Nazi Master Race Breeding Program using "Aryan" Studs

Budly

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People, even here on a skeptic forum actually believe that toward the end of the war, SS Aryan studs went around and impregnated women so as to have as many Aryan race babies as possible. Not unlike how a farm breeds animals. What a ridiculous urban lore legend! Even the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum (which is hardly objective) sets the record straight that this didn't occur.

From the USHMM.org

SS and Lebensborn

The SS even became involved in making social policy for the German Reich. In December 1935, using private funding but within the institutional framework of the SS Race and Settlement Main Office, the SS established the Lebensborn (Fount of Life) Society. Lebensborn was to care for children born out of wedlock to racially “suitable” women. Special Lebensborn homes provided a viable option to unwed mothers who might otherwise seek abortions (for which the Nazi regime increased criminal penalties in 1933). The homes offered a protective atmosphere in which the women could have their babies and even raise them if they so chose. Himmler estimated that the SS could save at least 100,000 babies from being aborted during pregnancy.

The ideological basis for Lebensborn corresponded to Nazi social policy encouraging families to have large numbers of children: more racially suitable babies meant more racially suitable and superior soldiers and eventual unlimited expansion of the so-called German master race. During the war, the SS leadership reassured SS men serving at the front that not only their legitimate children but any illegitimate children (and their mothers) would be cared for in Lebensborn homes. Himmler and Deputy Nazi party chief Rudolf Hess were even prepared to urge German women to choose to conceive and bear children out of wedlock for the sake of the Reich, but this overt assault on the institution of marriage in name of the biological expansion of the race was too radical even for Nazi society in time of war.
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After further review, this thread has been restored and placed in the most appropriate subforum. This is a very controversial issue, so please keep it civil.
Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: Tricky
 
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Budly said:
People, even here on a skeptic forum actually believe that toward the end of the war, SS Aryan studs went around and impregnated women so as to have as many Aryan race babies as possible. Not unlike how a farm breeds animals. What a ridiculous urban lore legend! Even the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum (which is hardly objective) sets the record straight that this didn't occur.

From the USHMM.org
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I'm going to go ahead and respond to this just because I happened to see it on the Recent Threads page, even though I'm sure it's going to be moved to its proper thread soon. If you'd bothered to read the article that ddt linked, it makes clear that this didn't happen.

Himmler's effort to secure a racially pure Greater Germany, the fact that Lebensborn was one of Himmler's race programmes, and sloppy journalism on the subject in the early years after the war led to false assumptions about the programme. The main misconception was that the programme involved coercive breeding. The first stories reporting that Lebensborn was a coercive breeding programme can be found in the German magazine Revue, which ran a series on the subject in the 1950s. On January 13, 1961, the German film Der Lebensborn (also known as Ordered to Love (US) and Fountain of Life (International)), produced by Artur Brauner, was released, later to gain worldwide circulation. The film purported that young girls were forced to mate in Nazi camps, which was not the case.[bolding mine]
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17060474efd71cbba4.jpg
 
A moderator moved this thread into 9-11 conspiracy theories, when it should be in "Conspiracy Theories." a moderator also merged my thread "Nazi Master Race Breeding Program using 'Aryan' Studs" into the "holocaust denial videos" thread which makes no sense. That thread had nothing to do with holocaust denial videos. I'm being discriminated against here at randi forum which doesn't surprise me. It's just a light version of the second stage:

All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.
Arthur Schopenhauer
 
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Budly said:
A moderator moved this thread into 9-11 conspiracy theories, when it should be in "Conspiracy Theories." a moderator also merged my thread "Nazi Master Race Breeding Program using 'Aryan' Studs" into the "holocaust denial videos" thread which makes no sense. That thread had nothing to do with holocaust denial videos. I'm being discriminated against here at randi forum which doesn't surprise me. It's just a light version of the second stage:

All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.
Arthur Schopenhauer
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Do you think every idiotic theory that is ridiculed and opposed is true?
 
Budly said:
All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.
Arthur Schopenhauer
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Since you feel the need to reiterate that as if it helps you any, I feel compelled to point out that it doesn't. Bumping old post:

ElMondoHummus said:
Unfortunately, in bringing this up, you're missing something: It only applies to truth, not fraudulent scholarship or maliciously generated myth. Pseudoscholarship and deceitfully created distortions to history get stuck in the ridicule stage. And for good reason.

Remember what Carl Sagan said:
... [T]he fact that some geniuses were laughed at does not imply that all who are laughed at are geniuses. They laughed at Columbus, they laughed at Fulton, they laughed at the Wright Brothers. But they also laughed at Bozo the Clown.
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You, sir, are certainly no Columbus, Fulton, or a Wright Brother. And the only reason I refrain from comparing you to the last is because I'd rather not insult Bozo.
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So when is this idea of yours going to go from being ridiculed to anything else? It's been stuck there for 60 years and counting...
 
Budly said:
People, even here on a skeptic forum actually believe that toward the end of the war, SS Aryan studs went around and impregnated women so as to have as many Aryan race babies as possible. Not unlike how a farm breeds animals. What a ridiculous urban lore legend! Even the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum (which is hardly objective) sets the record straight that this didn't occur.

From the USHMM.org


Merged with earlier thread with similar topic. Please do not start multiple threads on the same topic.
Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: Tricky
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SpitfireIX said:
I'm going to go ahead and respond to this just because I happened to see it on the Recent Threads page, even though I'm sure it's going to be moved to its proper thread soon. If you'd bothered to read the article that ddt linked, it makes clear that this didn't happen.




[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehosting/17060474efd71cbba4.jpg[/qimg]
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So, Budly, honest question time: Did you really think that no one here would bother to look at the post you were denigrating, and follow the provided links, to find out that the poster said nothing that was anything like what you claimed they said?

Did you really think that?

You yourself, earlier in this thread, chastised us for allegedly relying on strawman versions of your own arguments, and now, you've gone ahead and presented a strawman version of ddt's post. Why would you do that?

Seriously, did you really think that you'd get away with that? Did you really, actually, honestly, believe that we are that stupid and/or incurious?

Do you still think that?


Seriously.
 
Budly said:
People, even here on a skeptic forum actually believe that toward the end of the war, SS Aryan studs went around and impregnated women so as to have as many Aryan race babies as possible.
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(bolding mine)

Cool. Budly picks up one of my posts and distorts it. You are aware, Budly, that the most well-known Lebensborn baby, Ms. Lyngstad, had a father who was "just" a Wehrmacht officer (captain IIRC). I'm sure you know here, or at least her music. :p

And why doesn't anyone follow the rules anymore? :)

Leiden cheese.
 
Budly said:
A moderator moved this thread into 9-11 conspiracy theories, when it should be in "Conspiracy Theories." a moderator also merged my thread "Nazi Master Race Breeding Program using 'Aryan' Studs" into the "holocaust denial videos" thread which makes no sense. That thread had nothing to do with holocaust denial videos. I'm being discriminated against here at randi forum which doesn't surprise me. It's just a light version of the second stage:

All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.
Arthur Schopenhauer
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How ironic. The Holocaust denier complaining about free speech, yet probably believes the Holocaust should not be talked as if its true.
 
Budly said:
All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.
Arthur Schopenhauer
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If only i had a dollar for every cult minion nutjob, from creationists to truthers, to these Nazi nuts, that dragged out this quote and waved it around like it validates their insanity.

They recite it like programmed drones.

Do they like, teach this, in some kook cult, how to brainwash your minions, handbook? :boggled:
 
Crickets (I will follow some rules.) Budly, I get the impression that you came to this forum, made your silly rules in the OP, and then thought you wouldn't be debated on the actual facts on the Holocaust. Am I right? If I am right you've made a very large mistake. Most of us practice a skill called critical thinking and, unfortunately, this does not seem to be in your skill set. Your videos are amaturish, prevaricating, trash and your "debating" technique is laughable. So if you thought we'd just follow your rules and not engage you in a spirited debate, you were dead wrong.

Liederkranz
 
The Platypus said:
If only i had a dollar for every cult minion nutjob, from creationists to truthers, to these Nazi nuts, that dragged out this quote and waved it around like it validates their insanity.

They recite it like programmed drones.

Do they like, teach this, in some kook cult, how to brainwash your minions, handbook? :boggled:
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Even if New Truth implied Ridicule it wouldn't follow that Ridicule implies New Truth but not all truths are ridiculed. So the kooks are wrong twice over.
 
The Platypus said:
If only i had a dollar for every cult minion nutjob, from creationists to truthers, to these Nazi nuts, that dragged out this quote and waved it around like it validates their insanity.

They recite it like programmed drones.

Do they like, teach this, in some kook cult, how to brainwash your minions, handbook? :boggled:
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No Crap. If I had a dollar every time a Conspiracy kook...or any other type of crackpot..used that quote, I would be a rich man.
 
twinstead said:
Do you think every idiotic theory that is ridiculed and opposed is true?
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He's obviously unfamiliar with syllogistic fallacies since he's walking straight into one. From my point of view, he's committing the "Fallacy of the undistributed middle term" (here's another link):
  • All A are C
  • All B are C
  • Therefore, all A are B
The essence of Budly's statement:
  • My proposal is being laughed at.
  • All unpopular truths are first laughed at.
  • Therefore, my proposal is simply an unpopular truth.
People more versed in logic can tell me if I'm identifying that correctly, but from what I can tell, that's exactly the error he's committing. Regardless of the exact type, though, he's clearly committing a logical fallacy in presuming that our derision means holocaust denial is somehow a truth that's being denied merely because it's unpopular.

[/pedant] :pedant
 
Yup, that's the fallacy.

So far he's only trudged out the Schopenhauer quote. No comparison yet between Holocaust deniers and Galileo, or between the war crimes trials and the Salem witch trials. :D

- woolfe
 
woolfe99 said:
Yup, that's the fallacy.

So far he's only trudged out the Schopenhauer quote. No comparison yet between Holocaust deniers and Galileo, or between the war crimes trials and the Salem witch trials. :D

- woolfe
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They were nazis and witches?!
 
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