LCFC - Coming soon to a cinema near you...

[hellaeon]

whats a CIA disinfo artist

 

[WildCat]

whats a CIA disinfo artist

Good ol' hellaeon, never breaking cover!

 

[60hzxtl]

USA Today headline - Conspiracy film rewrites Sept. 11

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2006-04-27-conspiracies-sept-11_x.htm

Vanity Fair headline - Click Here for Conspiracy
With $6,000 and a laptop computer, three kids from upstate New York made a documentary about 9/11 that spread across the Internet and threw millions for a loop.

http://www.vanityfair.com/ontheweb/features/2006/08/loosechange200608

Just 2 examples.

There's no business like SNOW business!

 

[Moving On]

your research is 100 times shallower than mine:

Example one

9:35 Flight 77 is reported at 7000 feet … .*


· * This statement conflicts with the statement that the transponder was turned off. Primary radar alone does not detect altitude.


Your failure to understand how radars can be used to find an altitude of an aircraft not squawking Mode C. Your research is not very exhaustive. You post your information not to tell the truth but to mislead.

Your web site continues to this moment prove you have not the research capabilities you claim!

Fact is : your own words area " There are factual errors here I am aware of." Proving your research is not up to par.

What are you directing your energy to but mislead?

Because primary radar gives position information but lacks altitude information, mode C and mode S transponders report altitude.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transponder_code

Bill Keaton was responsible for the airspace in which United 93 disappeared from radar on 9/11, or at least for those airplanes flying between 24,000 and 33,000 feet. Keaton worked for Cleveland Center, the Oberlin-based control tower that monitors a huge swatch of airspace over middle America for the FAA. Today, he is a spokesman for his union, the National Air Traffic Controllers Association, but still logs many hours in front of those radar screens.

"I was told not to let anyone within 20 miles of that plane," says Keaton. "It was coming right through the middle of my sector. I just watched it march through the scope on a line heading toward Washington."

Someone had turned off United 93's transponder, so it was impossible to tell at what altitude the plane was flying. Keaton kept other aircraft as far from its radar signal as possible.


"Once [93] disappeared from my scope, I asked another pilot if he could go down and take a look. He said he saw black smoke coming from the area where United 93 lost signal. I heard a confirmation of the crash [from another pilot] as well."

http://www.freetimes.com/story/681

From the radar analysis on all four planes.

http://www.ntsb.gov/info/Rec_Radar_ Data_ Study_all _aircraft.pdf

Hmmmmmmmmmm

 

[WildCat]

The families themselves are fighting for the release of information. I respect them very much. It is the USG that has disrespected them by creating a void for the CT's to fill. Read about the outrage of Captain Burlington's family in regards to the USG trying to refuse him and Arlington burial. Then how the USG tried to refuse him a missing man formation. This is after he crashed into his old offices and killed former co-workers.

How about the outrage of the Burlingame family at the LC crew?

"They aren't truth-tellers looking to save the world," she says. "They're con artists hoping to sucker conspiracy-theory paranoids or anti-government malcontents into shelling out their hard-earned dollars."

How does that make you feel Russell?

 

[Mince]

Heres a quote from Dylan from his blog:


Hey, Screw Loose Change, have you got anything to say to the rescue workers who believe 9/11 was an inside job? It's astounding how quickly people can throw insults and conjecture from behind a monitor, but when it comes to face to face confrontation, these same people back down from any opportunity.

Go to any of the NYC 9/11 Truth meetings. Meet Craig Bartmer, David Miller, Kevin McPadden, Mike McCormick, tell any of those four people to their face that they're "kook Liberal conspiracy nutjobs"

Tell Willie Rodriguez he didn't hear explosions in the basement of the North Tower prior to the plane's impact. Tell Jose Sanchez, his co-worker, that he just imagined the entire thing and was confused.

Tell the Jersey Girls they're out of their mind.

Tell Bill Doyle and Bob McIlvaine that their sons were simply taken out by angry Muslims.

I'd love to see the response.

Cowards.

I totally agree with him on that

This is laughable, yet typical.

Hey, Screw Loose Change, have you got anything to say to the rescue workers who believe 9/11 was an inside job?

I do. Prove it.

It's astounding how quickly people can throw insults and conjecture from behind a monitor, but when it comes to face to face confrontation, these same people back down from any opportunity.

Says Dylan Avery, while throwing insults and conjecture from behind a monitor.

but when it comes to face to face confrontation, these same people back down from any opportunity.

Bullsh*t. Not everyone has to be belligerent and confrontational (read: Alex Jones) when discussing or debating 9/11. You can tell someone you don't believe them, or that they have not produced enough evidence, without calling them a liar. Most rational persons will understand this.

Go to any of the NYC 9/11 Truth meetings. Meet Craig Bartmer, David Miller, Kevin McPadden, Mike McCormick, tell any of those four people to their face that they're "kook Liberal conspiracy nutjobs"

Wish I could (go to the meetings). But again, just because someone believes something, or says something, does not make it true on its face.

Tell Bill Doyle and Bob McIlvaine that their sons were simply taken out by angry Muslims.

O.k. What are their email addys?

I'd love to see the response.

So would I.

Cowards.

Imbecile.

 

[Gravy]

Hi there, Russell, et al.

Hello, Atheist. I don't go to the LC forum since I was banned long ago, but this was my experience there:

I was banned without warning after 4 days, although I had broken no rules, posted only in the thread I started, and my thread was by far the most popular on the site.

The guy who started the forum, Dylan Avery, posted more than once that I was a CIA agent and that Mark Roberts is not my real name (it is).

An LC administrator posted that I should suffer the death of a traitor.

 

[T.A.M.]

What did I ever do to you to be insulted like that?!

lol

I have the utmost respect for film editors. In my spare time I edit independent films using adobe premiere pro. A good editor is a wonderful thing to behold...hence my point that he is a below average one.

TAM

 

[hellaeon]

From the radar analysis on all four planes.

http://www.ntsb.gov/info/Rec_Radar_ Data_ Study_all _aircraft.pdf

[qimg]http://www.pentagonresearch.com/lc2/radar1.jpg[/qimg]

[qimg]http://www.pentagonresearch.com/lc2/radar1a.jpg[/qimg]

Hmmmmmmmmmm
[/B]

Russell, im serious now (truly!), can you explain what your getting at with this? What do you propose this is suggesting. Allbeit just innuendo.

Cheers

 

[milesalpha]

USA Today headline - Conspiracy film rewrites Sept. 11

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2006-04-27-conspiracies-sept-11_x.htm

Vanity Fair headline - Click Here for Conspiracy
With $6,000 and a laptop computer, three kids from upstate New York made a documentary about 9/11 that spread across the Internet and threw millions for a loop.

http://www.vanityfair.com/ontheweb/features/2006/08/loosechange200608

Just 2 examples.

Ok now please indicate how either of these articles show that LC has any viability as a theater release. As I said, I am viewing this strictly from the aspect of a distributor picking up the rights to LC for a general cinematic release. Neither article would encourage any studio to do so, if anything they would have the reverse effect.

 

[beachnut]

truthers are liars; USA Today

USA Today headline - Conspiracy film rewrites Sept. 11

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2006-04-27-conspiracies-sept-11_x.htm

Vanity Fair headline - Click Here for Conspiracy
With $6,000 and a laptop computer, three kids from upstate New York made a documentary about 9/11 that spread across the Internet and threw millions for a loop.

http://www.vanityfair.com/ontheweb/features/2006/08/loosechange200608

Just 2 examples.

The magazine calls you guys liars ---- did you read your own post?

'They aren't truth-tellers'
Most of what the film alleges is refuted by the evidence at hand. Anything not answered definitively by the government is interpreted by the film as proof of a coverup.

they are making fun of truthers

are you blind because you are a truther and you think people calling you names is because they have not read your web site with errors on it, now confirmed by you own statements.

Are we missing something. You mention the pilot family of flight 77, and we find they think the movement you are with and all the people are "... con artists hoping to sucker conspiracy-theory paranoids or anti-government malcontents into shelling out their hard-earned dollars."

every piece of so called evidence is hearsay or just misleading, you have joined the con of truth;. Just try to introduce some real facts please.

This is not a personal attack you said things that are false and still persist to add to the pile of misleading information, introducing the pilot's family as if they are in the truth movement.

 

[bjb]

Russell, please tell my how the USA Today article helps your cause. WildCat beat me in posting the very uncomplimentary statements the article makes about you 9/11 deniers. True, people who read these are learning about the Loose Change, but these articles completely debunk the film and conspiracy theorists with statements like:

People believe in conspiracy theories because the truth "is either too simple or too remote," says sociologist Clifton Bryant of Virginia Tech University, who has made a study of "deviant logic" and behavior.
"We're always ready to believe something about which we know nothing," he says.

So the article says that conspiracy theorists are ready to believe things without adequate facts or understanding. These articles are written to trash Loose Change and conspiracy theorists in general. Why do you believe that such articles help your cause?

 

[Moving On]

Hi there, Russell, et al.

Lo and behold, the TRUTH about LC forum members is exactly the opposite to what the above would suggest. I told the forum in my first post that I am a member here and nobody banned me, or even cried about it. In fact, most people merely wanted to know why JREF members were so unfailingly rude and obnoxious to anyone who comes in here and mentions LC!

Keep it up, Russell, this is the kind of stuff which will turn ever more people to your way of thinking - flawed, in my opinion, though it may be.

p.s. to Russell, which ISP are you using that lists New Zealand with its alternative name of "Aotearoa" as well?

The Atheist,

Thank you for your kind words and fair observations!

The reason JREFers are not banned there any more is because despite my treatment here I have argued for their right to be their. Dylan agrees. I was accused but the nuttier ones in the bunch of being a government agent. They defected to another forum and are still ranting about me being a "plant" for my defense of JREFers.

As an admin there now, the main problems I have to deal with in terms of reported posts are involving rude JREFers. I still have bot banned a single one.

Thank you for agreeing to disagree as a gentleman. I will be honest and say many of my theories have been flawed along this path. I went from the typical no plane idea at the Pentagon to actually forensically being able to demonstrate it strongly which again has put me in the agent category.

The more I have researched the broader aspects of 9/11 and especially since my experience here, I am still very convinced of a conspiracy. I will remain so until I am not. I don't think it is gonna happen here since very little evidence ever gets discussed.

Your question is one my dad asked and I can't remember the answer. There was some pre Internet antiquated system recorded too. He looked it up but it was a little technical for me.

Russell

 

[The Atheist]

Hello, Atheist. I don't go to the LC forum since I was banned long ago, but this was my experience there:

I was banned without warning after 4 days, although I had broken no rules, posted only in the thread I started, and my thread was by far the most popular on the site.

The guy who started the forum, Dylan Avery, posted more than once that I was a CIA agent and that Mark Roberts is not my real name (it is).

An LC administrator posted that I should suffer the death of a traitor.

As I said, it's not an area I have any interest in, so I certainly don't know the history, but obviously things have changed and the people seem to be totally non-rabid. From what I can tell, most of them know all about your critiques on 9/11, but they don't see you as some kind of FEMA/CIA killjoy at all. Maybe you should try going back over there now, they seem quite reasonable, although I don't intend spending a lot of time there.

One odd thing, most of them are atheists.

 

[CptColumbo]

[w]e're going to be in theaters in 2007, no matter what happens.

Translation: every distributer said no.

Why would anyone go to a movie that they give away on the streets of NY and can watch for free on the internet. IMO no distributer is going to pick it up for any wide distribution to theatres. Maybe one in NY and one in LA, but I doubt they would waste their time with it.

 

[60hzxtl]

Russell, please tell my how the USA Today article helps your cause. WildCat beat me in posting the very uncomplimentary statements the article makes about you 9/11 deniers. True, people who read these are learning about the Loose Change, but these articles completely debunk the film and conspiracy theorists

After they see their names in print they stop reading. Then they stop comprehending.

Reeeeealy!

 

[T.A.M.]

I think this thread should be renamed "name calling, and banter"

TAM

 

[The Atheist]

From the old LC Forum:

The Atheist, you don't have the slightest clue what has gone on over the last 6 months.

Correct, and I admitted that - but they must have undergone radical change. Surely the fact that they have moved along means that they are going to meet you somewhere in the middle eventually.

That old flies/vinegar/jam business...

 

[Brainster]

Here are my suggestions:

1) Talk to FEMA enigneers.
2) Talk to Pentagon rescuers including the officers in charge.
3) Talk to the NTSB agents in charge of the FDR.
4) Attempt to talk with the FBI.
5) Talk to Donald Rumsfeld's personal historian.
6) Talk with eyewitnesses (many).
7) Talk to the Special agents who detained you one day.
8) Talk to the Pentagon police who detained you the other day and deleted your digital photos from your camera.
9) Talk to the Arlington County dispatch center and listen to tapes never released to the public.
10) Talk to various professor level people (non CT) about the videos released.

THEN

Talk with me.

And then we'll conclude as you have that Flight 77 crashed into the Pentagon?

 

[roger]

Russell, please tell my how the USA Today article helps your cause. WildCat beat me in posting the very uncomplimentary statements the article makes about you 9/11 deniers. True, people who read these are learning about the Loose Change, but these articles completely debunk the film and conspiracy theorists with statements like:

Gee, I don't know, bjb, this sounds pretty complimentary:

"The only thing they (the filmmakers) seem to have gotten right about the Sept. 11 attacks is the date when they occurred," says Debra Burlingame, whose brother was the pilot of American Flight 77 that crashed into the Pentagon.

"They aren't truth-tellers looking to save the world," she says. "They're con artists hoping to sucker conspiracy-theory paranoids or anti-government malcontents into shelling out their hard-earned dollars."