Press for truth!

[Oliver]

Oliver, Please elaborate on this. BTW, I'm not american.

Sorry, i´m wrong with "why it was happend". Doras
translation (was:explanation) is the better explanation because her
higher english skills.

 

[sleahead]

Sorry, Oilver, what I was looking for is more details on this:

Every non-friendly intervention, especially military
intervention

 

[gumboot]

You´re from New Zealand, Andrew. Not America. And it´s a general question about 9/11. I would prefer to ask that
in here - also because this is a more international forum
then politics with just americans in it.

It´s an international question i have.

Yes I know I am from New Zealand.

Sorry, what is the specific 9/11 related question? I may have missed it, for which I apologise.

Also, I think you will be pleasantly surprised to discover there are a wide range of nationalities heavily involved in the politics subforum. Certainly there are many Americans, but I get the impression the majority of this entire forum are Americans. Still, there are very vocal folks from around the globe.



-Andrew

 

[Oliver]

Sorry, Oilver, what I looking for is more details on this:

And i said:

"But i don´t want to discuss this any further before i don´t get a
general picture of other people thoughts about
that. It´s not my intention to step into trouble."

But let me ask where do you come from and
what do you guys thought that days on and
after 9/11? I think you know exactly the same
about interventions then me, i guess even more
since i´m not very political at all, if you live in
an european country.

 

[gumboot]

Why do you think i´m confused between people and media?
I was confused that Andrew did´nt thought "america had it´s coming".
I automatically thought if he does´nt know that beeing a lot
of time in here as "Neuseeländer" - the americans might think the same".

Oliver are you saying it was inevitable that this attack would occur? If you are, I agree totally, and apologise for my misunderstanding.

The phrase "had it coming" is more commonly used to imply that the attack was somehow deserved. Hence my feelings that the US did not "have it coming". However I agree an attack was inevitable - indeed it was not the first Al Qaeda attack on American soil. I also do not expect 9/11 to be the last.

-Andrew

 

[Oliver]

Yes I know I am from New Zealand.

Sorry, what is the specific 9/11 related question? I may have missed it, for which I apologise.

Also, I think you will be pleasantly surprised to discover there are a wide range of nationalities heavily involved in the politics subforum. Certainly there are many Americans, but I get the impression the majority of this entire forum are Americans. Still, there are very vocal folks from around the globe.



-Andrew

The general Question was: (especially to non-american people)

Did you wonder that 9/11 happend? And if not. Why?

 

[gumboot]

The general Question was: (especially to non-american people)

Did you wonder that 9/11 happend? And if not. Why?

Sorry, just to clarify...

Are you meaning, were we surprised that the attack happened? Or are you meaning something more like, did we ask outselves at all WHY the terrorists had attacked the US?

-Andrew

Edited for clarity.

 

[Oliver]

Oliver are you saying it was inevitable that this attack would occur? If you are, I agree totally, and apologise for my misunderstanding.

The phrase "had it coming" is more commonly used to imply that the attack was somehow deserved. Hence my feelings that the US did not "have it coming". However I agree an attack was inevitable - indeed it was not the first Al Qaeda attack on American soil. I also do not expect 9/11 to be the last.

-Andrew

No, i did not think that it was time that this occours.
I said that nobody really wondered in the aftermath,
that someday something like this must happen with
their foreign policy. That´s what people here thought
about it. Sorry, maybe i can not translate it the same
was as i would say it in german.

 

[sleahead]

Oliver, you made this statement:

Mhmm, i think the reasons for the attack on 9/11 was americas
foreign policy. So it looks very relevant to me. No matter if LIHOP,
MIHOP or "WHATHAPPEND" was the case

I cannot see why you should not provide details as to why you believe this to be so.

 

[Oliver]

Sorry, just to clarify...

Are you meaning, were we surprised that the attack happened? Or are you meaning something more like, did we ask outselves at all WHY the terrorists had attacked the US?

-Andrew

Edited for clarity.

I´m sorry, Andrew - both of these points, i think.
The first point in the aftermath. But as i said, it´s
hard to translate nuances in my sentences. This is
why there is a problem in understanding in here.

Maybe Dora is able to translate it better, just be-
cause she said the same thing and translated it
far better then me.

 

[gumboot]

Oliver,

Is perhaps, your proposal that the United States was throwing its weight around, all about the globe, doing as it please, interferring in other nations, and as such it made a lot of people angry, and really the US should have known some of those angry people would hit back?

-Andrew

 

[Oliver]

Oliver, Is perhaps, your proposal that the United States was throwing its weight around, all about the globe, doing as it please, interferring in other nations, and as such it made a lot of people angry, and really the US should have known some of those angry people would hit back?
-Andrew

If "doing as it please" means "doing for fun", then
this is not what i meant.

The rest is true:
People here thought that way - if i don´t make mistakes in
Phrases like "throwing weights around". I don´t know typical
english phrases you all are familiar with - so i have to guess
instead knowing. U know?

 

[sleahead]

To put it simply, Oliver, which non-military and military interventions are you taliking about?

 

[gumboot]

If "doing as it please" means "doing for fun", then
this is not what i meant.

The rest is true:
People here thought that way - if i don´t make mistakes in
Phrases like "throwing weights around". I don´t know typical
english phrases you all are familiar with - so i have to guess
instead knowing. U know?

"Doing as it please" means more "doing as it wants".

Fear not. Your English is far superior to my Deutsch!

Now we're on the same page.

In short, no I don't think that (and didn't after 9/11, although one of my first thoughts was that a lot of people would think that)

The main reason is I don't agree with the stance that the USA has been throwing its weight around. Quite the opposite. The thing is, the USA's relationship to the rest of the world has a long history. I don't think it's appropriate to look at it purely in the context of recent history.

Now, before I go further, let me just make it clear, YES, there have been times when the US ahs done stuff it had no place doing. It has interferred in other countries. It has thrown its weight about. It has made a lot of people angry. It is primarily concerned with its own interests. But what I am interested in a general trend. I am sure a German, of all people, can appreciate that it is unfair to judge an entire nation based on the actions of a single administration.

Germany was the setting for the most destructive and horrible administration in human history. But that was only for a few years, and it was decades ago. It would be as unfair to judge Germany on Nazism as it would be to judge the USA on its dealings in Iran in the 1950's with Operation Ajax (as an example). I love German people. I lived with a pair of Germans for a year or so, and they are still dear friends to me. I don't even know rightly WHY I like German people so much. But every German I have ever met I have just really liked.

So what I am looking for is a trend.

-Andrew

 

[Oliver]

To put it simply, Oliver, which non-military and military interventions are you taliking about?

Do you work for the FBI? What makes you care about it?
If you still try to bore me after i allready made my point, you´re
my very first guest on my ignore-list.

 

[sleahead]

Do you work for the FBI? What makes you care about it?
If you still try to bore me after i allready made my point, you´re
my very first guest on my ignore-list.

I thought we're supposed to exchange views and ideas on this forum. Perhaps, I was wrong. Sorry if asking you to clarify your reasoning bores you, but that is how we make progress in discussion.

 

[Oliver]

"Doing as it please" means more "doing as it wants".

Fear not. Your English is far superior to my Deutsch!

Now we're on the same page.

In short, no I don't think that (and didn't after 9/11, although one of my first thoughts was that a lot of people would think that)

The main reason is I don't agree with the stance that the USA has been throwing its weight around. Quite the opposite. The thing is, the USA's relationship to the rest of the world has a long history. I don't think it's appropriate to look at it purely in the context of recent history.

Now, before I go further, let me just make it clear, YES, there have been times when the US ahs done stuff it had no place doing. It has interferred in other countries. It has thrown its weight about. It has made a lot of people angry. It is primarily concerned with its own interests. But what I am interested in a general trend. I am sure a German, of all people, can appreciate that it is unfair to judge an entire nation based on the actions of a single administration.

Germany was the setting for the most destructive and horrible administration in human history. But that was only for a few years, and it was decades ago. It would be as unfair to judge Germany on Nazism as it would be to judge the USA on its dealings in Iran in the 1950's with Operation Ajax (as an example). I love German people. I lived with a pair of Germans for a year or so, and they are still dear friends to me. I don't even know rightly WHY I like German people so much. But every German I have ever met I have just really liked.

So what I am looking for is a trend.

-Andrew

I agree with what you say - but there is a general, "public
mind" that america is digging to deep in other countries interests.
And the reasons for this "public mind" are such things, you refer as
"done stuff it had no place doing". But anyway: I don´t talk very
much about american politics, you hear such ideas if someone talks
about american foreign politics. For example: People here would´nt
wonder if there were military operations to "get rid of the iran"-problem.

After going to irak without UN-support, america as military
dominance is getting something dangerous to many people.
Another thing is Quantanamo without any international laws.
This kind of stuff is an invitation to all kind of CT, like
the "New World Order"-stuff.

And i ´m not even able to realize what the muslim world must
think with their non-western media and rare knowledges
about the western world.

All in all - the middle east is something people and media
use to call: "A hot iron" - something you should´nt touch
or handle with extreme care - ...tending to "not touch".

 

[Oliver]

I thought we're supposed to exchange views and ideas on this forum. Perhaps, I was wrong. Sorry if asking you to clarify your reasoning bores you, but that is how we make progress in discussion.

It does not bore me very much, but i thought it
was a strange question from a non-american
guy. However - it´s going really off-topic in
here.

 

[Dora]

The main reason is I don't agree with the stance that the USA has been throwing its weight around. Quite the opposite. The thing is, the USA's relationship to the rest of the world has a long history. I don't think it's appropriate to look at it purely in the context of recent history.

-Andrew

well, I actually agree with this as well. But with a slight difference.
I think America has been throwing it's weight around BUT if there are situations where military interventions are necessary, the Western World also turns to America to throw their weight in, if you get what I mean.

It's imo a way to have a "clear" consciense, so yes, it's a bit hypocrit to first except America to come and help us, then blame them for being such warmongers.

Ah, and thanks to all for the warm welcome

 

[sleahead]

Ok, no more questions from me...

but i thought it
was a strange question from a non-american
guy

....leaves me speechless.