The Bible is 100% true and to be read literally

[Ducky]

Right, but you would be figuring out a design that was THERE, not how the plane spontaneously formed itself from nothing.

But the plane didn't spontaneously form from nothing. The engineering of aircraft has been taking place for many many years.

 

[Freethinker]

A worldwide flood would be devestating. And what brought it on? The Bible says the springs of the deep were broken open. If enough water came from those springs to flood the earth, if pressure was released on a volcanic scale, the water retreated to the sunk down ocean basin after it was over. If you ever look at a topographical map of the midatlantic ridge, it indicates a huge and uniform upheaval...you can even see parallel ridges both east and west of the ridge running all the way from north to south. The other upheavals from a destruction like this...where water is erupted along the entire ridge, could displace a global flood with newly formed mountain ranges, while the mid Antantic basic sunk. So I think much of the water is still with us, found in newer deeper oceans... but that is my opinion... and you know what they say about those!

You are pretending like you understand the physics here. It is painfully obvious you don't. You are talking about enough water to cover the entire earth to a depth of about 5 miles. Somewhere in the neighborhood of 1 billion cubic miles of water. If portions of the atmosphere somehow were trapped to occupy this space to allow the water to rise it would consume most of the breathable atmosphere, killing all air breathing animals.

To put it bluntly, there is absolutely no way this happened. Anyone arguing to the contrary is simply professing their ignorance of basic physics.

 

[CynicalSkeptic]

You're right, I should have stated my source.

so...

Or would you prefer to retract your statement?

 

[Ossai]

2LifeGuy

In short I came to believe there is more evidence for the Bible's version of how the world was put together. I know that sounds crazy, especially since I believed the other way for so long... If I do have on blinders, I don't mind being chanllenged about it.

Would you mind presenting and discussing what you believe that evidence is?

Well, actually, mythology (and I do enjoy Homer) has a lot to do with things obviously made of myth. However, the design required to make a system that utilizes the energy of the sun, put requires pollination to replicate has to do with an intelligence that goes beyond anything yet available to us.

This is nothing more than an argument from ignorance. You’ve posted a few more, but I won’t list them individually.

God, on the other hand, used his power to lay his life down in pain on our behalf. (Sorry to be so preachy!)

You may want to start another thread on this one. Jesus was not the messiah, he did not fulfill the prophecies and god directly excluded the Davidic lines used in the bible to link Jesus to David.
There was no sacrifice. A three day weekend does not equal a sacrifice.

So far, NO positive mutations which benefit a creature with NEW information has ever been observed. That is why they never show a picture of a positive mutation in text books...only negative ones.

Ignorance speaking again.

Ossai

 

[CynicalSkeptic]

To put it bluntly, there is absolutely no way this happened. Anyone arguing to the contrary is simply professing their ignorance of basic physics.

Or just bypassing physics, and saying goddidit.

 

[2LifeGuy]

Evolution does not add one system at a time. The species as a whole evolves.

You really should learn about evolution, if for no other reason than so you can make more coherent arguments against it.

I thought evolution states that life moved from simple one-celled organisms more complex, and on eventually to amphibians. To do that there are many internal systems.

How can a frog make it with a half evolved stomach, not yet able to digest, and half evolved reproductive organs, not yet able to reproduce. And even a frog has many other systems operating at once to keep it alive. There isn't convincing evidence that any organism can survive in a half-evolved state...especially with regard to internal organs.

Creation, on the otherhand reflects the power, wisdom and even love of God. The evidence is in the design.

 

[Ducky]

I thought evolution states that life moved from simple one-celled organisms more complex, and on eventually to amphibians. To do that there are many internal systems.

How can a frog make it with a half evolved stomach, not yet able to digest, and half evolved reproductive organs, not yet able to reproduce. And even a frog has many other systems operating at once to keep it alive. There isn't convincing evidence that any organism can survive in a half-evolved state...especially with regard to internal organs.

Creation, on the otherhand reflects the power, wisdom and even love of God. The evidence is in the design.

You claim to have studied evolution but this post makes me question that.

What evolutionist has ever claimed a "half-evolved" anything was ever in existence?

 

[aggle-rithm]

So far, NO positive mutations which benefit a creature with NEW information has ever been observed. That is why they never show a picture of a positive mutation in text books...only negative ones.

Obviously there are observable changes in animals...in breeding programs for example...but selective breeding is making use of features that are already contained in the gene pool.

I bet there is a scientist who will challenge this, but I'm just saying after some research, I have never seen evidence for a true positive mutation.

Just to name one example: Human populations that have lived at high altitudes for many generations (such as the Native Americans living in the Andes mountains) have large chests and short stature, making them ideally suited for their environment. Did God make them that way?

I don't think so. I think that, after the people settled there, babies born with genes for large ribcages and small stature were more likely to survive to adulthood, and so those are the traits that got passed down. In time, these traits dominated throughout the population.

Of course, you must realize that "positive mutation" is a relative term. The mutation is only positive or negative in the context of the organism's environment.

 

[cyborg]

2LifeGuy - I will make the same offer I made jesus_freak.

Stop presenting creationist website arguments badly, leave the URLs here and then go away if you are not even going to attempt to understand anything. We do not need you as a proxy to a website.

Thanks.

 

[2LifeGuy]

To put it bluntly, there is absolutely no way this happened. Anyone arguing to the contrary is simply professing their ignorance of basic physics.

Your question to me is where do I think all the water went. The earth is about 2/3 covered with water. It's there. It is reasonable to say that without the deep basins, this water could conceivably cover the earth. My own uneducated, backward, belief is that is what happened. Your belief is opposite. I can live with that.

 

[Ducky]

My own uneducated, backward, belief ...

Thanks for clearing that up.


Are you going to retract your obviously false statement regarding the 100th anniversary edition of Origin of Species?

 

[Cosmo]

My own uneducated, backward, belief is that is what happened. Your belief is opposite. I can live with that.

If you freely admit that you hold "uneducated, backwards" beliefs, then what are you doing here? Are you trying to learn something, or just preach? Do you think that you will convince people who hold educated beliefs?

 

[Katana]

I thought evolution states that life moved from simple one-celled organisms more complex, and on eventually to amphibians. To do that there are many internal systems.

How can a frog make it with a half evolved stomach, not yet able to digest, and half evolved reproductive organs, not yet able to reproduce. And even a frog has many other systems operating at once to keep it alive. There isn't convincing evidence that any organism can survive in a half-evolved state...especially with regard to internal organs.

Creation, on the otherhand reflects the power, wisdom and even love of God. The evidence is in the design.

And what evidence exists in the fossils of now-extinct members of Hominidae?

 

[2LifeGuy]

so...

Or would you prefer to retract your statement?

Since I have the book at home, I'd rather check my source! I'll retract if if the quote's not there.

Thanks

 

[grayman]

Your question to me is where do I think all the water went. The earth is about 2/3 covered with water. It's there. It is reasonable to say that without the deep basins, this water could conceivably cover the earth. My own uneducated, backward, belief is that is what happened. Your belief is opposite. I can live with that.

But a belief is merely that, only a belief, an opinion.

All we are asking for here is evidence.

 

[Ducky]

Since I have the book at home, I'd rather check my source! I'll retract if if the quote's not there.

Thanks

Are you claiming to have a 100th anniversary copy of "On the Origin of Species" By Darwin from 1959, or are you referring to another book that claims this introduction is in it?


Also, the introduction written by the author generally attributed to by your urban legend was written in 1928.

Keith, Arthur. Introduction to "The origin of species by means of natural selection", by Charles Darwin. London: J.M. Dent, 1928.

But he does NOT say what you think he does.

The Origin of Species is still the book which contains the most complete demonstration that the law of evolution is true.

But please, do look it up.

 

[CynicalSkeptic]

BUT if population only doubled every 20 years, within 180 years, total births would hit 1024. The Bible states original human life spans of hundreds of years.

Check your figures and assumptions. This is patently incorrect.
Creationist Claim CB620:

Actually, it's not bad depending on your exact assumptions:

If you start with a population of 4 at year 0, assume no deaths (hey, everyone lives to be like 600 or so), and the population doubles every 20 years and all births take place only in 20 year intervals, there are 1024 births in year 180.

I can't figure out the UBB code for tables, so this isn't formatted very well, but you get the idea...
[table=""]
year, population, births
0 4 0
20 8 4
40 16 8
60 32 16
80 64 32
100 128 64
120 256 128
140 512 256
160 1024 512
180 2048 1024[/table]

 

[NobbyNobbs]

But the plane didn't spontaneously form from nothing. The engineering of aircraft has been taking place for many many years.

You might even say that the engineering of aircraft is evolving....

I thought evolution states that life moved from simple one-celled organisms more complex, and on eventually to amphibians. To do that there are many internal systems.

How can a frog make it with a half evolved stomach, not yet able to digest, and half evolved reproductive organs, not yet able to reproduce. And even a frog has many other systems operating at once to keep it alive. There isn't convincing evidence that any organism can survive in a half-evolved state...especially with regard to internal organs.

Creation, on the otherhand reflects the power, wisdom and even love of God. The evidence is in the design.

Again, you are not demonstrating an adequate understanding of the process of evolution. I'd suggest you read up on it before deciding it is not possible.

Your question to me is where do I think all the water went. The earth is about 2/3 covered with water. It's there. It is reasonable to say that without the deep basins, this water could conceivably cover the earth. My own uneducated, backward, belief is that is what happened. Your belief is opposite. I can live with that.

Do you have any (mathematical) evidence that, should the deep basins of the ocean not exist, the water level would be 5 miles high world-wide? This is a good thought experiment for which I don't have the data to perform. Let's assume that rather than being sunken, the sea floor was at sea level. In other words, there is land and mountains but no valleys or trenches, and that all the water on the planet is uniformly covering it instead of concentrated in the ocean wells. How deep in it would we be?

 

[2LifeGuy]

2LifeGuy

You may want to start another thread on this one. Jesus was not the messiah, he did not fulfill the prophecies and god directly excluded the Davidic lines used in the bible to link Jesus to David.
There was no sacrifice. A three day weekend does not equal a sacrifice.

Ossai

Jesus did fufill the prophecies and the Davidic line was unbroken through his mother's geneology (Luke 3:23) gives her geneology, listing Joseph as a son of Heli, his father-in-law. The Davidic line was carried through his mother.

The way I know the sacrifice is real is because God's love changed me. The changes are proof to me, but obviously not proof to you... and as you say, it would be better to start another thread on that one!

 

[CynicalSkeptic]

Are you claiming to have a 100th anniversary copy of "On the Origin of Species" By Darwin from 1959..."

Actually, the "On" was dropped early on:

The sixth edition was published by Murray on 19 February 1872 with "On" dropped from the title,

[/pedant]

And I can find nothing about a 100th anniversary addition anywhere, except of course all those creationist sites that make all the bogus quote claims.