Hardfire: Szamboti / Chandler / Mackey

[bill smith]

And you guys have let bill draw you into his bullshyte again...

When are you ever gonna learn.

He doesn't play the same game you play.
He doesn't care about logic.
He doesn't care about correct & incorrect.
He doesn't care that you PROVE him to be a moron.

HE ... DOES ... NOT ... CARE.

Every time you answer him, even when you demolish his bs argument, he considers it a victory.

If you can't exercise the self-restraint, I highly recommend the ignore button.

He WILL get more & more desperate.
He WILL start to say more & more ludicrous things. (Yeah, even more so than now.)
He WILL show his true agenda.

He has been at this, EVERY SINGLE DAY of the week for about 3 years now.

Don't you get it?


Tom.

PS. The cherry on top is that, if you really, truly, simply ignore him, it WILL drive him bat-guano crazy. I dare you to try it.

It is the one & only path to ending his ability to pull every single conversation here down to a 3rd grade level.

WHICH IS PRECISELY HIS INTENT...!!!

And you guys LET HIM do it.

Really T ? Have you ever known me to grow desperate before ? Please provide a lnk from your massive compendium if you can prove it. Otherwise...?

I suggest that your call for people to ignore me displays the real desperation around here. You are not the first as readers may be aware. I think there may be other callers even on this page.

 

[bill smith]

I think you're on to something here, bill. As we all know, hundreds of warehouses, only minutes away from Manhattan, maintain trucks pre-loaded with fire extinguishers and kept on hand for just such an emergency.

I think there were possibly thousands of skyscrapers just full of them a stone's throw away from ground zero. What do you think ? Could that be ?

 

[bill smith]

So only a small portion are involved with the coverup yet all of them are lying to coverup the conspiracy.

How can you not see a contradiction?

If they are lying they are involved in a coverup.

Now that you have got the first part let's work on the second part.

Most of the ordinary direfighters would have just done their jobs and been aware of nothing to do with an inside job. As simple as that. Any of the few who were in the know or suspected and posed any risk of spillng the beans would have been threatened, and their families threatened in he most extreme way imaginable. Now I think you may see that the coverup of the complicity of a number of FDNY members was not particularly difficult even up to this day.

 

[tfk]

MUUUUCH better.

See how nice this is?

Quiet. Sane.

AAAhhhhhhhh...

Say, does anybody have any George Winston that they could put on...?

You guys learn quick.




Tom

PS. Now, how about someone get back to discussing the Hardfire debate. Or has that one pretty much petered out for the moment?

 

[Mangoose]

I bet if he were tortured a bit, he'd confess. They all deserve a bit of torture, those conspirators, don't they? After what they done.

It is educational, if not scary, to see the scapegoating process at work.

 

[Edx]

Now I think you may see that the coverup of the complicity of a number of FDNY members was not particularly difficult even to this day.

I think you are lying again since you have ignored everything I said. Well done.

 

[bill smith]

MUUUUCH better.

See how nice this is?

Quiet. Sane.

AAAhhhhhhhh...

Say, does anybody have any George Winston that they could put on...?

You guys learn quick.




Tom

PS. Now, how about someone get back to discussing the Hardfire debate. Or has that one pretty much petered out for the moment?

I guess you must be the head honcho around here T. ? These guys need a bit of guidance.

 

[bill smith]

I think you are lying again since you have ignored everything I said. Well done.

Are yoou asking me to post the firemen's statements ? And the video study of the 118 firemen who witnessed explosions ?

 

[Tony Szamboti]

Wow. Just came back to this thread to witness Tony Szamboti devolving into an average truther, having being defeated at his 'A' game, the missing jolt theory.
Having now abandoned any pretense of sound engineering to back up his conspiracy beliefs, Tony is now letting his delusions run free for all to see.

Remember the tilt Tony, and how you denied it happened right away, because you knew that it destroyed your argument? Remember how you ran away from WTC2 because it automatically destroyed your argument?

I don't blame you for evading those realities, because they threaten your worldview and scare you. So go play amongst the other truthers, and abandon the adult world. If you accuse FDNY of being part of mass murder, we understand - you are delusional, pure and simple.

Bardamu, the idea of irreducible delusion is not a smear, it is a theory, as elucidated by Mr. Mackey. You would do well to read his words.

I don't see how you can say asking why the fires weren't fought in WTC 7 is anything but a legitimate question. I would have brought it up in the debate if Ron and Ryan had been willing to discuss WTC 7 further than the couple of times I mentioned something about it.

If you actually read what I said you would realize that I do not think any member of the FDNY had to be in on any conspiracy and that it could have been done by simply manipulating Daniel Nigro. I would also be asking severe questions of those in the Giulliani administration who put the word out that WTC 7 was lost at 12:30 PM. What basis was there for that?

You seem to want to call people delusional simply because what they say doesn't fit with your actual delusion. Talk facts not nonsense.

 

[beachnut]

Are yoou asking ne to post the firemen's statements ? And the video study of the 118 firemen who witnessed explosions ?

Your ignorance knows no bounds on 911 (but you are as good as Tony on engineering issues). Many of the explosions were bodies hitting the ground. You are sick and the most shallow researcher who posts lies and delusional junk. You have not changed or tried to gain knowledge.

The ignore button is not enough

 

[Tony Szamboti]

Exactly. Hence my comment about Tony's suggestion that there were distant fire hydrants that could have been used. Well how distant? I mean if they were over in New Jersey...as an extreme example.

TAM

There is a reason they make pumper trucks.

It can be shown in a sound way that there would have been no problem bringing water to WTC 7 from the fireboats or hydrants from 1 or even 2 miles away and sending it with sufficient pressure to the 20th floor. The fireboats were only a few hundred yards away and had massive pumps on them which probably wouldn't even require augmentation. If there was a need, firetruck pumpers could be employed to compensate for any pressure loss due to distance. The same would go for using water from distant hydrants.

 

[carlitos]

If you actually read what I said you would realize that I do not think any member of the FDNY had to be in on any conspiracy and that it could have been done by simply manipulating Daniel Nigro.

Using the passive voice and avoiding a subject when making these accusations is despicable. Unless you have proof that SOMEONE "manipulated" Daniel Nigro, shut your mouth and go away.

 

[bill smith]

Your ignorance knows no bounds on 911 (but you are as good as Tony on engineering issues). Many of the explosions were bodies hitting the ground. You are sick and the most shallow researcher who posts lies and delusional junk. You have not changed or tried to gain knowledge.

The ignore button is not enough

Maybe if you try jumping up and down on it a few times....

 

[Edx]

Are yoou asking me to post the firemen's statements ? And the video study of the 118 firemen who witnessed explosions ?

We already know of those quote mines, Bill.

But we are talking about WTC7, remember?

1. How many had a problem with the idea that Building 7 would collapse?
2. How many said they should have been able to have fought the fires?
3. How many said they heard explosions?
4. How many said there were only a few insolated pockets of fire?
5. How many said they had a problem with how Building 7 collapsed?

Zero. But you know that already.

 

[DGM]

There is a reason they make pumper trucks.

I can show in a sound way that there would have been no problem bringing water to WTC 7 from the fireboats or hydrants from 1 mile away and sending it with sufficient pressure to the 20th floor.

Why WTC7 and not 90 W or the Verizon building or World financial? What's so special about WTC 7? Please don't say it had to be destroyed to get rid of evidence, a paper shredder can do that. Really, has anyone ever come up with a logical reason to risk more lives to save this building?

 

[Edx]

I don't see how you can say asking why the fires weren't fought in WTC 7 is anything but a legitimate question. .

Well why dont you actually ask the FDNY instead of insinuating on message boards and asking leading rhetorical questions over at AE911truth?

 

[Tony Szamboti]

Why WTC7 and not 90 W or the Verizon building or World financial? What's so special about WTC 7? Please don't say it had to destroyed to get rid of evidence, a paper shredder can do that. Really, has anyone ever come up with a logical reason to risk more lives to save this building?

Are you actually claiming that somebody could have gotten rid of the Enron California electricity scam files in the SEC offices of WTC 7 by using a paper shredder?

 

[Tony Szamboti]

Well why dont you actually ask the FDNY instead of insinuating on message boards and asking leading rhetorical questions over at AE911truth?

The AE911truth petition, which I am a signatory of, is asking for a new investigation with subpoena power to depose a number of people who were involved in the events of Sept. 11, 2001 in NYC. Chief Daniel Nigro, elevator maintenance and security co. employees from the towers, Giulliani administration officials, and Larry Silverstein would be among those who should be put under oath.

A lot of these unanswered questions could be answered that way.

I can't depose anyone and put them under oath and it is silly to even suggest that I go asking these questions of these people myself.

 

[Edx]

Are you actually claiming that somebody could have gotten rid of the Enron California electricity scam files in the SEC offices of WTC 7 by using a paper shredder?

The papper shredder example is just to say that coming up with a massive conspiracy to demonlish your building, pay off or scare firefighters into lying about it, invent super secret silent explosives, pay off clean up crews etc etc etc... all to destroy some documents...is ridiculous.

 

[bill smith]

We already know of those quote mines, Bill.

But we are talking about WTC7, remember?

1. How many had a problem with the idea that Building 7 would collapse?
2. How many said they should have been able to have fought the fires?
3. How many said they heard explosions?
4. How many said there were only a few insolated pockets of fire?
5. How many said they had a problem with how Building 7 collapsed?

Zero. But you know that already.

I will expeect you to have an answer to this. I say that we have seen almost nothing of the firemen who were at ground zero on 9/11. The only info we really get is from he Fealgood Foundation is about how they are dying like flies
from diseases caused by the comtsaminents at ground zero that the government ordered the EPA to deny.

So tell me why the public we have seen so litle of the firemen ?