Illegal Immigrants Plan to Boycott May 1

[delphi_ote]

Losing our national soul? Quickly everyone! Say it with me!

UNDER GOD!

There. Now everything is okay.

 

[Just thinking]

...First is the procurement and manufacture and dealing of fake documents

Driving with no liscence

No insurance

If you are willing to violate the law of sovereingty and tresspassing, whats a few more? The whole existence is criminal, your premise is completely false

Not to mention knowing that many times if caught in illegal activity, citizenship is not to be questioned.

 

[pipelineaudio]

Not to mention knowing that many times if caught in illegal activity, citizenship is not to be questioned.

Yeah, forgot about that one. In the cities of Mesa, Chandler, Glendale and Gilbert (phoenix is one BIG chunk with Mesa, Chandler, Gilbert, Phoenix, Tempe, Glendale, and a few other little ones as "the valley" but the cities are not separated, just different zones), officers are NOT allowed to inquire regarding citizenship status unless the person has already been PROCESSED for a crime, which usually means status undetermined till after the person is released

 

[Manny]

Yeah, forgot about that one. In the cities of Mesa, Chandler, Glendale and Gilbert (phoenix is one BIG chunk with Mesa, Chandler, Gilbert, Phoenix, Tempe, Glendale, and a few other little ones as "the valley" but the cities are not separated, just different zones), officers are NOT allowed to inquire regarding citizenship status unless the person has already been PROCESSED for a crime, which usually means status undetermined till after the person is released

Yeah. You realize that that tips the system (and prossibly illegally so) in favor of the police and away from the illegals, yes?

 

[pipelineaudio]

I dont see how

 

[Cleon]

"I absolutely and entirely renounce and abjure all allegiance and fidelity to any foreign prince, potentate, state or sovereignty, of whom or which I have heretofore been a subject or citizen ... "

Sounds rather specific to me and rather drastic a change.

And nothing about singing a song in Spanish, or speaking the language for that matter, indicates allegiance to another country. Your fishing for something that simply isn't there.

I never said that as well. And no ... you specifically said "nothing in there about assimilation ..." and in just one reply you are backing off that somewhat.

Because there isn't anything in there about assimilation. Assimilation is about giving up parts of your culture to adapt to a larger culture.

There's nothing in there that indicates you have to give up your culture, religion, language, hairstyle, or anything that indicates "assimilation" beyond a desire to become a citizen. Which isn't really assimilation.

Intent ... in my opinion.

Your opinion is not based on anything substantial, really, as shown above and below.

And that's your opinion.

No, that's the facts of the matter. Unless you can provide evidence that there is a proposal on the table to substitute this for the Star-Spangled banner, or that this is anything but a way to express that Spanish-speaking people are already part of the US, that they wouldn't have it any other way, and there's nothing wrong with that whatsoever.

 

[Cleon]

Then YOU pay for them

I cant afford it any longer, neither can my neighbors

You pay or you [edit] - really have no say in the matter

Yeah, I'm sure you're going broke because of all the immigrants in the area.

 

[Cleon]

Youre either a totaly liar or completely ignorant

ID has firsthand knowledge of immigration. You may want to check around before you start calling people "liar" or "ignorant" because they don't agree with your rantings.

The whole system of life becomes crime. First is the procurement and manufacture and dealing of fake documents

This is not correct. The majority of "illegal" immigrants arrive legally and overstay their visa.

Driving with no liscence

Again, not correct. You are not required to be a citizen to get a driver's license.

No insurance

Again, not correct, for the same reasons as above. In Georgia, for example, you are required to have insurance before you can get your car registered or tag renewed. Before you say anything about "fake documents," the system is completely computerized; cops don't even ask for insurance cards anymore, they just look it up in the database. And yet there aren't a massive number of people driving around with expired tags.

I as a person who drives MINIMALLY am on my third hit and slam from a illegal mobile.

Funny, I drive every day in a city and state that is crawling with immigrants, "legal" and not. Yet my last two accidents involved being rear-ended by good, upstanding, citizens.

Anecdotal evidence is a bitch, ain't it?

Its the familiar "everyone jumps out of the truck and runs off, leaving the truck in the intersection" to anyone in this area

It's so familiar, you can't provide evidence this happens on a regular basis, or that this is something unique to "illegals."

If you are willing to violate the law of sovereingty and tresspassing, whats a few more? The whole existence is criminal, your premise is completely false

Yeah, these evil, evil people who want to work and earn a better life for themselves and their families. How dare they.

 

[pipelineaudio]

Yeah, I'm sure you're going broke because of all the immigrants in the area.

YES, I am

Many of us have been for the last ten years

Our school system is being fined ONE MILLION DOLLARS a day for not being able to come up with the money to teach illegals in spanish

Our health care system is gone, unless you can afford the Mayo CLinic

Come visit for a week Ill show your ignorant, holier than thou, azz whats going on

 

[Cleon]

YES, I am

Yeah, ok.

 

[delphi_ote]

Our school system is being fined ONE MILLION DOLLARS a day for not being able to come up with the money to teach illegals in spanish

Reference?

Our health care system is gone, unless you can afford the Mayo CLinic

Literally? And the illegal immigrants took it away? You have proof?

Come visit for a week Ill show your ignorant, holier than thou, azz whats going on

Projection.

 

[pipelineaudio]

Reference?



Literally? And the illegal immigrants took it away? You have proof?

Projection.

http://www.nabe.org/press/Clips/clip010506b.htm

Notice it is not anyone but spanish speaking, there are no japanese, philipinos, samoans, vietnamese, noone else asking err insisting that they be handed to

But anyway, you guys be happy there in your little boxes while we suffer here and bear the brunt of it so you cguys can pat yourselves on the back

 

[ImaginalDisc]

http://www.nabe.org/press/Clips/clip010506b.htm

Notice it is not anyone but spanish speaking, there are no japanese, philipinos, samoans, vietnamese, noone else asking err insisting that they be handed to

Mr. Horne also disputed the court's decision to exempt English-language learners from the high school exit exam until the funding matter is resolved.

The exam is part of Arizona's Instrument to Measure Standards, or AIMS, the state testing system.

Until this ruling, these students were heavily motivated to become proficient in English. This ruling undercuts their motivation to acquire the skills they need to succeed in today's economy, Mr. Horne said.

ESOL (English for Speakers of Other Languages) instruction isn't just for spanish speakers. Here in Miami, the School District developed a written language for Hatian Creole just to help teach these students. (Hatian Creole is different enough from French that it was needed, but I'm not an expert on why exactly.)

But anyway, you guys be happy there in your little boxes while we suffer here and bear the brunt of it so you cguys can pat yourselves on the back

White boxes? What are you talking about?

 

[jj]

Around here, legally resident hispanics are also planning to strike on the 1st. Is there some reason for your misleading title?

 

[LostAngeles]

Around here, legally resident hispanics are also planning to strike on the 1st. Is there some reason for your misleading title?

I alluded to that earlier.

I know of a Russian, a South African, and several born U.S. citizens who are also joining the strike for starters.

 

[delphi_ote]

http://www.nabe.org/press/Clips/clip010506b.htm

Notice it is not anyone but spanish speaking, there are no japanese, philipinos, samoans, vietnamese, noone else asking err insisting that they be handed to

But anyway, you guys be happy there in your little boxes while we suffer here and bear the brunt of it so you cguys can pat yourselves on the back

So I guess the Mexicans didn't take your health care, as you've provided no evidence for that.

In a ruling last month, a federal court gave the state until Jan. 24, or just 15 days following the start of its 2006 legislative session, to find a way to adequately fund programs for such students, or be fined $500,000 per day for 30 days. The daily fine would increase to a maximum of $2 million if the state continued to miss the court's deadlines.

That doesn't sound like an unreasonable request, and it was handed down by a judge. I'm sorry you have a problem with the law.

As for teaching English as a second language, that sounds like a good way to assimilate these people into our culture. I don't understand why that would be a bad thing, unless of course you have a problem with more brown skinned people being affluent and successful Americans. Then I can't really help you.

 

[Just thinking]

And nothing about singing a song in Spanish, or speaking the language for that matter, indicates allegiance to another country. Your fishing for something that simply isn't there.

It seems I'm far from alone in this opinion (MSNBC) ...

Rejecting assimilation?

However, the same advance buzz that drew singers to scramble for inclusion in the recording sessions this week in New York, Miami, Texas, Mexico, Puerto Rico and the Dominican Republic has also spurred critics who say rendering the song in Spanish is a rejection of assimilation into the United States.

Even some movement supporters are puzzled by the use of Spanish.

"Even our Spanish media are saying, 'Why are we doing this, what are you trying to do?' " said Pedro Biaggi, the morning host with El Zol (99.1 FM), the most popular Hispanic radio station in the Washington area. "It's not for us to be going around singing the national anthem in Spanish. . . . We don't want to impose, we don't own the place. . . . We want to be accepted."

Because there isn't anything in there about assimilation. Assimilation is about giving up parts of your culture to adapt to a larger culture.

Your national allegiance is part of one's culture. The laws one followed growing up and obeying within their society are a large part. And as you can plainly see, your definition of assimilation is a bit limited -- I can point to many sites (even Hispanic) that consider just becoming a US citizen a process of assimilation.

There's nothing in there that indicates you have to give up your culture, religion, language, hairstyle, or anything that indicates "assimilation" beyond a desire to become a citizen. Which isn't really assimilation.

Sorry -- you're more than outnumbered in that suggestion.

Your opinion is not based on anything substantial, really, as shown above and below.

That's (my opinion) been more than substantiated at this point.

No, that's the facts of the matter. Unless you can provide evidence that there is a proposal on the table to substitute this for the Star-Spangled banner, or that this is anything but a way to express that Spanish-speaking people are already part of the US, that they wouldn't have it any other way, and there's nothing wrong with that whatsoever.

Even Hispanics will argue against you on that one.

Some immigration supporters, however, think the song sends a mixed message.

"When you listen on the radio about the marches, they tell you not to wave the Mexican flag, but they'll play this anthem. They're contradicting themselves," said Rafael Barajas, former president of the Federation of Zacatecan Clubs of Southern California.

The 54-year-old Anaheim resident said the song will ultimately hurt the movement and may trigger a backlash.

"Wow. What are they doing now?" said Raymundo Chavez of Placentia when he heard about the song on the daytime program "Escandalo T.V." Chavez said the artists are not helping out their own people.

"There are some things you just shouldn't touch, like 'The Star-Spangled Banner,'" Chavez, 65, said. "It was written a certain way, and that's the way it should be sung,"

Plus, can you point to where I said this was to be a rewrite of the National Anthem? I believe I pointed to it as being against the grain of assimilation. You're using a Strawman here.

 

[delphi_ote]

Because there isn't anything in there about assimilation. Assimilation is about giving up parts of your culture to adapt to a larger culture.

There's nothing in there that indicates you have to give up your culture, religion, language, hairstyle, or anything that indicates "assimilation" beyond a desire to become a citizen. Which isn't really assimilation.

St. Patrick's Day
Chinatown
Spaghetti
Native American reservations

We'll do just fine.

Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!

 

[Cleon]

It seems I'm far from alone in this opinion (MSNBC) ...

Argument ad populum.

Your national allegiance is part of one's culture. The laws one followed growing up and obeying within their society are a large part. And as you can plainly see, your definition of assimilation is a bit limited -- I can point to many sites (even Hispanic) that consider just becoming a US citizen a process of assimilation.

Sorry, this just isn't so. "My" definition of assimilation is the one that's referenced by dictionaries. You can point to sites that say that citizenship means that you should assimilate, but I seriously doubt you can substantiate the claim that citizenship means assimilation in and of itself. I can point to countless examples of non-assimilated cultures that function just fine and dandy in the US and have for generations, despite the fact that virtually 100% of their populations are citizens.. Start here: Kiryas Joel, New York; Lancaster, Pennsylvania; the state of Utah; the Diné.

That's (my opinion) been more than substantiated at this point.

It's been repeated. That doesn't make it correct.

Even Hispanics will argue against you on that one. Plus, can you point to where I said this was to be a rewrite of the National Anthem? I believe I pointed to it as being against the grain of assimilation. You're using a Strawman here.

*sigh* You can keep repeating this, it doesn't make it true. Provide the evidence, or quit grasping at straws. As far as your claim that this was to replace the National Anthem, well, you said:

"I do not view one wishing to change or alter the US National Anthem as bearing said faith."

They're not changing or altering the US National Anthem. The US National Anthem is the English verses of the "Star-Spangled Banner" sung to an old drinking song. There is no proposal whatsoever to change that. I point that out before, and you claimed "that's your opinion." Either provide the evidence, or again, quit grasping at straws.

 

[HeavyAaron]

Hombre de paja.

Edit: Aside from entering the country illegally, most illegal immigrants avoid breaking the law. They know that if they're arrested, and it's determined that they are in this country illegally, they will likely be deported.

Actually, this is what I consider to be the worst part of US immigration policy.

It's illegal to come. Therefore only those people who do not possess moral compunctions that prevent law breaking will come. It's exactly the people that stay in Mexico because of US law that I WANT here. People willing to break laws that they don't like are not folks I want around me. And as someone from the Arizona desert, I assure you that law breaking is hardly restricted to entry, at least in these parts.

As long as we're here... I think as a Federal problem all those lovely tax payers from other parts of the country should start sending CA, AZ, NM, and TX large sums of money to shore up our hospitals and schools becaues of federal laws demanding that they serve non-residents without having any funding.

Aaron