10 story hole in WTC 7

[aggle-rithm]

No kidding!

And remember, this was a 30-story skyscraper, 2nd-tallest imploded building ever, and it took massive amounts of work and a large number of charges. The amount of work required to bring down something like the WTC, significantly larger, would be frightening I bet.

Do you know anything about the old Fort Worth National Bank building, which is now known as The Tower?

I understand it was slated for demolition, but the cost was prohibitive so they ended up just remodeling it.

Since it was so big (36 stories, if I remember correctly) they couldn't just implode it, they were going to dismantle it floor-by-floor.

I bring this up as an example for the troofers who say that the World Trade Center was a financial disaster and it was cheaper to just destroy it than to clean up all the asbestos, etc.

 

[aggle-rithm]

Are you just begging for someone to whip out the Google-Fu and prove to you how ignorant that claim is?

Claims aren't ignorant.

People are.

 

[Belz...]

I bring this up as an example for the troofers who say that the World Trade Center was a financial disaster and it was cheaper to just destroy it than to clean up all the asbestos, etc.

Yet another proof that ignorance brings about certainty, while knowledge results in doubt.

Funny that.

 

[Cuddles]

Does anyone else find it quite funny that the tags for this thread are "wtc 7" and "did it exist"? I keep expecting to find people claiming that WTC7 was actually just a hologram, probably generated by a space-based laser cannon operated by elves.

 

[Belz...]

Wouldn't be surprising, at this point.

 

[Coritani]

Does anyone else find it quite funny that the tags for this thread are "wtc 7" and "did it exist"? I keep expecting to find people claiming that WTC7 was actually just a hologram, probably generated by a space-based laser cannon operated by elves.

That's ludicrous.


Everybody knows that Pixies would operate it, rather than elves. I mean, come on, Cuddles.

 

[Atomic Glee]

Do you know anything about the old Fort Worth National Bank building, which is now known as The Tower?

I understand it was slated for demolition, but the cost was prohibitive so they ended up just remodeling it.

Yep - The Tower was going to be demolished, and there had been talk of an implosion, actually, though I don't think that was the likely path. As I recall, it was going to be quite expensive to demolish, however they did it. At the time, the building's owners were the Bass family, the local billionaires who own significant bits of downtown including the wildly successful Sundance Square entertainment/shopping district. While the name doesn't mean much to out-of-towners, let me just put it this way: if the Bass family thought it was going to be prohibitively expensive, then it must have been pretty freakin' expensive.

Fortunately, new developers arrived with a proposal to remake the building into Fort Worth's first highrise condo tower, and the rest is history, sparking off the current downtown housing boom here.

 

[Christopher7]

Two of the biggest buildings in the world collapsed next to WTC7. There are photos showing massive damage to the building. There are witness reports of massive damage

The word 'massive' is what's in question here.
There are 4 statements in direct conflict with the '10 story gouge' statement.
Therefore:
It didn't exist.

Either you believe that the '10 story gouge' statement was a misinterpretation of the damage


or
you believe the firefighters who said there was
"no heavy debris in the lobby" were mistaken

and the person who reported

"debris damage across 1/4 width of the south face, starting several floors above the atrium (extended from the ground to 5th floor), noted that the atrium glass was still intact." was mistaken

and the firefighter who

"walked the 9th floor along the south side folowing the collapse of WTC1, the only damage to the 9th floor facade occured at the south west corner." was mistaken

and Chief Fellini, who was in charge of operations at West and Vesy,
doesn't know the difference between:

"ripped steel out from between the 3rd and the 6th floors"
and
"middle 1/4 to 1/3 width of the south face was gouged out [30 to 40 feet deep] from floor 10 to the ground"

 

[Christopher7]

Are you just begging for someone to whip out the Google-Fu and prove to you how ignorant that claim is?

My bad

 

[Christopher7]

No proof ? That's funny. We have plenty of visual evidence, expert opinions, eyewitness testimony, and physical evidence, that it happened as the "official" story says. What does "proof" mean to you, then ?

We do not have physical evidence

http://wtc.nist.gov/pubs/NISTNCSTAR1-3BDraft.pdf

pg 5

"lack of WTC 7 steel precludes tests on the actual material from the building"

pg 27

"NIST possesses 236 structural elements from the World Trade Center (WTC) buildings"

"No pieces could be unambiguously identified as being from WTC 7"

 

[CHF]

Chris,

WTC7. Was. Leaning.

How does a CD lean a building?

 

[Christopher7]

There is a great deal of circumstantial evidence to support this opinion. There is no evidence to the contrary.

In this thread i am pointing out that some of that evidence is incorrect.

Do you argue as vociferously on CT forums against the opinion that CD brouight down the building? If not , why not?

No. Because i believe WTC 7 was a CD

Before you ask again, This thread is about the '10 story gouge', NOT CD.

 

[Christopher7]

Chris,

WTC. Was. Leaning.

Source?

 

[Dog Town]

Source?

Dare ya... double!

 

[CHF]

Source?

Here's one: Quote:
"Yeah. There was enough there and we were marking off. There were a lot of damaged apparatus there that were covered. We tried to get searches in those areas. By now, this is going on into the afternoon, and we were concerned about additional collapse, not only of the Marriott, because there was a good portion of the Marriott still standing, but also we were pretty sure that 7 World Trade Center would collapse. Early on, we saw a bulge in the southwest corner between floors 10 and 13, and we had put a transit on that and we were pretty sure she was going to collapse. You actually could see there was a visible bulge, it ran up about three floors. It came down about 5 o�clock in the afternoon, but by about 2 o�clock in the afternoon we realized this thing was going to collapse."

Note the part about the "transit." That's a device that shows if something is moving. WTC7 WAS MOVING.

Please explain how demolition charges make a building lean like that before knocking it down.

Here's another: Quote:
"Anyway, I was looking at WTC7 and I noticed that it wasn’t looking like it was straight. It was really weird. The closest corner to me (the SE corner) was kind of out of whack with the SW corner. It was impossible to tell whether that corner (the SW) was leaning over more or even if it was leaning the other way. With all of the smoke and the debris pile, I couldn’t exactly tell what was go- ing on, but I sure could see the building was leaning over in a way it certainly should not be. I asked another guy looking with me and he said “That building is going to come down, we better get out of here.” So we did." –M.J., Employed at 45 Broadway.

 

[CHF]

And Chris:

WHY WAS THE DEMOLTION OF WTC7 SO DAMN QUIET?

Exactly what kind of explosives do you think were used?

 

[beachnut]

No

Do you think the government has ever or will ever investigate itself and find itself guilty of anything ?

WaterGate!

Darn. You have not checked it out. The government is always finding itself guilty you just have to check it out.

You have to research and understand. Like you have already presented enough information to support your 10 story hole in the WTC7.

Do you always argue both sides and loose? You seem to ignore the fact you have presented more than enough information to support damage in excess of a 10 story hole being in WTC7.

Did you hear the steel in WTC 1 and 2 was numbered. Did you know WTC7 was not designed by the same people who did WTC 1 and 2? Just wondering what you are up to.

So why are you still asking about the big hole in WTC7 after proving it is there with all your stuff you presented. You did a good job convincing me there is a big 10 story or better hole in the WTC7. Good job! Thanks.

 

[Alt+F4]

Do you think the government has ever or will ever investigate itself and find itself guilty of anything ?

In no particular order:

1. Watergate
2. FBI’s “Virtual Case File” fiasco
3. Mars Polar Lander
4. Abscam
5. Mars Climate Orbiter
6. Randy "Duke" Cunningham Bribery Case
7. Rep. Ney pleads guilty to federal charges of corruption & bribery involving disgraced lobbyist Jack Abramoff.
8. Challenger Explosion
9. Former Bush aide David Safavian convicted on four of five felony counts of lying and obstruction.
10. Vioxx

There’s just ten. Need I go on?

 

[Christopher7]

Here's one: Quote:
"Yeah. There was enough there and we were marking off. There were a lot of damaged apparatus there that were covered. We tried to get searches in those areas. By now, this is going on into the afternoon, and we were concerned about additional collapse, not only of the Marriott, because there was a good portion of the Marriott still standing, but also we were pretty sure that 7 World Trade Center would collapse. Early on, we saw a bulge in the southwest corner between floors 10 and 13, and we had put a transit on that and we were pretty sure she was going to collapse. You actually could see there was a visible bulge, it ran up about three floors. It came down about 5 o�clock in the afternoon, but by about 2 o�clock in the afternoon we realized this thing was going to collapse."

A visible bulge in the SW corner does not mean the building is leaning.

It means the SW corner is sagging.

Deputy Chief Hayden did not say the building was leaning.

For the building to lean, the bulge would have to run all the way across the west and south sides at a minimum.

Here's another: Quote:
"Anyway, I was looking at WTC7 and I noticed that it wasn’t looking like it was straight. It was really weird. The closest corner to me (the SE corner) was kind of out of whack with the SW corner. It was impossible to tell whether that corner (the SW) was leaning over more or even if it was leaning the other way. With all of the smoke and the debris pile, I couldn’t exactly tell what was go- ing on, but I sure could see the building was leaning over in a way it certainly should not be. I asked another guy looking with me and he said “That building is going to come down, we better get out of here.” So we did." –M.J., Employed at 45 Broadway.

So that's your case? Some guy thought it was leaning.

Look at all the photographs of WTC 7.

Can you see the building leaning in any of them ?

 

[Christopher7]

Dare ya... double!

Respond to post #388
Who is mistaken?

post #399
Where's the 'lean'?