[Split]Debris piles at GZ- split from: UL Moves For Sanctions Against Morgan Reynold

[jammonius]

Really?

The Bowties are a good reference point since they are in all three pictures.


[qimg]http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o72/ardoucette/wtc_shattered2.jpg[/qimg]

[qimg]http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o72/ardoucette/WTC4160.jpg[/qimg]

This last construction photo will confirm that the bowties were nearly 150 ft above ground level (basement) and construction docs show that the bowties were over 60 ft above what would be street level.

[qimg]http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o72/ardoucette/WTCconstruction-197717.jpg[/qimg]

Your analysis is, in my view, misleading (I did not say "slightly" or "highly"). The construction photo does not allow you to make an assumption that the height is 150 feet; and, the plain content of the photos themselves puts paid to any notion that they are more than one storey. In fact, they are 1 storey or less. The proper frame of reference is the photo itself. Look at the lobby windows of WTC 1. The debris does not extend up to them in either of the photos shown, just as is the case with those posted earlier. Look at WTC 5, to the left. It was 9 stories and you can count at least 5 of them in the photo meaning the debris is not high enough to obscure them.

The photo is taken so as to suggest height, perhaps, but there is none there, as I see it.

 

[tsig]

This is yet another highly revealing, although undated photo showing, amongother things:

1 'fuming' or what is called 'molecular dissociation' of materials still occurring at GZ as of the date of the undated photo. See far right hand side of picture in the center (horizontal axis).

2 that fuming is utterly inconsistent with a hyrocarbon based fire and cannot possibly be plain ordinary 'smoke.' The worker in the left foreground is wearing an appropriate respirator to provide some protection from that and other toxic effects of DEW. Unfortunately, there is no guarnantee that the person seen did not become seriously ill as a result of being exposed to the DEW toxicity.

3 Several cranes and 'earthmoving' equipment apparatus that are digging up contaminated remnants of GZ where dirt or soil has also been liberally applied as a part of that remediation process. Incidentally, it is not widely discussed, but dirt is to this day May, 2008, still being shipped in and out of GZ and puffs of fuming (albeit smaller now than was the case when this undated photo was taken) are STILL OCCURRING.

Some people call fumes smoke.

 

[jammonius]

Really?

The Bowties are a good reference point since they are in all three pictures.


[qimg]http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o72/ardoucette/wtc_shattered2.jpg[/qimg]

[qimg]http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o72/ardoucette/WTC4160.jpg[/qimg]

This last construction photo will confirm that the bowties were nearly 150 ft above ground level (basement) and construction docs show that the bowties were over 60 ft above what would be street level.

[qimg]http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o72/ardoucette/WTCconstruction-197717.jpg[/qimg]

Your height deduction is incorrect, in my view. Using the construction photo in the manner you suggest results in an absolute contradiction with the information revealed in the photos of the remnants of WTC 1. The lobby windows are not obscured; they are visible as are most of the floors in the 9 storey WTC 5 seen at the left.

 

[theauthor]

Is this really Judy Wood?

 

[tsig]

Your height deduction is incorrect, in my view. Using the construction photo in the manner you suggest results in an absolute contradiction with the information revealed in the photos of the remnants of WTC 1. The lobby windows are not obscured; they are visible as are most of the floors in the 9 storey WTC 5 seen at the left.

I can see every floor there. Looks just like they fell by gravity.

 

[jammonius]

Jammonius is treating the term "directed energy weapon" as a sort of infinitely malleable concept to which (s)he can impute any properties at all which are required to maintain the conspiracist fantasy.

That's not gonna do; it's time to get specific.

So, what kind of energy does Jammonius claim was involved? Electromagnetic radiation? If so, what wavelength? Particle beams? If so, what sort of particles?

Why exactly should such a beam have "toxic effects"? What mechanism would produce these and how could they be detected and their source discovered?

Claiming "DEW" as an all-purpose does-whatever-you-want-it-to deus ex machina is nothing more than handwaving. Repeating "psyop" over and over isn't a "get out of facing reality" card, either.

So, Jammonius, what are the specifics of what you think happened at the WTC?

Drum roll. I think that is what the lawsuits are dealing with.

You've seen that SAIC and ARA manufacture, test, develop and otherwise deal with both DEW and with PSY OPS, correct?

 

[theauthor]

Jammonius is treating the term "directed energy weapon" as a sort of infinitely malleable concept to which (s)he can impute any properties at all which are required to maintain the conspiracist fantasy.

That's not gonna do; it's time to get specific.

So, what kind of energy does Jammonius claim was involved? Electromagnetic radiation? If so, what wavelength? Particle beams? If so, what sort of particles?

Why exactly should such a beam have "toxic effects"? What mechanism would produce these and how could they be detected and their source discovered?

Claiming "DEW" as an all-purpose does-whatever-you-want-it-to deus ex machina is nothing more than handwaving. Repeating "psyop" over and over isn't a "get out of facing reality" card, either.

So, Jammonius, what are the specifics of what you think happened at the WTC?

Well if you put food in the microwave and put it on for extra long....

 

[theauthor]

Seeing as we are graced with the presence of Judy Wood, I would like to ask a question.

Judy, you often say that Dr Jones can't produce an example of a building that was demolished with thermite. So heres my question:

Can you give a previous example of a building demolished by a directed energy weapon?

 

[TexasJack]

Is this really Judy Wood?

I think it is Judge Judy.

 

[tsig]

Well if you put food in the microwave and put it on for extra long....

Teh giant microwave that eat manhatten. oh noes

 

[tsig]

Seeing as we are graced with the presence of Judy Wood, I would like to ask a question.

Judy, you often say that Dr Jones can't produce an example of a building that was demolished with thermite. So heres my question:

Can you give a previous example of a building demolished by a directed energy weapon?

We did a few for practice.

 

[jammonius]

I think we're talking past each other though.

I don't need to try hard to imagine a society in which a major tragedy could be distorted in the public discourse until it bore little resemblance to actual events - it happens all the time.

But the proposition I balk at is that you have evidence for this in these photos. These photos are available the world over. There are a great many very intelligent people, from various different specialities, who have no doubt gone over these photos with a fine-tooth comb - and have absolutely no fear whatsoever in discovering evidence of a conspiracy. No cognitive dissonance. No social fracture. The prospect of adulation, not censure, from superiors.

A large scale psychological operation to steer people away from noticing something untoward simply wouldn't work in a hostile power. You can't tell your engineering corps that America is the great Satan and we seek to undermine it, but not that hard because it wouldn't be patriotic. It would fall straight apart.

I think the "tide is turning" and that the psy op is cracking. I think people are beginning to come forward in precisely the manner you are describing and re-quoted below. Of course, the proof of this remains to be seen. One might say that the existence of the lawsuits that inform this thread is one step in that direction.

It may well be that as the cases move forward "a great many very intelligent people, from various different specialities, who have no doubt gone over these photos with a fine-tooth comb - and have absolutely no fear whatsoever in discovering evidence of a conspiracy...[n]o cognitive dissonance... [n]o social fracture...(with) the prospect of adulation, not censure, from superiors" may well come about.

We do not know this, of course, but we shall see.

 

[jammonius]

Teh giant microwave that eat manhatten. oh noes

Actually, GZ is still being remediated to this day and 130 Liberty is being treated as though it has the equivalent of a combination of leprosy, bubonic plague and the latest strain of bird flu.

If you live in NYC, then you know the Path station at GZ is in its, what, 4th or 5th temporary location. If you use that station, do proceed with care and caution.

I, for one, would not recommend building a 1776 ft tower there.

Now, ask yourself, is that kind of remediation consistent with kerosene fire?

Or, does it matter to you if something "eat manhatten"?

 

[uk_dave]

Requests for "proof of a negative" -- 'provide proof that it was impossible for the impact damage... -- are indicative of an inherent and relentless attempt to obfuscate.

So, in response to your request, no.

But early on in your 'truther' career you did try....and failed, right?

Remember the billiard balls?

 

[uk_dave]

Actually, GZ is still being remediated to this day and 130 Liberty is being treated as though it has the equivalent of a combination of leprosy, bubonic plague and the latest strain of bird flu.

If you live in NYC, then you know the Path station at GZ is in its, what, 4th or 5th temporary location. If you use that station, do proceed with care and caution.

I, for one, would not recommend building a 1776 ft tower there.

Now, ask yourself, is that kind of remediation consistent with kerosene fire?

Or, does it matter to you if something "eat manhatten"?

It's consistent with the massively violent gravity driven collapse of a very large structure into it's own sub-levels and the damage caused to the retaining walls around the footprint of the site.

Your harping (or HARRPing) on about kerosene fires makes you look very silly. Just sayin'.

 

[jammonius]

Obviously you have never been up close and personal with a hollow aluminum aircraft. Any idea of the strength of the leading edge?
...

I haven't, but these poor birds have. As you can see, however, even birds can do signficant damage to thin, hollow, built to be as lightweight as possible, aircraft:

 

[theauthor]

I haven't, but these poor birds have. As you can see, however, even birds can do signficant damage to thin, hollow, built to be as lightweight as possible, aircraft:

[qimg]http://nomoregames.net/911/exploding_the_airliner_crash_myth/bird-wing.jpg[/qimg]

But those pictures aren't of 757 are they?

 

[uk_dave]

Yeah, and yet the wings lift the plane up into the air. Incredible that something so flimsy can lift a heavy fuselage. Or maybe the structure of the plane is stronger than you think.

You're not very good on structures, are you jammonius?

ETA: Actually, the pictures you posted appear to be the tail of a plane.

 

[Confuseling]

You're still missing the thrust of my objection.

Are you telling me that the engineers in Iran, China, North Korea, Venezuela, Cuba and so forth are under the same spell? What could possibly be holding them back? They're not all incompetent, are they. So something must be persuading them to just not look at the evidence - if such evidence exists.

 

[jammonius]

It's consistent with the massively violent gravity driven collapse of a very large structure into it's own sub-levels and the damage caused to the retaining walls around the footprint of the site.

Your harping (or HARRPing) on about kerosene fires makes you look very silly. Just sayin'.

As it's your birthday, I guess, it's ok for you to be silly. Ongoing, nonstop remediation (using dirt), nearly 7 years after the event, might, however, give some thoughtful people cause to re-think the accuracy of what they're being told. Once again, both thoughtful people and people with expertise in environmental cleanup, firefighting and, of course, DEW cleanup just might be thinking about the fact that GZ is not remediated as yet, despite the length and the intensity of the project to do so.

Of course, that SAIC controls access to GZ to this day. The site remains highly veiled and shielded from easy public view. To get an impression of what is actually going on, you have to work pretty hard at it as SAIC is doing as much as it possibly can to prevent the public from knowing what's going on.

I gather that, for some, everything is just so ducky that the site wouldn't even need to be veiled and closed off. They're prepared to accept that it's ok to truck dirt in and out, using hazmat protection, no problem. Don't worry, be happy, it's my birthday, etc.