Architects and Engineers for 9/11 Truth

[johnny karate]

Probably because there are multiple accounts of firefighters who thought the sequential nature of the explosions suggested bombs or explosives.

Lies, lies, and damned lies. How many times do you plan on lying today in the same thread?

First, you made the idiotic claim that anyone here might have said there were no explosions heard during the collapse of the towers. You wisely backed off this claim after realizing just how stupid it really was.

Now, you are once again trying to put words in the mouths of firefighters you so irrationally despise. No firefighters ever "suggested" what they experienced on 9/11 was indicative of a controlled demolition. They merely used terms like "bomb" and "explosive" as a point of reference in describing what they experienced. Your pathetic semantic games are wholly transparent and not even remotely convincing.

You hate the FDNY. We get that. So please stop dragging them through the mud with your shamefully slanderous implications.

 

[Christopher7]

The red column of Figure 6-1 reports locations where FIRE was reported, per floor.

The type was so small I did not see it. I read the caption.
"Figure 6-1 Observations of building damage after initial awareness but before beginning of evacuation in WTC 1"
Nowhere in the text did it mention fire.
There is a difference between being wrong and lying. Lying is "knowingly" saying something that is not true. Whenever someone gets anything wrong, you call them a liar. Now that you have pointed it out I will accept that NCSTAR 1-6 indeed says that there were fires on some of the lower floors.
I will change my position when presented with evidence, you will not.

Do you have any statements to confirm these fires? I haven't seen any.

How do you think the 700 bone fragments were thrown 250' to 300' and landed on top of 130 Liberty St.?

 

[Gravy]

First responders heard bombs?

"Sounded like bombs" –Keith Murphy

"A huge explosion" –Gerard Gorman

"Sound of popping and exploding" –Alwish Monchery

"Explosions" –William Burns

"Kept hearing these large boom, boom" –Rosario Terranova

"Sounded like explosions." –Anthony Fitzgerald

"Like a shotgun going off" –Mark Meier

"Sounded like explosions" –Wilfred Barriere

"Sounded like bombs, like blockbusters" –John Murray

"You could hear explosions" –Richard Smiouskas

"Sounded like an M-80, that's how loud they were" –Tim Pearson

"Sounds like a shotgun" –Eric Ronningen

"Sounded like an explosion" –John Morabito

"There were lots of explosions" –Jeff Birnbaum

"Under the assumption that the sounds were secondary bombs." –Andrew Rodriguez

"Sounded like bombs. Like a bomb going off. I mean, it was huge." –FDNY Deputy Chief Peter Hayden


All of these sounds were made by bodies from the towers impacting the ground or structures.

 

[Christopher7]

Lies, lies, and damned lies. How many times do you plan on lying today in the same thread?
No firefighters ever "suggested" what they experienced on 9/11 was indicative of a controlled demolition.

I won't call you a liar as is the custom here. However, you're statement is incorrect.


[FONT=&quot]Dominick Derubbio -- Battalion Chief (F.D.N.Y.) [Division 8]
It was weird how it started to come down. It looked like it was a timed explosion ...

[/FONT] [FONT=&quot]Rich Banaciski -- Firefighter (F.D.N.Y.) [Ladder 22][/FONT][FONT=&quot]
We were there I don't know, maybe 10, 15 minutes and then I just remember there was just an explosion. It seemed like on television they blow up these buildings. It seemed like it was going all the way around like a belt, all these explosions.

[/FONT] [FONT=&quot]Brian Dixon -- Battalion Chief (F.D.N.Y.)[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
. . . the lowest floor of fire in the south tower actually looked like someone had planted explosives around it because the whole bottom I could see -- I could see two sides of it and the other side -- it just looked like that floor blew out[/FONT].

[FONT=&quot]Stephen Gregory -- Assistant Commissioner (F.D.N.Y.)[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
[/FONT] [FONT=&quot][It was at] the lower level of the building. You know like when they demolish a building, how when they blow up a building, when it falls down? That's what I thought I saw.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]It was like they planned to take down a building
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4zY1lHFAxVs

[/FONT]

 

[ElMondoHummus]

Holy simile misappreciation, Batman!

 

[beachnut]

How do you think the 700 bone fragments were thrown 250' to 300' and landed on top of 130 Liberty St.?

I thought Gage was the only pathetic terrorist apologist who used this bone dolt statement.

Gage has no idea what conclusion to make from this stupidity. But if he is trying to say explosives did it, he can't because he used thermite, and thermite doesn't blow up bones. Bombs, unless they are attached to bodies do not do this. But a body moving at 590 mph does fall apart and spread bone fragments all over. So it was not an explosive, not thermite, just an impact. Gage delusion is not very good at getting close to reality.

Only a dolt like Gage ignores the debris raining down from Flight 175 impact, bones, aircraft parts, and parts of the building. BUSTED, Gage is a dolt, a very nice dolt who spews delusions. Narrow that down, he is dolt on 911 issues; proven many times over.

Look at the left side of the photo, parts are raining down. Get a life Gage. Don't repeat the lie of bone parts again Gage.

Dominick Derubbio -- Battalion Chief (F.D.N.Y.) [Division 8]
It was weird how it started to come down. It looked like it was a timed explosion ...

[FONT=&quot]Rich Banaciski -- Firefighter (F.D.N.Y.) [Ladder 22][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]We were there I don't know, maybe 10, 15 minutes and then I just remember there was just an explosion. It seemed like on television they blow up these buildings. It seemed like it was going all the way around like a belt, all these explosions.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Brian Dixon -- Battalion Chief (F.D.N.Y.)[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]. . . the lowest floor of fire in the south tower actually looked like someone had planted explosives around it because the whole bottom I could see -- I could see two sides of it and the other side -- it just looked like that floor blew out[/FONT].

[FONT=&quot]Stephen Gregory -- Assistant Commissioner (F.D.N.Y.)[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot][It was at] the lower level of the building. You know like when they demolish a building, how when they blow up a building, when it falls down? That's what I thought I saw.[/FONT]

sim·i·le (s m -l )
n.
A figure of speech in which two essentially unlike things are compared, often in a phrase introduced by like or as, as in "How like the winter hath my absence been" or "So are you to my thoughts as food to life" (Shakespeare).

often in a phrase introduced by like

SEE THIS POST!

Holy simile misappreciation, Batman!

Those in 911Truth use simile as evidence hard evidence as in dense, very extreme dense, like dirt dense.

Why!? Why do they pick the statements with LIKE in them! Wake up 911Truth!

 

[Christopher7]

First responders heard bombs?
"Sounded like bombs" –Keith Murphy
"A huge explosion" –Gerard Gorman
"Sound of popping and exploding" –Alwish Monchery
"Explosions" –William Burns
"Kept hearing these large boom, boom" –Rosario Terranova
"Sounded like explosions." –Anthony Fitzgerald
"Like a shotgun going off" –Mark Meier
"Sounded like explosions" –Wilfred Barriere
"Sounded like bombs, like blockbusters" –John Murray
"You could hear explosions" –Richard Smiouskas
"Sounded like an M-80, that's how loud they were" –Tim Pearson
"Sounds like a shotgun" –Eric Ronningen
"Sounded like an explosion" –John Morabito
"There were lots of explosions" –Jeff Birnbaum
"Under the assumption that the sounds were secondary bombs." –Andrew Rodriguez
"Sounded like bombs. Like a bomb going off. I mean, it was huge." –FDNY Deputy Chief Peter Hayden

All of these sounds were made by bodies from the towers impacting the ground or structures.

Are you saying that there were no explosions?

Start at 2:45 in this video. At 2:54 and 3:16 you can hear bodies hitting the ground. It does NOT sound like an explosion. the firefighters knew what that sound was.

There WERE explosions that were consistent with a CD.

Frank Cruthers -- Chief (F.D.N.Y.) [Citywide Tour Commander] .. there was what appeared to be at first an explosion. It appeared at the very top, simultaneously from all four sides, materials shot out horizontally. And then there seemed to be a momentary delay before you could see the beginning of the collapse.


Rich Banaciski -- Firefighter (F.D.N.Y.) [Ladder 22]
... and then I just remember there was just an explosion. It seemed like on television they blow up these buildings. It seemed like it was going all the way around like a belt, all these explosions.

Karin Deshore -- Captain (E.M.S.)
Somewhere around the middle of the World Trade Center, there was this orange and red flash coming out. Initially it was just one flash. Then this flash just kept popping all the way around the building and that building had started to explode.

Albert Turi -- Deputy Assistant Chief (F.D.N.Y.)
And as my eyes traveled up the building, and I was looking at the south tower, somewhere about halfway up, my initial reaction was there was a secondary explosion, and the entire floor area, a ring right around the building blew out.

Dominick Derubbio -- Battalion Chief (F.D.N.Y.) [Division 8]
It was weird how it started to come down. It looked like it was a timed explosion ...


Kevin Darnowski -- Paramedic (E.M.S.)
I heard three explosions, and then we heard like groaning and grinding, and tower two started to come down.

Greg Brady -- E.M.T. (E.M.S.) [Battalion 6]
We were standing underneath and Captain Stone was speaking again. We heard -- I heard 3 loud explosions. I look up and the north tower is coming down now, 1 World Trade Center.


Frank Campagna -- Firefighter (F.D.N.Y.) [Ladder 11]
You see three explosions and then the whole thing coming down.

[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Keith Murphy -- (F.D.N.Y.)[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
I had heard right before the lights went out, I had heard a distant boom boom boom, sounded like three explosions. I don't know what it was. At the time, I would have said they sounded like bombs, but it was boom boom boom and then the lights all go out. I hear someone say oh, s___, that was just for the lights out. I would say about 3, 4 seconds, all of a sudden this tremendous roar. It sounded like being in a tunnel with the train coming at you.

[/FONT]

 

[Gravy]

May I suggest that people stop responding to this troll, who merely repeats his 2006 ignorance ad nauseam? He is clearly unwilling or incapable of assimilating the information we provide him, or even of reading the material we take the time to link to. When we show him physical evidence that directly contradicts his nonsense, he simply claims that it's false.

If anyone has anything new to discuss relative to Richard Gage's group, I suggest this thread be used for that purpose.

 

[twinstead]

NOBODY IS SAYING THERE WEREN'T EXPLOSIONS, CHRIS!

Playing dueling witnesses doesn't make your case any stronger. Please provide some REAL evidence, get somebody who is actually respected among experts to champion your cause, and GET THE JOB DONE.

Otherwise, Gravy is right. You're just a troll.

 

[twinstead]

[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Keith Murphy -- (F.D.N.Y.)[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
I had heard right before the lights went out, I had heard a distant boom boom boom, sounded like three explosions. I don't know what it was. At the time, I would have said they sounded like bombs, but it was boom boom boom and then the lights all go out. I hear someone say oh, s___, that was just for the lights out. I would say about 3, 4 seconds, all of a sudden this tremendous roar. It sounded like being in a tunnel with the train coming at you.

[/FONT]

I can't resist this one though...I declare that the WTC was brought down by a train

 

[beachnut]

Gage needs to get on TV and expose the plot. Wait, the news people know Gage is delusional on 911.

Beer if you ignore Gage's cult member better than I.

 

[Christopher7]

May I suggest that people stop responding to this troll, who merely repeats his 2006 ignorance ad nauseam? He is clearly unwilling or incapable of assimilating the information we provide him, or even of reading the material we take the time to link to.

Quite the contrary my good sir. I follow nearly every link provided and read carefully.
You will remember that it was you who graciously gave me the link to NIST L and told me to read it. I did, and to my amazement, it said that the DD/F hypothesis only "Appeared possible". That's a from cry from the certainty that you and your fellows were claiming it said.

When we show him physical evidence that directly contradicts his nonsense, he simply claims that it's false.

You haven't been paying attention. I just followed a link provided, used the control + feature and confirmed that R.Mackey was right, admitted I was wrong and have changed my position to reflect this new knowledge.

But that was documentary evidence. What physical evidence have you [or anyone here] provided that directly contradicts anything I have said?

 

[Baylor]

I was also very wrong and have changed my position. I used to think Christopher7 was not a troll. However, after viewing the overwhelming evidence that suggests otherwise, I now have no choice but to label Christopher7 a troll.

 

[johnny karate]

I won't call you a liar as is the custom here. However, you're statement is incorrect.

Read my whole post, champ. Especially this part:

They merely used terms like "bomb" and "explosive" as a point of reference in describing what they experienced.

You've done nothing but provide examples that completely bolster my point.

 

[RedIbis]

May I suggest that people stop responding to this troll, who merely repeats his 2006 ignorance ad nauseam? He is clearly unwilling or incapable of assimilating the information we provide him, or even of reading the material we take the time to link to. When we show him physical evidence that directly contradicts his nonsense, he simply claims that it's false.

If anyone has anything new to discuss relative to Richard Gage's group, I suggest this thread be used for that purpose.

How about allowing people to decide for themselves with whom they want to have a discussion?

Although I do understand why you would not want to address Chris7's list in the post above yours. None of these accounts are describing the bodies. Most of the accounts are not figurative at all, but literal descriptions of what they saw and heard. It is this specificity that you are trying to get people to avoid.

 

[A W Smith]

lets do an audio check list, shall we?

1. sirens? check
2. helicopters? check
3. crowd screaming? check
4. rumbling during collapse? check
5. controlled demolition explosions? none

here is a bridge cd

Chris, you have nothing but a list of similies and arguments from incredulity. You have zero physical evidence of a controlled demolition. No det cord, No blasting caps, No devices that could hold thermite against a vertical surface, Hell. no thermite or blast residue even. And don't spit out that old canard that they weren't looking for it. they combed through the wreckage at Fresh Kills. It would be self evident, obvious, and impossible to conceal with the thousands of experts on site. You are stuck back in 2006 with your agenda driven lies, game, match, set, in convincing anyone here, you lose Chris

 

[lapman]

Are you saying that there were no explosions?

Start at 2:45 in this video. At 2:54 and 3:16 you can hear bodies hitting the ground. It does NOT sound like an explosion. the firefighters knew what that sound was.

There WERE explosions that were consistent with a CD.

Frank Cruthers -- Chief (F.D.N.Y.) [Citywide Tour Commander] .. there was what appeared to be at first an explosion. It appeared at the very top, simultaneously from all four sides, materials shot out horizontally. And then there seemed to be a momentary delay before you could see the beginning of the collapse.


Rich Banaciski -- Firefighter (F.D.N.Y.) [Ladder 22]
... and then I just remember there was just an explosion. It seemed like on television they blow up these buildings. It seemed like it was going all the way around like a belt, all these explosions.

Karin Deshore -- Captain (E.M.S.)
Somewhere around the middle of the World Trade Center, there was this orange and red flash coming out. Initially it was just one flash. Then this flash just kept popping all the way around the building and that building had started to explode.

Albert Turi -- Deputy Assistant Chief (F.D.N.Y.)
And as my eyes traveled up the building, and I was looking at the south tower, somewhere about halfway up, my initial reaction was there was a secondary explosion, and the entire floor area, a ring right around the building blew out.

Dominick Derubbio -- Battalion Chief (F.D.N.Y.) [Division 8]
It was weird how it started to come down. It looked like it was a timed explosion ...


Kevin Darnowski -- Paramedic (E.M.S.)
I heard three explosions, and then we heard like groaning and grinding, and tower two started to come down.

Greg Brady -- E.M.T. (E.M.S.) [Battalion 6]
We were standing underneath and Captain Stone was speaking again. We heard -- I heard 3 loud explosions. I look up and the north tower is coming down now, 1 World Trade Center.


Frank Campagna -- Firefighter (F.D.N.Y.) [Ladder 11]
You see three explosions and then the whole thing coming down.

[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Keith Murphy -- (F.D.N.Y.)[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
I had heard right before the lights went out, I had heard a distant boom boom boom, sounded like three explosions. I don't know what it was. At the time, I would have said they sounded like bombs, but it was boom boom boom and then the lights all go out. I hear someone say oh, s___, that was just for the lights out. I would say about 3, 4 seconds, all of a sudden this tremendous roar. It sounded like being in a tunnel with the train coming at you.

[/FONT]

Oh, so it only takes 3 asplosions to make it a CD?

Please learn to count.

 

[A W Smith]

How about allowing people to decide for themselves with whom they want to have a discussion?

Although I do understand why you would not want to address Chris7's list in the post above yours. None of these accounts are describing the bodies. Most of the accounts are not figurative at all, but literal descriptions of what they saw and heard. It is this specificity that you are trying to get people to avoid.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=nj+earthquake+explosions&aq=f&oq=

 

[Christopher7]

But a body moving at 590 mph does fall apart and spread bone fragments all over.

Gage ignores the debris raining down from Flight 175 impact, bones, aircraft parts, and parts of the building. Look at the left side of the photo, parts are raining down.

Good point. Well done.
However, you don't know what was in that fireball and debris.

The plane and the people in it were traveling at 590 mph. The fuselage did not disintegrate on contact. It broke up as it passed thru the the tower. The remains of the plane and people, along with everything the fuselage took out, were still traveling away from the Bankers Trust building as the fire ball erupted. It is very unlikely that the remains of the people in the fuselage were blown back out thru the hole where the plane had entered.

There were 700 bone fragments on top of Bankers Trust. Thousands of fragments would have to be ejected backwards for this to occur.

 

[Christopher7]

I was also very wrong and have changed my position. I used to think Christopher7 was not a troll. However, after viewing the overwhelming evidence that suggests otherwise, I now have no choice but to label Christopher7 a troll.