This is where I think communication breaks down and objections arise, especially on a sceptic forum like this.
Communication- exchange of information: the exchange of information between people, e.g. by means of speaking, writing, or using a common system of signs or behavior
Two-way street, dude.
Objection - expression of opposition:
Maybe that's what we're doing, negotiating a new way of thinking that is pro-active instead of merely reactive. We are changing the rules of engagement.
Maybe we are forming a community of like-minded individuals who provide a refuge from the constant barrage of nonsense we are buffeted with daily everywhere else.
Maybe we are negotiating a way of thinking and a way of being that is our own and that stands up to our admittedly rigorous standards and is in accordance with verificationism.
Maybe we are making a fresh start in developing an understanding of ourselves and the world that is free of the intellectual, moral and emotional bankruptcy of what has come to dominate human thought for millennia.
Maybe we are coming to terms with just how much damage previous ways of dogmatic thinking has been to us and to others. How it was stagnant and humanity-hating.
Maybe we are here so that those testing the waters of free-thought can find a place free of recrimination and vilification in which to do so. I never had the benefit of such a place growing up.
Maybe we are recovering from generations of mass murder, torture and savage brutality brought to us by the "good" people.
Skeptic- somebody who doubts something is true: a doubter of accepted beliefs
- somebody who doubts religious teachings: a doubter of religious doctrines and principles
Doubt does not equal denial. See: Communication above.
Forum (internet) - Internet discussion group: an Internet discussion group for participants with common interests
Have you read any of my posts. If I spammed a religious forum the way some spam this forum, I suspect I'd be banned immediately. What's your favourite religious forum. Maybe I'll show up and present myself as an anti-theist and see how long I last before being banned.
I think it's that communication thing again.
As you say, this is a skeptical forum. Why then is there even a forum for ‘the discussion of philosophy or religion’?
Philosophy and religion are not the same thing. There is work to be done, now that we are shrugging off the malaise.
I mean, there is the general atmosphere that skeptics have heard it all before, and nothing will convince them to change their own perceptions or beliefs.
(This is understandable once an individual believes it is really the product of a brain)
That reaction is a natural one when the most common tactic used by the religious is to assault/spam us with a wall of chapter & verse. Or even better, to assume that we are somehow fooling ourselves and deep down inside we know we are wrong. See: Communication above.
Why would a skeptic forum have the need of putting in place things that they have (in their own brains) surpassed the need to discuss?
Again, religion and philosophy are not the same thing. Admittedly, there are those who think they have surpassed philosophy. I, personally, am not one of them.
You see there were these two brothers. One was named Intuitionism, the other named Verificationism. Intuitionism was jealous of Verificationism, because Verificationism worked and Intuitionism didn't. Intuitionism murdered Verificationism in his sleep. Now a new Verificationism has been born and he survived the sword just long enough to show that he works. Intuitionism is vainly trying to convince people reaping the benefits of Verificationism's work that this is a bad thing. But Verificationism is young still, and despite being an overachiever, there's some growing to adulthood to be done.
Could it be that, they really are not convinced in their beliefs as being the truth?
Did you really just say that? Sigh. How tired.
"Or even better, to assume that we are somehow fooling ourselves and deep down inside we know we are wrong. See: Communication above."
Not only are we not convinced that what we believe is the truth, eschewing truth is the very definition of a skeptic. Not quite what you meant, I understand, but you'll get there if you keep trying.
Belief - acceptance of truth of something:
That's one definition, mmmyup! It is, by no means, the only one, nor is it the most well-considered one. Beliefs can be conditional, too, contingent on something other than the interiors of our own heads...
While I agree that the discussion of anything can result some kind of agreement, I also note that some of the less mature reactions in this and other threads have nothing to do with discussion and often show the reader where such individuals are at in terms of their own beliefs, and this show and tell seems to denote an unfulfilled need in the ones who name-call.
"Or even better, to assume that we are somehow fooling ourselves and deep down inside we know we are wrong. See: Communication above."
Perhaps then, a skeptic forum which has a place for those with other beliefs to communicate those other beliefs in, is no more than a trap waiting to happen.
If so, what is the skeptic saying? That they are so bored they need to create this kind of thing for their entertainment?
Perhaps we welcome thought critical of our own. Maybe we like diversity of thought. Maybe we recognize that as having survival value. Maybe we want to be challenged. Those not taking heed of the errors of the past are doomed to relive them, right?
Maybe there is a standard of what constitutes evidence that is being espoused here, and the only way to describe it is in terms of the other standards that have a grip on people's minds.
I am not sure that it would be fair to say that all skeptics have this need to be entertained by what they regard as inferior belief systems.
I'm not sure that would be fair to say either.
Maybe the skeptics are really fishing for some evidence because they would like to believe they are more than the product of the brain. So they remain open to the possibility that someday something will produce that evidence and free them from the mundane.
Maybe. Maybe we are coming to grips with "the mundane" as you call it, after being told for centuries that it was "only" mundane. Maybe we are coming to terms with not being evil, after all.
Maybe we are watching others desperately fishing off the end of a pier on a dead lake and we want, from sheer human compassion, to point them to the other pier where the fish are nibbling.
Maybe there are other reasons?
Maybe.
Maybe we are minions of the debbil.
Maybe we are Greys holding Elvis's brain in a jar in Area 51.
Maybe we are the underground railway for Bigfeets.
Maybe we skulk around on movie sets painting "C"s on rocks.
Maybe we are the mythical MIB "Theys" the CTers rail against.
Maybe we just wanted a place where we could surreptitiously talk about goats.
Maybe we think we have something to offer to human experience.
Maybe we prefer Hobbits happy and free to Hobbits in chains.
Maybe we revel in diversity and find orthodoxy suffocating.
Maybe we're just people.
Maybe.
Maybe we just want to...
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