Merged Skeptics vs. Knowers/Believers

King of the Americas said:
That would explain the shape shifting... OR

More likely, I think, that my perception was was tainted by the drink...?
Click to expand...

maybe you just got confused between centimetres and inches, that happens a lot when people drink, but as you havent got any credible witnesses we'll never know

wait, did your ufo spotting buddy see it too ?
:p
 
Last edited:
King of the Americas said:
I am proposing that a skeptic would refuse to accept their own experiences, if there was no evidence to back it up...

"What you are saying happened is impossible, therefore you didn't SEE what you claim to have seen. It was a delusion."

Without evidence what else could it be?
Click to expand...
Nope, a skeptic would either assume that they were mistaken, or, properly, sigh and accept that they do not have an explanation and not enough evidence to reach a conclusion, rather than make stuff up to fill the gap in their knowledge.

You saw something that you can't explain, and then you made something up because you can't accept that there isn't a rational explanation. You have no evidence at all to categorize what you saw, but you give it a category anyway. That's a "God of the gaps" argument, or in your case a "More highly evolved creatures than us of the gaps" argument.

Show us some actual evidence that we are living in a world that is also home to a more highly evolved species and we might take you seriously. But so far all you've come up with is "people have been seeing things they can't explain for as long as we have records, so there must be something to it!"

As arguments go it's fairly near the bottom of the pile.
 
wollery said:
Show us some actual evidence that we are living in a world that is also home to a more highly evolved species and we might take you seriously. But so far all you've come up with is "people have been seeing things they can't explain for as long as we have records, so there must be something to it!"

As arguments go it's fairly near the bottom of the pile.
Click to expand...

as I know specifically what he based that statement on I can tell you that it is actually the bottom of the pile, hidden under the denial
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=145251&page=5
;)
 
wollery said:
Nope, a skeptic would either assume that they were mistaken, or, properly, sigh and accept that they do not have an explanation and not enough evidence to reach a conclusion, rather than make stuff up to fill the gap in their knowledge.

You saw something that you can't explain, and then you made something up because you can't accept that there isn't a rational explanation. You have no evidence at all to categorize what you saw, but you give it a category anyway. That's a "God of the gaps" argument, or in your case a "More highly evolved creatures than us of the gaps" argument.

Show us some actual evidence that we are living in a world that is also home to a more highly evolved species and we might take you seriously. But so far all you've come up with is "people have been seeing things they can't explain for as long as we have records, so there must be something to it!"

As arguments go it's fairly near the bottom of the pile.
Click to expand...

I think this is a mischaracterization of my stance.

I don't know what it was that I saw. I do however, know what it it wasn't.

Thus my categorizing them as "non-human"

The other label I gave them was 'better', because they demonstrated superior maneuverability skills.

I find moreover, that there's no need for them to be 'alien' or E.T., because there are plenty of local places that we've not fully explored, AND they've always been here, according to our history.

So, your "god of the gaps" label is inaccurate in comparison to my arguments.

It'd have been more accurate to apply that to those who 'worship' these things as "God", which I find no evidence of...
 
King of the Americas said:
I think this is a mischaracterization of my stance.

I don't know what it was that I saw. I do however, know what it it wasn't.
Click to expand...


You assert that, yet you haven't actually checked all the possibilities for what-it-wasn't. Your position is based on faith, a simple belief.

Thus my categorizing them as "non-human"

The other label I gave them was 'better', because they demonstrated superior maneuverability skills.

I find moreover, that there's no need for them to be 'alien' or E.T., because there are plenty of local places that we've not fully explored, [...]
Click to expand...


Not to the extent that there could exist a civilization of evolutionarily advanced beings who operate flying craft in our skies, there aren't. To believe otherwise would require an irrational faith, much like religion.

[...] AND they've always been here, according to our history.
Click to expand...


Simply not true.

So, your "god of the gaps" label is inaccurate in comparison to my arguments.

It'd have been more accurate to apply that to those who 'worship' these things as "God", which I find no evidence of...
Click to expand...


Actually the "god of the gaps" comments in this thread have nothing to do with the concept of worship, and fit your position perfectly. It's a metaphor. It's not about gods. In this discussion it's about your refusal to simply allow that you don't know what you saw, and irrationally filling in the "I-don't-know" spaces with something you want to continue to believe.
 
GeeMack said:
You assert that, yet you haven't actually checked all the possibilities for what-it-wasn't. Your position is based on faith, a simple belief.
Click to expand...

I have so far come up with NO 'human' contraption that could explain or compare to what I saw. I have seen 'most' American planes, either airborne, or up close. I've never seen, heard of, nor considered possible that human craft could accomplish those tasks. If you knew me at all, you'd know that I am totally sans faith in anything. I find faith entirely useless. What I do put weight in, is research. I've done it, read it, and looked through it, repeatedly. NOTHING by our handy-work 'combines' to form a larger version of itself. But I AM 'open' to this possibility... Show it to me. Name the model number, and trot it out for a demo-flight. If humans are this capable, we should have this global climate change thing licked in no time.

GeeMack said:
Not to the extent that there could exist a civilization of evolutionarily advanced beings who operate flying craft in our skies, there aren't. To believe otherwise would require an irrational faith, much like religion.
Click to expand...

..."irrational faith,..."

We can't find Osama bin Laden, a REAL person hiding in the mountains who requires kidney dialysis every other day. And he doesn't even have any cool flying machines.

And you think it is irrational to consider that an advanced race 'could easily' hide from us...? The Earth, and our solar system are a BIG place...with LOTS of places to hide. Seemingly the tribal lands between Pakistan & Afghanistan are remote enough to hide the world's most wanted man from the most technologically powerful country time has ever known... I guess it is all about not having the right tools for the right job.

GeeMack said:
Simply not true.
Click to expand...

Well, now that depends on your interpretation of specific texts and artwork, right Marduk?

GeeMack said:
Actually the "god of the gaps" comments in this thread have nothing to do with the concept of worship, and fit your position perfectly. It's a metaphor. It's not about gods. In this discussion it's about your refusal to simply allow that you don't know what you saw, and irrationally filling in the "I-don't-know" spaces with something you want to continue to believe.
Click to expand...

AGAIN, I never said I "know" what these thing were...

Rather, I can only claim to know what they weren't.
 
Last edited:
Marduk said:
denial, and a lie and the incorrect terminology, you are getting worse
:(
Click to expand...

I never know what you think or feel, when I read your posts. I'm really glad you always include an emo-con, to help everyone including me understand your emotional situation.

I'm sorry you're sad :(

If you don't cheer up, I am gonna kill this puppy.

(*WHAT, that always makes my kid stop crying!)
 
Last edited:
King of the Americas said:
I never know what you think or feel, when I read your posts. I'm really glad you always include an emo-con, to help everyone including me understand your emotional situation.

I'm sorry you're sad :(

If you don't cheer up, I am gonna kill this puppy.

(*WHAT, that always makes my kid stop crying!)
Click to expand...

how about any qualified historian saying "they are here"
whos here ?
where ?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom