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Canadian Heathcare system sucks!!

Thunder

Banned
T
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Nov 18, 2006
Messages
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OK. I was just in Montreal for 7 days. One of the staffers of the Hostil I stayed at just dislocated his shoulder.

#1. He told me he had to wait for 2 HOURS for an ambulence to come. They eventually decided to give up on the ambulence and his dad drove him to the hospital.

#2. The hospital treatment and x-ray was free. But..he told me that national insurance does NOT cover physical therapy!! He said he would have have to fork over at least $40 a session..and he would need like 6 weeks at least.

#3. I asked him if he has a G.P. He said that it is very difficult to get a G.P. in Montreal, all the doctors refuse to take any more patients, and many doctors actually move to New York or other border states where they can get more pay.

Is this all true? Is the Canadian system this bad or does this guy simply not know his $$$$?

If even half of this stuff is true...it would be very bad for Obama's plans for health care in the USA.

Canadians...please respond.
 
Um, Obama's healthcare plan is nothing like Canada's? They have a doctor shortage, and the AMA endorsed Obama's plan.

And why do you call for an ambulance for a dislocated shoulder?
 
I do believe that if you called for an Ambulance for that kind of injury in America, you would in fact get stuck with the bill (a few hundred dollars). I don't think any insurance plan considers a dislocated shoulder to be medical necessity for an ambulance, and I believe they'll deny that claim every time.

Somebody else can correct me if I'm wrong, I'm speaking from personal but narrow experience here.
 
well..the arm remained dislocated. it didnt go back in for a while.

i called an ambulance cause i had food poisoning once. i had to pay like $100 for the ambulance and insurance covered the rest.
 
Yes, it's quite possible that the ambulance was busy because it was attending to actual emergencies that required its immediate use. Situations where someone's life may be in danger, or blood is spurting all over the place. You know, emergencies.
 
well, if i had my way, all Americans would basically have the same coverage as I do from GHI.

i pay NO monthly premiums. but i pay a $20 co-pay every time i see a doctor and have to pay an additional co-pay for certain other things like x-rays, ambulance, surgery, etc.

yes..it takes money out of my pocket....but WAAAYYY less then if I had no insurance.

if anything, my insurance should require that i see my GP once every 6 months for a general physical and cholesteral test. just so i know what my condition is.

and yes...perhaps this guy's arm was not an emergency. but i was unhappy to hear that he had to wait 2 hours..and that he may have to pay $50 or more for each physical therapy session. i assume that is amount is subsidized by the government though.
 
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Now does Canada have fewer or more bankruptcies due to medical bills than the USA?
 
How does this compare to the current USA healthcare system where if you don't have money, you only get emergency treatment? Where if you get such treatment, they will garnish your check? Where many, many people go bankrupt and continue to be sick because they are underinsured or not insured at all?
 
parky76 said:
well, if i had my way, all Americans would basically have the same coverage as I do from GHI.

i pay NO monthly premiums. but i pay a $20 co-pay every time i see a doctor and have to pay an additional co-pay for certain other things like x-rays, ambulance, surgery, etc.

yes..it takes money out of my pocket....but WAAAYYY less then if I had no insurance.
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Wow. That's an incredibly detailed look at your health insurance plan. Yes, it's a wonder it isn't enacted on a national scale!

if anything, my insurance should require that i see my GP once every 6 months for a general physical and cholesteral test. just so i know what my condition is.
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Yes, but see, insurance companies have these bean-counter fellas called "actuaries." And what these guys do is look at the costs, statistics, and the health of those they cover, and they figure out that's going to cost them WAY more to pay for a twice-yearly physical for each one of their insured than it would save them in long-term medical costs.

So that's not going to happen.

and yes...perhaps this guy's arm was not an emergency. but i was unhappy to hear that he had to wait 2 hours..
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Really? Because I'd be unhappy if the ambulance was wasting taxpayer dollars on coming to get his lazy ass, rather than dealing with people who actually need it.

and that he may have to pay $50 or more for each physical therapy session. i assume that is amount is subsidized by the government though.
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First of all, $50 for a physical therapy session is not expensive. $50 for any kind of medical session is not expensive.

Second, a dislocated shoulder rarely needs actual professional physical therapy.

Third...Seriously, WTF?! As medical horror stories go, this ranks up there with "I stubbed my toe on my way in to the ER." Christ, I once waited four hours in an emergency room for stitches and I was actually bleeding. But that was in a good old-fashioned for-profit American hospital, so I guess it doesn't really count.

You! Parky! Back of the Fail Bus! NOW!!!
 
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Cleon said:
Really? Because I'd be unhappy if the ambulance was wasting taxpayer dollars on coming to get his lazy ass, rather than dealing with people who actually need it.
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dislocating an arm can be very very painful and paralyzing. mine came out in a pool before i had my surgery done and while it was out..i could NOT move and pain was intense.

have a heart.

:)
 
I wonder if our public servants in Congress with be solely covered under the magnificent RomneyObamacare or continue with their gold plated plan? (of course we all know the answer).
 
parky76 said:
dislocating an arm can be very very painful and paralyzing. mine came out in a pool before i had my surgery done and while it was out..i could NOT move and pain was intense.

have a heart.

:)
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Yes, it's painful. It sucks. But something that requires immediate need of an ambulance, and the paramedics that come with it? An ambulance and paramedics that could be dealing with a gunshot victim, someone in a car accident, a heart attack, or seizure?

No. Hell no. Not by a long shot.

And you tell me to have a heart.
 
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kallsop said:
I wonder if our public servants in Congress with be solely covered under the magnificent RomneyObamacare or continue with their gold plated plan? (of course we all know the answer).
Click to expand...

You don't actually read the threads you post in, do you.
 
parky76 said:
OK. I was just in Montreal for 7 days. One of the staffers of the Hostil I stayed at just dislocated his shoulder.

#1. He told me he had to wait for 2 HOURS for an ambulence to come. They eventually decided to give up on the ambulence and his dad drove him to the hospital.

#2. The hospital treatment and x-ray was free. But..he told me that national insurance does NOT cover physical therapy!! He said he would have have to fork over at least $40 a session..and he would need like 6 weeks at least.

#3. I asked him if he has a G.P. He said that it is very difficult to get a G.P. in Montreal, all the doctors refuse to take any more patients, and many doctors actually move to New York or other border states where they can get more pay.

Is this all true? Is the Canadian system this bad or does this guy simply not know his $$$$?

If even half of this stuff is true...it would be very bad for Obama's plans for health care in the USA.

Canadians...please respond.
Click to expand...

There's some FUD here mixed in with some facts. Regarding #3, it can be difficult to get a G.P. in some parts of Canada - the problem seems to be particularly bad in some regions of Quebec (like Gatineau). But just to be clear, this is not the same thing as not being able to see a doctor. Walk-in clinics are not difficult to find and anyone can see a doctor at a such a clinic without an appointment. The issue in these specific regions of the country is finding a G.P. who will take you on as a regular patient. Also, the claim that "all" doctors in Montreal refuse to accept new patients is certainly hyperbole.

#2 is true, but most people have supplemental private insurance to cover these things (and other stuff that isn't covered, like dental). Usually through their employer.

#1 has been addressed by others.
 
parky76 said:
OK. I was just in Montreal for 7 days. One of the staffers of the Hostil I stayed at just dislocated his shoulder.

#1. He told me he had to wait for 2 HOURS for an ambulence to come. They eventually decided to give up on the ambulence and his dad drove him to the hospital.
Click to expand...
Already addressed. The ambulance crews were probably busy with real emergencies. Also, the availability of an ambulance or lack thereof has nothing at all to do with our health care insurance system.

#2. The hospital treatment and x-ray was free. But..he told me that national insurance does NOT cover physical therapy!! He said he would have have to fork over at least $40 a session..and he would need like 6 weeks at least.
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By "national" I assume the staffer meant the Quebec plan (The province of Quebec has a tendency to refer to its programs and institutions as "national".) The health care insurance system in Canada is funded federally and provincially, and run by each province individually. There are likely to be differences between provinces on what's paid for and what's not.

#3. I asked him if he has a G.P. He said that it is very difficult to get a G.P. in Montreal, all the doctors refuse to take any more patients, and many doctors actually move to New York or other border states where they can get more pay.
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I'll see your anecdote and raise you one of my own. When I needed to get a family doctor, I called a telephone line run by the provincial medical association, which maintains a list of all doctors currently accepting patients. I was given three names based on my address. I picked one based on the location of the practice, and had a family doctor the next week. Regular visits and check-ups, plus other visits to deal with life's medical annoyances such as an ear irrigation I had this spring are at no extra cost to me. Ditto for seeing a good endocrinologist for ongoing monitoring and care of my diabetes.

Is this all true? Is the Canadian system this bad or does this guy simply not know his $$$$?

If even half of this stuff is true...it would be very bad for Obama's plans for health care in the USA.

Canadians...please respond.
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Canada has a population of approximately 33 million people. You're bound to get any number of bad stories.

What you don't hear about are the stories like my father's. He had a mild heart attack back in 2000 at age 75. He was transported 250 km from the small city he lived in to a hospital where world-class heart medicine is done. A triple bypass later, two weeks in hospital, and he went back home. Total out-of-pocket expenses were for the 250 km ambulance ride because it's not covered by our provincial plan. Today at 84 he walks an average of 1.5 to 3 miles a day.

His current health insurance coverage is in no way affected by his surgery. That statement is just as true if he had had his surgery at 45 instead of 75. Can you say that for your system?
 
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Blue Mountain said:
By "national" I assume the staffer meant the Quebec plan (The province of Quebec has a tendency to refer to its programs and institutions as "national".) The health care insurance system in Canada is funded federally and provincially, and run by each province individually. There are likely to be differences between provinces on what's paid for and what's not.
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Unlikely. All provinces are governed by the Canada Health Act.
 
I was working in Vancouver some years back, during the time that an election season marketing campaign was being waged in the US against single payer that was demonizing the Canadian system. Without exception, the Canadians I spoke with, including my affluent right-wing client, were basically supportive of the system and thought the TV ads were idiotic. For what it's worth.
 
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