Moderated What's wrong with porn?

[Sledge]

Just to point out again that the problem with the "all porn actresses were abused as children" claim is not that it is wrong (I have no idea), just that it is irrelevant. You could eliminate all the porn in the world tomorrow and it would not change the fact that those women were victims of abuse. Whether they go into porn or investment banking doesn't make their past abuse go away, and does not stop it from happening.

Hence my saying this:

A lot of rape and sexual abuse counselors were themselves raped or sexually abused. Clearly these jobs need to be outlawed.

There's no logic to saying a job should be outlawed because a certain type of person gravitates towards it unless you can also show that the job is in some way bad. The anti-porn types never seem to get that part of it. I've yet to see anyone argue against porn with anything other than their personal distaste for it.

 

[Eric D]

Really? What "major assumptions" do you believe I've made?

Not believe. Know. You said numerous times that, based on your own experiences, most women would not want to go into porn. Your reason for not wanting to date a porn star is because you'd be at a higher risk of contracting an STD. If you spout off information like this without verifying it first, you are clearly making assumptions.

 

[Southwind17]

I'd like to interject that there are quite a lot of girls who write and draw porn for no compensation, as a hobby. I'm curious if Southwind is interested in discussing whether there's something wrong with this as well [emboldening added].

This is the wrong tree, is it? I thought it was a straightforward if somewhat sarky response to the OP. I have not accused you of being anti-porn [emboldening added], rather I am trying to figure out what you are on about with this 'no woman I know would ever want to do sex for pay' angle, by introducing the idea of women who are involved in porn without having sex for pay.

First, I interpreted the emboldened qualifier in the first quotation above as evidence that you had concluded that I think there's something wrong with porn. I can see the possible alternative interpretation, however, namely the introduction of written and drawn porn into the discussion as a slightly different subject. I believe you intended the first interpretation, however, which does raise a question over the emboldened words in the second quotation above, but I don't really think there's any mileage in going there. Feel free to correct me, though, if I'm wrong.

Second, quite simply, Lithrael, the writing and drawing of porn "as a hobby" is not what I had in mind when I posed the question, and clarified it thus:

I suppose my definition, on the hoof, is simply the publication of sexual images and material, essentially for commercial purposes.

Now, I can see why you might wish to argue that, technically, the type of porn you refer to fits within my "on the hoof definition" and persist with your enquiry, but the way that porn is produced is, certainly in my mind, implicit within my definition (I'll happily expand the definition if that helps), and I certainly didn't have written and drawn porn in mind, for the simple reason that I honestly never come across porn produced using such media. I'm not suggesting it doesn't exist - I know written porn does, and I have no doubt that drawn porn does - I'm just not particularly into still images (even photos) or the written word when it comes to porn. Sorry if that dissappoints.

 

[Southwind17]

You will, I trust, understand when I say I really don't care.

Oh yes - I understand alright. Just like you "didn't care" when you took the time to make the post.

 

[BenBurch]

 

[Southwind17]

It seems most women do not want to be engineers, so clearly engineering is demeaning to women.

And what application of "logic" draws you to that sarcastic conclusion? If most women don't wish to do "x" that's because there's something about "x" that deters most women. Most engineers are men, so one can draw an inference that most women don't want to become engineers (there could be other reasons, of course). So far as engineering goes I can appreciate what would deter most women (I can't necessarily explain it, but I can appreciate it). I can also appreciate what would deter most women from pursuing a porn career. Interestingly, I can also explain it, which I think I've essentially done already. And there, my friend, lies the flaw in your logic, sarcastic or otherwise. QED!

 

[Southwind17]

I am wondering. He seems to actually hate sexworkers.

??????

 

[Southwind17]

I would like to make an observation here, and it may be way off-base. If so, then I apologise.
Southwind17 has said that he likes porn, and in fact "can't get enough of it". He also thinks that most women who do porn don't want to do it.

Er ... stop right there.

So I can't help wondering how Southwind17 reconciles he admitted enjoyment of porn with his claim that he believes that most porn is exploitational. Like I said, if I'm off the mark with this, I'll withdraw the question.

Yes - I think a rapid withdrawal would be appropriate!

 

[Southwind17]

What is this supposed to be? A threat?

Yeah - like I'm going to bash you over the head with a digital club!

Sorry, but whatever your motives are and however correct [or incorrect] I am about them means virtually nothing to me outside of this discussion. What do you mean by dangerous anyway? Am I in danger of being dead wrong about what your motives are? If so, I can live with that. No sweat.

You can sleep soundly tonight buddy - I assure you!

 

[arthwollipot]

Er ... stop right there.


Yes - I think a rapid withdrawal would be appropriate!

Okay. I'm off-base. I withdraw the question. I have misinterpreted what has been said, and I apologise for that. Returning to lurk...

 

[Southwind17]

Yes, leads to, but is not answered with. In your case, one question leads to you dancing around said question without ever answering it.
My question is "How is it relevant whether or not most women would want to work in porn?" You have yet to answer.
Ron's question is "Where is your proof that most women wouldn't want to work in porn?" Your answer was that it's obvious and you don't need proof.

Hey - pack it in - I'm the one asking the questions around here!

 

[Southwind17]

Why not? If it paid well and your children were happy doing it, why should it matter?

You really believe getting paid well and being happy in your job (for however long your career lasts!) are the only two factors in career choice?

You said yourself that porn wasn't wrong, yet you seem to have quite a few issues with it.

To be accurate (which is important around here) I wrote ""wrong"".

 

[Southwind17]

In response to you claiming most women would not want to work in porn. "what are you trying to say?" In other words, "Why is it relevant?" Don't just take a snippet of the conversation to make me sound vague in my inquiry. You know damn well what I meant, what I have been asking, and you still have not answered me. Again, you are dancing around the question.

I think you should re-read the thread in its entirety rather than keeping on poking me with a digital pointy stick. You should find the answer you're so desperately seeking.

 

[makaya325]

Whats wrong with Internet porn: Pop-ups and Virus's!

 

[Southwind17]

Read between the lines, dummy. He's mocking you.

Talk about smug! You honestly think there's not much to the world outside your microcosm of experience don't you?

Have you actually joined this Forum for a reason other than to vent your seemingly extraneous frustration? Tip: try kick boxing or squash.

 

[Southwind17]

Not believe. Know. You said numerous times that, based on your own experiences, most women would not want to go into porn.

That's not an assumption, let alone a "major" one.

Your reason for not wanting to date a porn star is because you'd be at a higher risk of contracting an STD.

I don't think I actually said that. But even if I did, I can assure you it would be based on much more than assumption - it would be based in fact (think about the scenarios before challenging!).

If you spout off information like this without verifying it first, you are clearly making assumptions.

I suggest you review closely who's doing most of the "spouting" around here.

 

[Southwind17]

Jeez - I've caught up. I can do some work now while most of you sleep (soundly Eric!).

 

[arthwollipot]

Yeah - take a break, man. You've been working too hard.

 

[JFrankA]

I'm cool with that. You don't know, I do, so what?!


What was all that about "making a general assumption without any facts or data to back you up"? See how that works?!


Well thank you for clarifying that not insignificant point.


You might well have lived your life (so far) wearing blinkers and ear muffs, but I can assure you I haven't.

Read between the lines, dummy. He's mocking you.

You know, Eric, when I blatantly mock someone like that, using their own words against them, and they A) don't see it, and B) claim superiority, it just makes the mocking all the more sweeter.....

 

[Southwind17]

Don't you agree that most women taken from a cross section of society would deplore the idea of being a porn actress?

Most women taken from a cross section of society might deplore the idea of being a trashman. Does that mean that trashmen have low self-esteem?

Tell you what, why don't you explain exactly why you're focusing on trashmen here, as opposed to, say, doctors. Seriously - please do. Depending on your response I might then entertain your request.

I'm not. I'm just using trashmen as a counter-example. I might just as well have used any other low-status profession.

"Low-status profession"! Not sure what you mean. Care to expand?

Is it "low-status" or "profession" you're pretending you don't know what means?

I assure you there's no pretense on my part. You used the term "low-status profession". I'm not sure what you mean when you use that term, and I'd like you to explain, however you'd like to cut it.

I'm still keen to hear Leif Roar's rationale for selecting "low-status profession" as the comparator with being a porn star. Does Leif Roar consider that being a porn star is a "low-status profession"? Does Leif Roar consider that "low-status profession" have something in common with that of a porn star? If so, I wonder what Leif Roar would offer as that commonality. Leif Roar? Anybody?