Who Disrespects NYPD & NYFD

Okay, I was able to watch the video. The audio is certainly out of synch, which is an issue.

But I don't get it. You CTs are citing this as a fake because the guy draws a conclusion that makes sense?

This thread started with an appeal for us to believe an eyewitness.

What happened?

See you later. I'm sure there will be pages and pages of coherent CT hypotheses backed with evidence when I log back in.
 
If you're going to argue that claim, Usual, you might just as well argue that the government allows the tobacco companies to kill hundreds of thousands of people a year. What's the difference?

(Note to non-CTers: I know what the difference is, so don't flame me... :)
 
The very same people who may have been involved in 9/11 are directing a chain of command to kill other people right now as we speak. Many of those people are innocent.

When they set out to "transform" the balance of military power in the world by having forward bases in the Gulf which they falsely justified with 9/11 and WMD, do you think as military planners they made any estimate of U.S. troop deaths for the invasion and occupation of the Middle East?

The answer is yes they did have casualty estimates. Let's say it was 2000 troops.

So now these people have created a falsely justified war and knowingly sent at least 2000 U.S. citizens to their death.

They also have "collateral" casualty estimates for civilian deaths. Let's say it was 10,000.

So once again knowing that the reasons for going to war were a lie they killed those 10,000.

Since they knew in advance it was a lie and had some reasonable expectation how many people would die, then they have acted in a premeditated fashion to kill American citizens and the citizens of the Middle East.

What else do you need?

The actual death toll of U.S. troops in the two wars is now higher than the number of people killed the day of 9/11.

If they are doing it now, why is 9/11 any different?

This is not an accusation, but instead an observation of what is and has actually happened in terms of the U.S. citizens we refer to as soldiers sent to die by people who knew the justification for war was false.

Just stop thinking of your next theoretical argument for a minute and let that sink in. Somebody probably died while I was typing this. I mean really died - not like on TV and stuff.

Those are potentially the people you are defending!
 
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Pardalis said:
Do you see any "logic" to Usual's claim that the US governement deliberately killed (still ongoing) the workers at ground zero?
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It wasn't only workers at Ground Zero. They sent people back to their houses. Kids back to school. I know you've seen the news about the nun who is dying. Her name slips my mind right now. They let people go back to lower Manhattan knowing the air was not safe. The EPA/Gov't DELIBERATELY LIED and told this people the air was safe. 100's, even 1.000's will die many years sooner than they would have if the gov't was honest and said don't go back. In my mind every person who dies due to health related reasons from the air quality was/is murdered by the gov't due to that lie. If we don't agree on that so be it. The gov't doesn't gain anything off these death. I used the EPA lie as an example to show just how much the gov't values American human life. Based on what the EPA under order of the gov't can you say the gov't holds American lives as high as you think they do??

If I tell you to cross the street knowing you'll get hit by a car did I not deliberately hurt you??
 
Russell:

Where was your outrage when Saddam was killing a million Kurds?

I don't support the quagmire the US is in now, and I don't believe we should have stayed in Iraq an hour after Saddam fell. Their government is THEIR business, not ours.

But Saddam is one of the most evil, if not the most evil, human being now walking the planet and needed to be removed from power.

[/rant]
 
jhunter1163 said:
If you're going to argue that claim, Usual, you might just as well argue that the government allows the tobacco companies to kill hundreds of thousands of people a year. What's the difference?
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Hmmmmm let's see. The Surgeon Generals warning that warns smoking is hazardous to ones health and can cause death. The smoker knowingly makes the choice to smoke. Unlike the citizens of lower Manhattan who were DELIBERATELY LIED to and not told the truth about the health risk and had no choice. There's your difference. Nice try though.
 
Russell.

I want to make this crystal clear for you. I am an old boy, I'm 46. Before the Iraq war I matched, yes I actually got off my aging backside and matched against it. I voiced my objection on the day the bombs started falling on Bagdad.

I have NEVER supported the war in Iraq; I have NEVER defended the US Government on this issue. I have NEVER applauded and clapped as the death toll mounts. The continuing bloodshed out in Iraq and other parts of the world for that matter are absolutely appalling. Right now Iraq is lunging toward civil war. People, real people are dying, I OBJECT.

But I will object on reality, not on some make believe, some whispers of a conspiracy involving US citizens being involved in Mass murder of their fellow countrymen, to make it all happen.

Please do not use the blood letting and blood shed that is going right now as some kind of fall back. I KNOW the US and my own Government has got it wrong, I know they are making a mess out there. This does not mean 911 were engineering to start it all.

Please, for goodness sake stop trying to get everybody on a guilt trip by implying everybody is blissfully unaware of the worlds problems and injustices. This did not all start on 911, this has been there for a long time.

I hope you can see this Russell because this is one of the most annoying tactics used by cters. Please don't dothis.
 
jhunter1163 said:
Russell:

Where was your outrage when Saddam was killing a million Kurds?

I don't support the quagmire the US is in now, and I don't believe we should have stayed in Iraq an hour after Saddam fell. Their government is THEIR business, not ours.

But Saddam is one of the most evil, if not the most evil, human being now walking the planet and needed to be removed from power.

[/rant]
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He was also that evil in the 80's when Rummy went to meet with him and shake his hand but the U.S. did see the need to take him out of power than.
 
Usual Suspect said:
It wasn't only workers at Ground Zero. They sent people back to their houses. Kids back to school. I know you've seen the news about the nun who is dying. Her name slips my mind right now. They let people go back to lower Manhattan knowing the air was not safe. The EPA/Gov't DELIBERATELY LIED and told this people the air was safe. 100's, even 1.000's will die many years sooner than they would have if the gov't was honest and said don't go back. In my mind every person who dies due to health related reasons from the air quality was/is murdered by the gov't due to that lie. If we don't agree on that so be it. The gov't doesn't gain anything off these death. I used the EPA lie as an example to show just how much the gov't values American human life. Based on what the EPA under order of the gov't can you say the gov't holds American lives as high as you think they do??

If I tell you to cross the street knowing you'll get hit by a car did I not deliberately hurt you??
Click to expand...


LC interviewed another ground zero worker. He was in the national guard. Hes on oxygen permanently now. What he said is frightening: it takes only one particle of asbestos to cause asbestosis and they may have to test 400000 new yorkers for it. He also mentioned congressional hearings that could result in manslaughter prosecutions for EPA people.
 
stateofgrace said:
This did not all start on 911, this has been there for a long time.

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Correct. At least 70 years:

"Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country." - Hermann Goering, Nazi leader.
 
Usual Suspect said:
He was also that evil in the 80's when Rummy went to meet with him and shake his hand but the U.S. did see the need to take him out of power than.
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But he hadn't killed the million Kurds yet, then. He only did that after they got uppity after the first Gulf War. The Kurds figured he'd been weakened enough that they could revolt. He hadn't.
 
jessicarabbit said:
Correct. At least 70 years:

"Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country." - Hermann Goering, Nazi leader.
Click to expand...

Please I don't need history lessons from you. Are you seriously comparing the US to Nazi Germany?
 
jhunter1163 said:
But he hadn't killed the million Kurds yet, then. He only did that after they got uppity after the first Gulf War. The Kurds figured he'd been weakened enough that they could revolt. He hadn't.
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You might want to check those "facts". He killed many people in the 80's. Kurds weren't the only ones to suffer under Sadam.
 
jhunter1163 said:
We should've gotten rid of him during the first Gulf War, but the UN resolution didn't authorize us to do it. Damn that pesky international law, always messing up our plans.
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If we were so worried about his crimes against humanity we should have removed him in the 80's when we were busy shaking his hand. Your sracasm is about as good as your question with smoking, totally lacking.
 
Tony Snow says on TV "President Bush only used the term Stay The Course 8 times" --- LIE

Iraq has WMD --- LIE

Cheney say Iraq has connect to Al-Qaeda and 9/11 --- LIE

Cheney says he never said Iraq had connections to Al-Qaeda and 9/11 --- LIE

I can go on but how much of a pattern do you need before you question things??
 
Usual Suspect said:
If we were so worried about his crimes against humanity we should have removed him in the 80's when we were busy shaking his hand. Your sracasm is about as good as your question with smoking, totally lacking.
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There are loads of leaders that commit crimes against humanity but by a strange coincidence its only the ones that live near oil fields that we bother taking out.
 
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