The 9/11 Conspiracy Facts

[Corsair 115]

Of course without power there were no security cameras, no security locks on doors and many, many 'engineers' coming in and out of the tower.

The bolded part is my favorite. Breathtaking in its ignorance.

No it isn't! I mean, it's exactly how things work in Hollywood movies, so it must also be how things work in the real world too!

 

[BillyRayValentine]

Ok good, so if someone were to state that "All Sri Lankans are bad swimmers", you would call that person a "racist"?

You clearly didn't understand my posts with respect to this topic. Try reading them again slowly.

More importantly, your sri lankan swimmer analogy is moronic. Saying something is made like a chinese motorcycle is an ethnic pejorative. It's a reference to the stereotype of Chinese incompetence. It's a value judgement, one that is perpetuated by dolts who a) don't have the sense to realize it's offensive and b) would most likely have no first-hand basis for commenting on Chinese motorcycles. They're (you're) just ignorantly repeating a stereotype.

If someone said "all Sri Lankans are bad swimmers", on the other hand, the only thing I'd find offensive is his stupidity - I bet there are a few Sri Lankans who are comfortable in the water. If he said "most Sri Lankans are bad swimmers", that might be more reasonable.

Regardless, no reasonable person would construe either comment as a pejorative. It's an observation. Probably false, sort of interesting if it's true, but nothing more than an observation either way.

Being called a bad swimmer is not demeaning.

 

[Dave Rogers]

You are attempting to deem all racial stereotyping as racist. Thus if I were to state that Sri Lankans are bad swimmers, that would be racist.

Lol, well yes it is when you omit the second half of the sentence:

As you can see from the original quote, I took the sentence in its entirety. Therefore, your implication that I "omit the second half of the sentence" is incorrect, as I quoted the complete sentence. In effect, you're lying by saying I've distorted your quote - which is more or less what I've come to expect from you.

Oh, and if you said of someone else "You swim like a Sri Lankan", and you meant by this that Sri Lankans were bad swimmers - yes, it would be racist, because it would be defining an inferior characteristic of a racial group, just like your "Chinese motorcycle" comment. But by all means keep on defending your racism, because it really helps put your arguments in context.

Dave

 

[Dave Rogers]

Ok. Here's your first problem. I have not said that such people are cowardly. Not at all. The fact is that the power down is an oddity. It would not prove anything. It would not even be illustrative of a personal belief. Yet it would put you firmly in one camp, i.e. one where you are implying that the gov blew up the TTs. This would get you fired from your firm, most surely,and land you in a world of acrimony from the likes of yourself. It would turn the persons life upside down. And all for uttering the occurence of an oddity. This is why people will not come out and talk about it; not cowardice or greed.

Pure speculation. I thought you wanted a thread about facts.

Dave

 

[gumboot]

That was my favorite part as well. In all secure areas I have worked in, a power outage meant the security system locked down all of the secure areas, not unlocked them.

To be fair, I'd be very surprised if this was the case in the WTC. It's pretty standard in office buildings etc. that when there's a power cut all security doors are unlocked. The reason is because otherwise people are trapped in the building. Imagine if there was a fire that cut power to the building?

I know that in New Zealand, at least, it's a legal requirement that security doors in office buildings unlock when without power. It's kind of like how elevators automatically return to the nearest floor and the doors open.

-Gumboot

 

[Dave Rogers]

You interpret his comment correctly, hence why he goes on to say that he cannot see how any racial stereotyping is not racist. As I have said before, such is true on a literal level, but since we are all adults, we can debate this in an adult fashion. For a comment to be "racist", with the meaning that it connotes, is to state that it is not only a negative comment, but one that has sensitive overtones.

I see. So you're now claiming, in effect, that not only are the Chinese incompetent at engineering, but that they are happy to be characterised as incompetent at engineering.

I was in a meeting yesterday where a Chinese colleague of mine was getting extremely unhappy about a situation where he was inferring a slur on the manufacturing ability of a Chinese company that he is dealing with very closely. There was no such slur intended, but he felt so sensitive on the issue that he found it very difficult to keep calm and discuss the problem dispassionately. I considered (not seriously) telling him that his arguments were falling apart like a Chinese motorbike, but I suspect he'd have stormed out of the room and then initiated a disciplinary complaint against me for racial harrassment. And if I'd said it, and he'd raised the complaint, I'd have had no defence, because he'd have been right.

So yes, your comment was not only a negative stereotype, but an offensive one, and one that, in a specific instance I can cite, would have caused serious offence. What is incredible is that you not only defend your behaviour, but that you accuse those who draw it to your attention as childish and irresponsible for doing so. But that seems to be your main technique for dismissing arguments you can't counter; claim that the arguers aren't serious.

I've been putting this off for a while, but I think it's time to give up on you, and on this thread. You stated in your OP that you believed that everyone who disagreed with you was either ignorant or a liar, so it should have been clear that you were simply planning to spread abuse under the guise of serious debate. I'm just disappointed with myself, now, that it took me so long to realise that you're no more than a long-winded Malcolm Kirkman clone.

Dave

 

[Brainache]

A friend of mine bought a Lambretta that was made in India. It fell apart pretty quickly.
On second thought, he wasn't much of a rider so that might have had something to do with it.

Does that help?

 

[funk de fino]

Is he saying that all the power from the 50th floor up was isolated?

Does this mean that the lift had no power? Or does the lift power come from below?

Does this mean there was no power at all at the observation deck that weekend during this 26/36 hr power down?

That may surprise my friends who went up the Twin Towers that very saturday using their Citypass ticket?

There would also be security cameras and locks below the 50 floor level so these engineers could not enter the buidding unoticed or not recorded (or even enter without being searched by security as I was)

I went up the tower in the July before the attacks and often wonder what happened to the lazy security guy who sat on his chair as we went up to the roof, the loud voiced woman who was shouting out the souveneir photo numbers at the top deck, the camera guy who took the photos and the lift operator people who herded you in like cattle for your trip to the top.

This tower was open 365, 9 till late for tourists and i think they would have noticed if they could not get to the top, or there was no power when they got there, or were refused entry to the top deck due to "ongoing work"

Scott is at the least mistaken about the extent of the power isolation and more probably a liar.

My friends would have no fear verifying his story, if indeed true, as they are not US citizens

Also none of this ascertains why the same was not carried out in the other tower?

before posting on this site (i was shown to it by stundie no less) i read through this thread from start to finish and to start with thought that mjd1982 was a quite bright chap and slightly different than your average fable guy, how wrong was i?

the fact that initially he seems intelligent and lucid makes it all the more scary that he believes stories like the power down and that they prove anything

two scenarios for me here:-

1. real fable guy with same MO as all the rest just using finer language skills

2. total windup merchant

 

[Brainache]

Fable Guy! I like that one.

Welcome Funk De Fino! Do you have a sister called Bugga?

 

[Revolutionary91]

http://pointlesswasteoftime.com/mjignore.jpg


Ah, that's better.

Yes it is easier to cover your ears than listen to painful truths sometimes.

 

[Brainache]

Yes it is easier to cover your ears than listen to painful truths sometimes.

Have you ever heard the word "irony"? If so, do you know what it means?
BTW R91, how many on your ignore list now?

 

[twinstead]

The only painful truth here is that the claim of a mysterious power down in the WTC is completely ludicrous.

When shown the light of day, most claims by 911 CTs suffer the same fate.

 

[T.A.M.]

Welcome to the forum Funk.

TAM

 

[HeyLeroy]

A friend of mine bought a Lambretta that was made in India. It fell apart pretty quickly.
On second thought, he wasn't much of a rider so that might have had something to do with it.

Does that help?

Years ago a former neighbour bought a Russian Lada. His first car wash turned his 'whitewalls' into blackwalls.

 

[nicepants]

They were informed by the PA ~3 weeks in advance.

Source please. I'll assume they were informed in writing?

The potential reasons for no others coming forward have been explained by me already to BRV

If one person has already "come forward" then the story is already public. What would stop another witness from coming forward?

 

[lapman]

Let's be more accurate. Of the 10,000 no one has come out and stated that this happened. Not one of them has come out and said that it didnt. We will come onto this in a sec...

Hey, I just read the headlines in the paper that said that Joe Schmo didn't rob or kill anyone today! Let Scott go on national TV and call his co-workers shills for not exposing the "truth." See what happens. Yet, we have at least one person on here that was in the building on on a supposed powered down floor. Yet it wasn't powered down. Hmm.

Ok. Here's your first problem. I have not said that such people are cowardly. Not at all. The fact is that the power down is an oddity. It would not prove anything. It would not even be illustrative of a personal belief. Yet it would put you firmly in one camp, i.e. one where you are implying that the gov blew up the TTs. This would get you fired from your firm, most surely,and land you in a world of acrimony from the likes of yourself. It would turn the persons life upside down. And all for uttering the occurence of an oddity. This is why people will not come out and talk about it; not cowardice or greed.

Yet only Scott is the only one out of ~10,000 that has been brave enough to risk being fired or even killed. Ok.

It becomes evidence when it gets whitewashed by the authorities from history

Or that it is irrelevant. Which the power down is. Remember, this power down went from only a few floors to the top 50 floors as reported by Scott to both towers as reported by the "Truth Movement." This shows how the "Truth Movement" has made a mountain out of an ant hill.

 

[JonnyFive]

All males of Irish/Scots descent have immensely huge wieners.

There, start that stereotype making the rounds and I'll die happy.

It's not a stereotype, 'tis true!

 

[BillyRayValentine]

It's pretty standard in office buildings etc. that when there's a power cut all security doors are unlocked. The reason is because otherwise people are trapped in the building. Imagine if there was a fire that cut power to the building?

That's incorrect. Doors (at least in the U.S.) most definitely don't just unlock, because a power outage could never trap people inside a building. For two reasons. First, security doors accessing individual floors can always be opened manually from the inside. Second, and more importantly, fire stairwell doors and building exits must allow for free egress at all times, by law. Emergency exits (fire stairwells) with unlocked doors must be accessible on each floor, no exceptions.

 

[Cuddles]

To be fair, I'd be very surprised if this was the case in the WTC. It's pretty standard in office buildings etc. that when there's a power cut all security doors are unlocked. The reason is because otherwise people are trapped in the building. Imagine if there was a fire that cut power to the building?

I know that in New Zealand, at least, it's a legal requirement that security doors in office buildings unlock when without power. It's kind of like how elevators automatically return to the nearest floor and the doors open.

-Gumboot

That's what I was going to say. Somewhere really concerned about security, like a bank vault, might work differently, but an office building will always put health and safety before security. My office building definately opens everything if power is lost, and I'm fairly sure that is a legal requirement here in the UK as well.

 

[mjd1982]

Better yet, why don't you ask him to post here? This is something he should be singing from the rooftops if it was indeed true. He should welcome the chance to make his case. But I suspect he won't for some reason...

He is a very humble seemign individual, who has no desire to scream this event from the rooftops. It was burning a hole in him, and so he had to come out and say something. He has no inclination to travel the world and spread his story. Were he doing such, you would be stating that he was profiteering off his "lies", so this just illustrates that yu have no regard for the truth iether way.