

[Loss Leader]

The ultra-orthodox are not fringe elements, they are the essence of true Judaism.

The vast majority of Jews and the organizations which represent them would disagree with you. There is no agreeent inside or outside Jewish organizations as to what "true" Judaism entails. My Conservative Rabbi would disagree with the Reform Rabbi down the street about such a concept, and they would both disagree with the Orthodox Rabbi down the street the other way.

One might as well say that Nebraskans are the essence of true Americanism, or that your butt is the essence of true Saggy-ism. Those assertions are equally unprovable and meaningless.

A statement is not true simply because you would like it to be.

it's an official part of the conversion process from Christianity to Judaism to spit on the cross.

To check this, I called my uncle who converted to Judaism from Catholicism. He said this was wrong. In fact, I bet you cannot find one single Jewish convert anywhere on the planet earth (including anyone who later converted back) who supports this statement. It is a lie.

 

[Foolmewunz]

What Better Than To Turn a Saggy Thread Into a Jewish Joke Festival? Nu?

So, Sadie, who'd survived Buchenwald where her husband and brother and sister-in-law all died, goes to America and remarries. She has a daughter who gives her a grandson, but dies in a car crash with her husband when the baby's only two. Sadie takes him down to Boca Raton and is walking the toddler along the beach one day when a huge wave crashes ashore and sweeps the kid out to sea!

My God! Why"have you forsaken me? First I lose my Abe and his sister Rebecca and my dear brother Herschl in that horrible camp. Then I finally find happiness in New York and marry Hyman, only to have him die of an aneurism at 41, and then you take my Sarah and her Yoshua away from me in that car crash. And now? Now? With only one thing in the world that gives me some happiness after these seventy years, you take my grandson from me for no reason? Why, God??? Why?????

Just then a little curler of a wave comes ashore and deposits the little boy a mere two feet from Sadie. Looking at the sky, she says, "He had a hat, ya know!"

 

[r-j]

I typed into Google the phrase "a religious European Jew was required to spit in the direction of any church he walked past" and found the source right away.

It's from the book, Jewish History, Jewish Religion: The Weight of Three Thousand Years

Amazon says in a review-

Shahak, who came to Israel in 1945 after surviving the concentration camp in Belsen during the Holocaust, contends that the potential for Israel's right-wing Jewish religious movements to seize power represents a threat to the peace of Israel and to the Zionist movement. He posits that Israel as a Jewish state constitutes a danger not only to itself and its inhabitants, but to all Jews and to all other people and states in the Middle East. Shahak, who was raised as an Orthodox Jew, condemns what he sees as discrimination against non-Jewish citizens of Israel.

Jewish History, Jewish Religion: The Weight of Three Thousand Years

So according to this Jewish author, Orthodox Jews did spit, and did, and still do, treat non-jews in a fashion that arouses animosity against all jews.

Again from Wikipeida - "Shahak's writings on Judaism have been a source of widespread controversy."

I imagine that is a bit of an understatement.

 

[cwalner]

Continuation of the Jewish Joke festival

Upon Mt. Sainai, Moses is receiving the Torah.

God proclaims through the burning bush "THOU SHALT NOT SEETHE THE KID IN ITS MOTHERS MILK."

Moses is a bit confused. "What does that mean, Lord? We should not cook meat in milk?"

God repeats "THOU SHALT NOT SEETHE THE KID IN ITS MOTHERS MILK."

Moses responds "But what do you mean, Lord? We should never serve meat and dairy in the same meal?"

Again, God repeats "THOU SHALT NOT SEETHE THE KID IN ITS MOTHERS MILK."

Moses continues "Do you mean that we should have two completely seperate sets of ovens and cookware? One for meat and one for milk?"

Finally God answers (In a typicaly New York, Jewish accent) "FINE, HAVE IT YOUR WAY"

 

[Maja]

From AD 200 to the early 1800’s, a religious European Jew was required to spit in the direction of any church he walked past.

How did "religious European Jews" manage to carry out this requirement between AD 200 and the Edict of Milan in AD 313, when there were no recognisable church buildings and Christians held their meetings in secret?

 

[cwalner]

I typed into Google the phrase "a religious European Jew was required to spit in the direction of any church he walked past" and found the source right away.

It's from the book, Jewish History, Jewish Religion: The Weight of Three Thousand Years

While, I appreciate the link, this does nothing to truly edify the situation. Saggy is claiming Shahak as the source for other antisemitic drivel. In fact he explicitly claimed that this info came from somebody other than Shahak.

 

[r-j]

Well originally it probably did. Shahak must have used a source for the information.

 

[Doctor Evil]

While, I appreciate the link, this does nothing to truly edify the situation. Saggy is claiming Shahak as the source for other antisemitic drivel. In fact he explicitly claimed that this info came from somebody other than Shahak.

In any case, Shahak is a well known source of antisemitic drivel. This shows two points. i) That you can belong to a group and be prejudiced against it, and ii) that antisemites love it when they find can find a Jew which agrees with some of their points.

 

[Foolmewunz]

Well originally it probably did. Shahak must have used a source for the information.

I'd love to see it if there is one. Shahak was a notoriously bad scholar. He used footnotes scantily - or should I say, "intentionally scantily". He's a published Dr. of Chemistry, so knows how to write a proper paper or study, but his political writings are very weak in that regard.

In numerous (there are dozens upon dozens) articles on the issue of spitting, not one cites anything from traditional teachings or any historical documents - except the works of Shahak.

If you come across any such reference, please provide it. You also might've gone a little deeper into the Wiki article. Saying his works are controversial is putting it mildly. He's the poster boy for Stormfront and Anti-Israeli Islamist sites (not that they are in the least related - just pointing out who's using his material, and it ain't serious scholars).