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SweatyYeti's Martian Civilization Evidence Thread

Quite frankly I don't want a dead martian civilization to be discovered. I feel it would be too depressing. The book I'm planning on reading "Martian Life" by Ben Bova is about a Navaho Indian who discoveres the remnants of a Cliff Dwelling Martian civilization. He's in the process of trying to decipher the martian writings he has found. I don't know anything else about it yet but its my guess the gentleman feels a kinship with these long lost people. I'd feel the same sense of loss that he may feel.
 
neltana said:
GMB,

Could you post some references to what you are referring to (the covered tubular roads). It would make this go better. Then we all be on the same page.

And, just to get it out of the way, I am a liar, a fake skeptic and prone to occult epistemology, so no need to mention it. But I would like to know what you are talking about and would appreciate it if you could explain it a little more clearly.

We aren't talking about lava tubes, are we?
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GMB has been suspended for 3 days.
 
Damn, now I'll never know what the heck he was talking about.

Well, I suppose that I could wait 3 days....

It'll be like waiting for Christmas morning!
 
neltana said:
GMB,

Could you post some references to what you are referring to (the covered tubular roads). It would make this go better. Then we all be on the same page.

And, just to get it out of the way, I am a liar, a fake skeptic and prone to occult epistemology, so no need to mention it. But I would like to know what you are talking about and would appreciate it if you could explain it a little more clearly.

We aren't talking about lava tubes, are we?
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I haven't seen any larva tubes. I haven't seen anything that LOOKS like larva tubes. Larva tubes never have been known to meet at ninety degree angles. So we see that the thesis that we are seeing something that could throw immense light on our knowledge of geology is a good one and that therefore NASA is both remiss and clearly dysfunctional. Being a guardian against new knowledge and not a paid servant of science.

Yet still the very strangeness of these tubes, that look nothing like larva, are not the right size for larva, and have these bands that refute the idea of them being larva, also hold up the ancient lunar base thesis. Both good theses. Even the possibility of larva, though implausible, ought not be ruled out after all things may act differently with different gravitation, air pressure, and all that.

But both theses show that NASA is out of order and the mass-sackings ought begin.

http://www.metaresearch.org/solar system/cydonia/asom/artifact_html/default.htm

Bear in mind that these banded covered roads (ie tubes that LOOK like banded covered roads) are 20-30 metres across. They are the size of roads.

Seriously I want to get rid of all voodoo from science. But I don't really see what the point is in pre-emptively ruling out ideas that there is no reason to rule out. That goes against the idea of following the evidence where-ever it leads you.
 
GMB said:
I haven't seen any larva tubes. I haven't seen anything that LOOKS like larva tubes. Larva tubes never have been known to meet at ninety degree angles. So we see that the thesis that we are seeing something that could throw immense light on our knowledge of geology is a good one and that therefore NASA is both remiss and clearly dysfunctional. Being a guardian against new knowledge and not a paid servant of science.

Yet still the very strangeness of these tubes, that look nothing like larva, are not the right size for larva, and have these bands that refute the idea of them being larva, also hold up the ancient lunar base thesis. Both good theses. Even the possibility of larva, though implausible, ought not be ruled out after all things may act differently with different gravitation, air pressure, and all that.

But both theses show that NASA is out of order and the mass-sackings ought begin.

http://www.metaresearch.org/solar system/cydonia/asom/artifact_html/default.htm

Bear in mind that these banded covered roads (ie tubes that LOOK like banded covered roads) are 20-30 metres across. They are the size of roads.

Seriously I want to get rid of all voodoo from science. But I don't really see what the point is in pre-emptively ruling out ideas that there is no reason to rule out. That goes against the idea of following the evidence where-ever it leads you.
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Are you writing 'larva' for some reason or do you mean 'lava'? At 75' across those would be some large larva!!!
 
Yeah interesting point. Almost a freudian slip. Because they look more organic than they do geological thats for sure. Really I do think larval flow is not a serious paradigm here. Because of those bands mostly. We have vacuum tubes for cleaning gear up at work. And they have exactly the same sort of bands which are designed to stop the material from collapsing in on itself. And notice too that it has the same purpose as what the ancient lunar outpost paradigm would suggest. The banded tubes on Mars, and in our vacuum hoses. They are there to allow an artificial atmosphere. Its almost hard to be creative enough to think of anything else.

The lunar outpost paradigm is a good one. Doesn't mean its the right one. But its a good one and its hard for me to take seriously anyone that doesn't think so. Its hard to try and figure out what the objections to it are.
 
GMB said:
The lunar outpost paradigm is a good one. Doesn't mean its the right one. But its a good one and its hard for me to take seriously anyone that doesn't think so. Its hard to try and figure out what the objections to it are.
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Just like the Bigfoot on Mars paradigm.
 
Thats not a real good paradigm. No-one would be walking around in that atmosphere uncovered. That would be far more unlikely then expecting streakers at the South Pole. No-ones suggesting intelligent evolved life there. That would seem implausible. Definitely if its evidence for intelligent life its like an old outpost. Like base camp Antarctica. That sort of thing. No-ones going to be running around in bare feet.

Plus there are very good reasons why Inter-Stellar travelers, would set up shop in a place like that, in preference to earth.
 
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Well try and think it through. And the starting point is that Violent-Mars YouTube and the idea that planets that have the sort of pre-requisites for evolved life are also planets that:

1. Only have a window of opportunity for macro-scopic life. Since if contemporary theories of solar activity are spot on, a star on the MAIN SEQUENCE get progressively hotter. Hence while we may have 5 billion years before we are engulfed by an expanded sun here on earth, we may have only 300 million more years before the earth is too hot for life, at least without capitalism to find ways to cool it.

2. Planets that are suitable as a venue for the evolution of intelligent life may also only have a window of opportunity for macroscopic life to survive, on the basis that they may be prone to exploding. No joke. Thats a serious theory out there and forms the basis for that YouTube video. You see for a planet to be the basis for evolved life its likely to have a thick atmosphere and a magnetic field to keep out the cosmic rays. But the planet with the magentic field is also the one that has the internal make-up as to be a casualty of explosion.

1 & 2 imply:

3. That there will be more than one type of panspermia. Panspermia is now all but proven but perhaps not at the sort of ubiquity that Fred Hoyle had for it. But thats at the microscopic level. If planets are exploding all the time they can carry with them microscopic seeds of life. But if planets are exploding all the time it provides the opportunity and the motivation for intelligent life to migrate once in a while.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Now having said all that imagine you and those other billionaires and those babes you've brought with you are coasting far from home and the only technology and capital goods that you have amounts to the vehicle you are traveling in.

What energy are you using? How do you set up a robust colony? What resources do you need? And when thinking about it compare the two-moon situation that the YouTube talks about with Mars, as opposed to the Earth-And-Moon situation we have here as the alternative.

Think it through. What are the advantages of each? What choice would likely prevail?
 
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Right. Hence the asteroid belt. If you look at a planet like ours. And take its internal state. Then ask yourself..... what is this substance, what temperature would it be, and what phase or state would it be in if it were in space at that temperature.

What we find in the case of our earth is that most of it would be gas at its current temperature if subject to a no-pressure situation.

The problem is thought to happen if the internal planet cools I think. If some of the liquid goes to turn into a solid and implodes, and that leads to a sudden no-pressure situation and therefore a sort of counter-explosion.

I might have that entirely wrong. But it is a serious theory. Van Flandern reckons that the earth will likely explode sooner or later under this paradigm but not likely for a billion years.

Anyhow. Technology is imbedded in the capital structure of an economy. And the capital is limited by the extent of the market. This poses enourmous problems for the inter-stella survivor. Since capital goods are used up in the act of production and all these guys have is what is in their ship.

Now supposing their energy supply is hydrocarbons? Not real plausible right? And how are they going to start a new standard oil company when they get to the new home. There is no turning back. Or how about nuclear fission? How is the fuel going to be reprocessed? What about mining and refining new fuel where it is you are going?

Not likely.

So the choice of energy is really only one choice and all else may follow from that.
 
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GMB said:
The problem is thought to happen if the internal planet cools I think. If some of the liquid goes to turn into a solid and implodes, and that leads to a sudden no-pressure situation and therefore a sort of counter-explosion.
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I had you up to here. What substances implode when frozen?
 
Pretty much everything except for water. Really we are talking about things like iron and nickel. If they take a lot less space when solid then that could be a problem. Having a major satellite like the Moon is a destabilizing factor one would imagine. But its not like I'm real up on the theory.
 
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