Have you ever been sexually assaulted?

[Dancing David]

I am sorry that as usual we have all the wierd rape stuff happening, yet again.

It just shows that the issues of sexual assault are touchy and people get stupid about them, the narrowing of defintions is rather typical.

I was sexually assaulted by a woman. Her son restrained me over a chair and she penetrated my anus with an object, against my will. So no, I do not meet the criteria some silly people have established for what constitues sexual assault. Then there was also some wierd sexual incest by a family member (also female).

But as is the case in many scenarios, it did not involve penetrative contact, so again, by silly contorted defintions of sexual assault it doesn't count.

Thanks goodness that state legislatures (at least in Illinois) have gotten wise to the excuses that perpetrators make (not the intent of the OP), so that the use of minors in forms of sexual gratification and exploitation that do not involve penetration are still considered sexual assault.

These threads seem to always go this way, which is why i waited to post.

 

[GreNME]

To those who have shared their experiences, as well as to those who feel uncomfortable sharing, I want to thank you and apologize that your experiences have been glossed over in the face of some very ridiculous conditional statements about what constitutes rape. I recall a friend facing a situation several years ago, where someone they cared about dearly as a close friend and confidant basically accused this person of "buyer's remorse" after reporting a rape committed by another mutual friend, and the pain that the ensuing emotional torrent caused my already timid and sensitive friend. To date, at least a dozen friends of mine have shared their rape experiences with me, and I've always been surprised at the almost unanimous hesitancy from them to hope for or demand justice over the experience. The reason I was surprised was in how often they seemed to be (or outright stated that they were) resigned to the fact that the other person got away with it because of the nature of the relationship prior to the rape (often romantic or flirting), the circumstances surrounding the rape (could they have dressed/acted/reacted better?), and because the person who was raped didn't want to have to deal with the experience in a courtroom, where their horror and pain would be picked at, doubted, and possibly mocked. A few people I've known when I was a bit younger (18-21) even stated that they feared for their safety were they to report it, and someone very close to me today still fears for their safety over a decade later. To that end, I can understand in some sympathetic fashion why someone would be hesitant to share their experience-- who would want an experience that was horrifying to them ridiculed publicly, and why risk that kind of pain? You didn't deserve it then, and you certainly don't deserve it now.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Here is someone that claims it has happened to him

ETA:
Here is his actual account of the incident

"Unconscious"

Not relevant to what I said.

Keep it up folks, your straw men are falling like tin soldiers.

 

[Lonewulf]

Yeah, Skeptigirl definitely has a lot of us on ignore.

 

[Professor Yaffle]

She still pretending that nobody posted any evidence?

 

[Ysidro]

I'm only too pages into this thread and already I'm disgusted by skeptigirl's claims about male sexuality.

Skeptigirl, you are absolutely NO better than someone who claims "she was asking for it" and no amount of word twisting and ignorance of biology will allow you to squirm out of it.

I wish I had stronger words for you, but I can only say "for shame." You insult every man and woman who was ever sexually assault by persisting in your beliefs.

 

[Lonewulf]

http://www.answerbag.com/a_view/3461749


Here

Kept gun on him all the time

"One of the women pulled out a gun and held up the man while the other two undressed.

"Then all three of them raped him in turn, with one of them keeping the gun pointed at him," said Nothnagel.

Here 2

It was a topic George wasn't comfortable with, but despite his protests the talk turned physical.

"She pinned me down on the bed," he said.

Kelly claims he was raped. However, according to the investigation, there's no proof; no evidence; no smoking gun. The only remnant is an apologetic phone message left by George's alleged attacker.

"I'm really sorry, OK, [about] what happened. And, um, you were right, you know. It shouldn't have happened. OK. Think like it never happened," the woman said in a recorded phone message.

It is proof of an uncomfortable interaction, perhaps, but not a rape. Which is what detectives of the sex crimes unit determined when they investigated Kelly's accusation.

Do you want me to find "evidence" wherein someone makes a claim, police believe the person unquestionably, and there's no cause for doubt at all, Skeptigirl?

Afraid such a thing isn't possible. Let's see you dismiss this, though.

By the way, I'll say this one last time.

You said, Skeptigirl:

Not relevant to what I said.

You mean all that you've said in this thread? Every claim, all of which you refuse to retract (or rather, you completely ignore that you made in the first place)? There's not wanting to be wrong, and then there's abject denial...

Then I recommend you go back and re-read exactly what you've posted. You'll come off as less dishonest when you do so.


Note: In case Skeptigirl has me on ignore, please quote my message so she can see it? ESPECIALLY the two cases listed above, with link.

 

[tyr_13]

http://www.answerbag.com/a_view/3461749


Here


Here 2


Do you want me to find "evidence" wherein someone makes a claim, police believe the person unquestionably, and there's no cause for doubt at all, Skeptigirl?

Afraid such a thing isn't possible. Let's see you dismiss this, though.

By the way, I'll say this one last time.

You said, Skeptigirl:



You mean all that you've said in this thread? Every claim, all of which you refuse to retract (or rather, you completely ignore that you made in the first place)? There's not wanting to be wrong, and then there's abject denial...

Then I recommend you go back and re-read exactly what you've posted. You'll come off as less dishonest when you do so.


Note: In case Skeptigirl has me on ignore, please quote my message so she can see it? ESPECIALLY the two cases listed above, with link.

Done. Of course I find it very funny that the most logical explanation we can come up with for her still denying this is that she has half the people active in the thread on ignore.

What is in question:

* That a man can be forced to have an erection and then raped. Meaning awake, not intoxicated, and not coerced by a child molester.

Not only has this been shown, but what of it? What possible point could you be trying to make?

As far as it not mattering, you're right. And if there weren't so many straw men attacks here that would be a lot more obvious.

Then why are you arguing the point? So it doesn't matter, but you say it still doesn't happen. What, are you saying women strong enough to hold healthy adult males don't commit rape? Is this some way to justify a lack of sympathy for certain rape victims? If a healthy adult male just had not gone to sleep around those women, they wouldn't have gotten raped. Or if they weren't drinking, they wouldn't have gotten raped. If they stayed away from date-rape drugs and women who use blackmail they wouldn't have gotten raped. Is that how it is?

Is it that you just cannot let yourself feel bad for us evil adult males? Your position is confusing and ever changing, and you say "strawman" so much that I've started to look for a lion, a witch, and a man made of tin.

And no, no one is about to say that Dorthy sexually assaulted the Tin-man with the oil can.

 

[GreNME]

"Unconscious"

Not relevant to what I said.

Keep it up folks, your straw men are falling like tin soldiers.

Just in case you are wondering, Skeptigirl, this type of behavior is why I was correcting you earlier in that what you're displaying in this thread is not skepticism at this point, but is instead incredulity. You've already moved from a very broad range of sexual assault to a very specific range, but you are also completely disregarding several posts that have given you the information you've demanded as a self-imposed requirement to validity even though academic studies and clinical therapy sites had been posted before them. At this point what you are clearly doing is backpedaling instead of acknowledging something you may have been previously unaware of having existed.

Fact: most studies show about 1 in 10 rapes involve men as the victim.
Fact: most men can be induced to erection through the reflexive response of the penile tissue.
Fact: most studies show that of rapes involving men as victims, while other men are the majority of the perpetrators there are a significant number of instances where women perpetrated the rape.
Fact: in cases of rape involving both men and women, a statistically significant portion of the victims experienced physical stimulation completely separate from the emotional (and/or physical) horror of knowing they are being forced against their will, and that this phenomenon is known to cause severe cases of guilt and clinical depression (and emotional damage) to the victims who undergo this type of experience.

Also fact: none of these statistics offer useful data toward proving that men are more violent or aggressive than women or the converse of that statement. Neither does it offer useful data toward an equality of violence or aggression between genders.

 

[Agatha]

I have been raped twice. Once by a stranger, once by my ex-husband after we separated. After some of the things claimed on this thread, I don't wish to share more than that, other than to say in my experience as a 'victim' and as a sometime counsellor on a rape advice line, Skeptigirl's assertions are, in the main, wrong. I don't have the links to studies, though I note some have been posted.

As a new poster, I hesitate to disagree with someone who is clearly an established poster here. But I think Skeptigirl has done a huge disservice to both men and women who have experienced rape or sexual assault, whether as minors or as adults. Stating as fact that men cannot have erections unless aroused, and can't be raped by a woman, and that women cannot experience arousal or orgasm during rape, just serves to intensify the guilt and shame that some victims feel because what happened to them didn't conform in every respect to an outsider's perception of what rape and sexual assault is.

I apologise for my mangled English, anger and frustration has taken away my ability to think and type coherently tonight.

 

[Lonewulf]

I have been raped twice. Once by a stranger, once by my ex-husband after we separated. After some of the things claimed on this thread, I don't wish to share more than that, other than to say in my experience as a 'victim' and as a sometime counsellor on a rape advice line, Skeptigirl's assertions are, in the main, wrong. I don't have the links to studies, though I note some have been posted.

Urgh, yet another example of someone not wishing to share more because of certain people in this thread. You know, I really did think more of other people here, but I've been profoundly disappointed here... mainly by merely two other posters, but enough to be very disappointing.

I'm sorry to hear that you were raped. I'm glad that you've worked as a counselor on a rape advice line, and I'm happy to hear that you worked to help others that went through a similar crisis. You have my respect.

As a new poster, I hesitate to disagree with someone who is clearly an established poster here.

By the way, welcome to the forum!

Being a new or old poster doesn't matter as much here, I feel, but what matters is the kind arguments you make, and the way you carry yourself in a discussion. Besides, as you've probably more than noted by now, you are not alone in disagreeing with Skeptigirl -- in fact, it's pretty much been a one-woman army on her side so far.

But I think Skeptigirl has done a huge disservice to both men and women who have experienced rape or sexual assault, whether as minors or as adults. Stating as fact that men cannot have erections unless aroused, and can't be raped by a woman, and that women cannot experience arousal or orgasm during rape, just serves to intensify the guilt and shame that some victims feel because what happened to them didn't conform in every respect to an outsider's perception of what rape and sexual assault is.

I agree in every way possible.

I apologise for my mangled English, anger and frustration has taken away my ability to think and type coherently tonight.

You were more than easy to understand, and your English is just fine. Is English your second language, by the way? Just curious.

Thank you for posting, by the way. We need more people with personal experience to chime in.

 

[Agatha]

Thank you. English is my first language, but my sentence structure went all to cock above!

 

[GreNME]

Agatha: your English is fine, and I extend my thanks to you as well, not only for sharing but also for being someone who has given back and tried to help other victims.

Some further examples for skeptigirl:

Woman charged with raping man:

A 23-year-old woman has changed her story after biological evidence on a man's underpants and penis demonstrated their physical contact. The woman no longer denies laying a finger on him but insists she has committed no crime.

This woman wound up being convicted ^{[1], [2]}.

A similar instance in Stockholm, though I can imagine that this case will be dismissed because there was alcohol involved-- not that I would agree with a summary dismissal at all, considering many rapes of adults (male and female) occur while or after alcohol is present.

I don't have access to the FindLaw library that is only accessible to registered users, so if anyone wants to try to register and tell me if this article applies, which I believe deals with Theresa Spickler-Bowe, a woman who was convicted of rape in Washington (the PacNW state), though I believe that may have been a case of forced sodomy (like a broomstick or something).

Anyway, hope those examples help.

 

[Pardalis]

Skeptigirl, what was the purpose of the poll if you're not going to consider the results?

You asked people to share extremely personal and intimate things about themselves, why do you ignore the results?

 

[Professor Yaffle]

Agatha: your English is fine, and I extend my thanks to you as well, not only for sharing but also for being someone who has given back and tried to help other victims.

Some further examples for skeptigirl:

Woman charged with raping man:


This woman wound up being convicted ^{[1], [2]}.

A similar instance in Stockholm, though I can imagine that this case will be dismissed because there was alcohol involved-- not that I would agree with a summary dismissal at all, considering many rapes of adults (male and female) occur while or after alcohol is present.

I don't have access to the FindLaw library that is only accessible to registered users, so if anyone wants to try to register and tell me if this article applies, which I believe deals with Theresa Spickler-Bowe, a woman who was convicted of rape in Washington (the PacNW state), though I believe that may have been a case of forced sodomy (like a broomstick or something).

Anyway, hope those examples help.

Its not exactly clear, but this suggests that the man was both raped, and sodomised with a broomstick (the detail of the case are pretty shocking):

Theresa Spickler-Bowe, Eunice Eickhoff, and R.V. shared an apartment.
In early December 1996, Ms. Spickler-Bowe and Ms. Eickhoff began to abuse
R.V. Ms. Spickler-Bowe required R.V. to sleep on the floor with no clothing, no blanket, and while chained to the door. She also chained R.V.
to Ms. Eickhoff on more than five occasions. Sometimes R.V. had to relieve himself on the floor while he was chained.
Both women made R.V. stand outside during the winter months without shoes or clothing, or while wearing a diaper. They beat R.V. daily with their fists and a broom handle, as well as choked and scratched him. The women broke his nose, cheekbone, and finger. They limited R.V. to small portions of food. R.V. lost weight. They also forced R.V. to stand with a broomstick over his head for hours.
Ms. Spickler-Bowe held a knife to R.V.'s eye and throat. Ms.
Eickhoff, at Ms. Spickler-Bowe's direction, burned R.V. by applying a hot
butter knife and spatula to his chest and buttocks. This resulted in
second degree burns.
On January 16, 1997, both women raped and sodomized R.V. with a broom
handle and hit him in the ribs. Two days later, they forced him to drink
alcohol. They then made R.V. pour the alcohol on himself and forced him to leave the apartment.

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?court=wa&vol=168301&invol=o01

And I mnaged to get to your page using the google cache version:
http://216.239.59.132/search?q=cache:YmT9b6z9fccJ:caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl%3Fcourt%3Dwa%26vol%3D170179%26invol%3Do01+Theresa+Spickler-Bowe&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=3&gl=uk

From reading that and some news reports it seems that the sodomy with the broom handle was the rape in this case.

 

[Lonewulf]

Thank you. English is my first language, but my sentence structure went all to cock above!

Uh... pun intended?

Yeah, I can understand being angry and frustrated and posting while doing so. If you look back at some of my previous posts, I can get quite amazingly dense sometimes and rather silly in my posts.

Your English was perfectly fine.

Its not exactly clear, but this suggests that the man was both raped, and sodomised with a broomstick (the detail of the case are pretty shocking):

Holy ****.

Truly baffling. There are some sick people in this world.

 

[Cainkane1]

I'm sorry

I have been raped twice. Once by a stranger, once by my ex-husband after we separated. After some of the things claimed on this thread, I don't wish to share more than that, other than to say in my experience as a 'victim' and as a sometime counsellor on a rape advice line, Skeptigirl's assertions are, in the main, wrong. I don't have the links to studies, though I note some have been posted.

As a new poster, I hesitate to disagree with someone who is clearly an established poster here. But I think Skeptigirl has done a huge disservice to both men and women who have experienced rape or sexual assault, whether as minors or as adults. Stating as fact that men cannot have erections unless aroused, and can't be raped by a woman, and that women cannot experience arousal or orgasm during rape, just serves to intensify the guilt and shame that some victims feel because what happened to them didn't conform in every respect to an outsider's perception of what rape and sexual assault is.

I apologise for my mangled English, anger and frustration has taken away my ability to think and type coherently tonight.

I'm sorry to hear this. I know what being assaulted can do to a girl. My first cousin was assaulted by her won father. No penetration except digital but the long lasting effects were horrendous.

 

[Safe-Keeper]

Skepticgirl, as a person who respects you and usually highly values your input, let me give you a friendly piece of advise: you're in it way over your head. Stop, desist, leave the thread, and preferably, give an apology.

I don't know your ultimate rationale for acting like you do, but you obviously have a lot of emotion vested in this topic - obviously too much to discuss it rationally. Just drop it, apologize, and move on.

No penetration except digital but the long lasting effects were horrendous.

Excuse me for being thick, but... what do you mean by that? 'Digital penetration'?

 

[Pardalis]

He didn't insert an Ipod into her genitalia, if that's what your asking.

 

[Agatha]

Digital=fingers.