Moderated Iron sun with Aether batteries...

[Michael Mozina]

Talk about delusions and wilful ignorance.
GM Has explained *EVERY* pixel on the images. They are the result of the RD process.

No. He described the mechanical process of how an RD image is created. In no way did he explain any cause/effect relationships between any specific solar activity and any specific pixel in any specific image. You folks are absolutely clueless.

 

[GeeMack]

You did *NOT* explain the rigid outlines under the wave. You simply ignored the data you don't want to deal with as usual. Care to try again?

Sure, right after you answer this one: Whose face is this?


And now that you've officially bailed out on supporting your claim to understanding running difference images, you know nobody will let you forget that.

 

[GeeMack]

No. He described the mechanical process of how an RD image is created. In no way did he explain any cause/effect relationships between any specific solar activity and any specific pixel in any specific image. You folks are absolutely clueless.

You don't even understand the mechanical process, Michael. You do not have the qualifications to speak with any authority whatsoever on the issue of running difference images. Let it go, man. You're only making yourself look more and more foolish each time you throw another tantrum and each time you ignore another request to explain the graphs, pixel by pixel, like myself and several others have done.

 

[Reality Check]

By your logic, that cannot happen. The corona should heat all the layers up to millions of degrees according to your notions of heat flow! You simply *assume* it heats up below the photosphere. Most of the studies of sunspots reveal they have *COOLER* plasma in them. How is that possible if the temperature under the photosphere 'heats up'? Where does that lower temperature plasma come from if not from under the photosphere?

By the laws of physics it can and does happen.

All sunspots have cooler plasma than their surrounding plasma and the mechanism is well understood. I sugeest that you learn something about the Sun .

I do not *assume* it. It is *measured*.

Originally Posted by Tim Thompson
Limb observations of the sun make it possible to retrieve the temperature structure of the photosphere as a function of depth, in much the same way as limb observations of Earth's atmosphere by satellites allows us to retrieve temperature profiles for the Earth's atmosphere (see, e.g., Solar Astrophysics by Peter Foukal, Wiley-VCh 2004, chapter 5: "The photosphere"; The Observation and Analysis of Stellar Photospheres by David Gray, Cambridge University Press 2005, 3rd edition). The temperature at the lowest level we can determine is 9400 Kelvins

 

[Michael Mozina]

Alternately:
brantc,
Can we take it that you are OK with Michael Mozina hijacking this thread for his version of your idea?
If so I will copy the list of outstanding questions about his idea to here.

How exactly is attempting to demonstrate the existence of a solid surface a hijack of his thread? I was careful to even point out that wireless transmission of electricity is a demonstrated real process. You seem to have an unusual notion of a hijack.

 

[Michael Mozina]

Sure, right after you answer this one: Whose face is this?

Another dodge. How cute.

And now that you've officially bailed out on supporting your claim to understanding running difference images, you know nobody will let you forget that.

How have I "officially bailed out" of anything in your mind? Are you going to send me your info, yes or no? Are you afraid of what might happen if you do?

 

[Reality Check]

What the hell are you talking about? Those aren't "fake" RD images! Why would I even "fake" an RD image in the first place let alone invest 2500 dollars in IDL software? You don't even make any sense.

One of the few times that you have ever said anything right.
They are not "fake" RD images because no one knows why or how you created or copied these images.
They look like altered images of the Sun. They show no rigid structures, just the usual solar activity of the plasma in the photosphere.

 

[Michael Mozina]

Just out of morbid curiosity, how are the RD images I cited a "fraud" in your opinion? How does one "fake" a running difference image exactly?

 

[Reality Check]

Why would superheated plasma from the CME "fall back as a dark cloud" if it's not made of heavier materials? What exactly causes "coronal rain" in your opinion?

It falls back as a "dark cloud" because the TRACE astronomers are describing images that appear in the RD movie - a "black cloud" that falls back toward the surface. It does this beacuse of a little thing called gravity.

 

[Michael Mozina]

One of the few times that you have ever said anything right.
They are not "fake" RD images because no one knows why or how you created or copied these images.
They look like altered images of the Sun. They show no rigid structures, just the usual solar activity of the plasma in the photosphere.

Actually RC, nobody has ever accused me of fraud before let alone over something so petty and stupid. I would not even have a clue how to "fake" a running difference image and I certainly would not have invested in IDL software if I intended to "fake" any images on my website. In fact I have been extremely careful to use only LMSAL and NASA images (or public domain images) rather than using any of my own image with the exception of the four images I cited just so that nobody would attempt to accuse me of image manipulation of any sort. The fact he would be so stupid and so arrogant about those four specific images is simply unbelievable and I will make him pay dearly for his libelous comments if he is man enough to send me his real info.

 

[GeeMack]

Another dodge. How cute.

And you apparently don't understand that until you can tell me whose face that is, I can't tell you what the rigid stuff is in your image.

Now I can come up with at least one very well evidenced explanation for why you see things that aren't really there, but I'm sure you wouldn't find it very flattering.

How have I "officially bailed out" of anything in your mind? Are you going to send me your info, yes or no? Are you afraid of what might happen if you do?

Sue me. I have nothing to fear by calling your fraudulent material fraudulent. Maybe you want to ask your lawyer how well you'll do in a court case where you're required to demonstrate that those fakes are genuine running difference images. Let me know what he says, eh?

But, so as to not let you change the subject too far, a common strategy for you when you can't answer a question or you run your mouth and people actually expect you to back up your claims...

How is it that anyone might take an image containing data that was obtained thousands of kilometers above the Sun's surface, and process that data so that it somehow ends up showing solid surface features thousands of kilometers below and under a totally opaque photosphere?

 

[Hellbound]

Actually RC, nobody has ever accused me of fraud before let alone over something so petty and stupid. I would not even have a clue how to "fake" a running difference image and I certainly would not have invested in IDL software if I intended to "fake" any images on my website. In fact I have been extremely careful to use only LMSAL and NASA images (or public domain images) rather than using any of my own image with the exception of the four images I cited just so that nobody would attempt to accuse me of image manipulation of any sort. The fact he would be so stupid and so arrogant about those four specific images is simply unbelievable and I will make him pay dearly for his libelous comments if he is man enough to send me his real info.

Well, if you seriously think you've been libelled and/or slandered (not sure which applies to an internet post), you can start the suit and have a court order issued to JREF to get his real info.

I mean, really, posturing that you'll get him "if he only sends his real info" is a rather, um, juvenile attempt at intimidation.

Reminds me of playgrounds around the nation..."Yeah, you're lucky I have to catch the bus or I'd beat you up good!"

Looks around for more gas to throw on the fire

 

[Michael Mozina]

Well, if you seriously think you've been libelled and/or slandered (not sure which applies to an internet post), you can start the suit and have a court order issued to JREF to get his real info.

That's expensive and slow. If he's so sure of himself, he can send me a real name and address and we'll settle this fast and permanently.

 

[Michael Mozina]

And you apparently don't understand that until you can tell me whose face that is, I can't tell you what the rigid stuff is in your image.

What type of dodge is that? It's not even clever or relevant. All you're doing is demonstrating to everyone that you have no interest in honestly or openly dealing with that rigid element under the wave. That's pure denial GM.

 

[GeeMack]

Just out of morbid curiosity, how are the RD images I cited a "fraud" in your opinion? How does one "fake" a running difference image exactly?

I already explained that, too. You run a couple of STEREO images through a few PhotoShop filters and voila, you get the fakes you're passing off as running difference images.

 

[Michael Mozina]

I already explained that, too. You run a couple of STEREO images through a few PhotoShop filters and voila, you get the fakes you're passing off as running difference images.

How would that even be a "fake" RD image? What exactly constitutes a "real" RD image, and why would one particular image manipulation program be "fake" or only one image program "real"?

Are you going to email me your info?

 

[D'rok]

Then what are those rigid features under the wave in Kosovichev's video? Stop dodging that direct question.

Kosovichev's own explanation should suffice, yes? He says they aren't rigid features nor are they under the "wave". Why should we believe you and not him?

 

[GeeMack]

What type of dodge is that? It's not even clever or relevant. All you're doing is demonstrating to everyone that you have no interest in honestly or openly dealing with that rigid element under the wave. That's pure denial GM.

Michael, honestly, truthfully, and to the best of not only my knowledge but to the best of the knowledge of every last professional physicist on the face of this planet including Dr. Kosovichev, there is no rigid element under the wave.

Like I said, I could certainly venture an opinion based on a half a decade worth of evidence as to why you believe you see something solid there. But it would only piss you off. And I'm sure I'm not the only one here who would rather see you stop throwing tantrums and start trying to support your crackpot notion about the Sun.

And just so we don't forget, your qualifications to analyze and/or explain running difference images has been challenged, and so far you have outright refused to support your claim of being qualified.

 

[Michael Mozina]

Kosovichev's own explanation should suffice, yes?

Why? Are you appealing to authority perhaps?

He says they aren't rigid features nor are they under the "wave". Why should we believe you and not him?

You should believe me because he offered us no relevant way to explain the rigid outlines in the video, just as nobody here will offer us a relevant way to explain those features using a plasma sun model.

 

[Michael Mozina]

Michael, honestly, truthfully, and to the best of not only my knowledge but to the best of the knowledge of every last professional physicist on the face of this planet including Dr. Kosovichev, there is no rigid element under the wave.

Well, the problem is that none of you account for that rigid outline under the wave. To his credit Dr. Kosovichev spent many emails with me trying to do so, but he ultimately didn't offer us a physically viable method to explain it. You won't do that either.

And just so we don't forget, your qualifications to analyze and/or explain running difference images has been challenged, and so far you have outright refused to support your claim of being qualified.

I don't even know what makes you think that *YOU* are qualified to explain a solar RD image. So far all you've done is talk about the technique mathematically and you have outright ignored the solar processes and the specific pixels in specific images. What exactly are your qualifications as it relates to solar physics? I accept that you understand the math related to RD image processing but I see no evidence at all that you know squat about solar physics or solar images in general.