The value of negotiations
- Thread starter Ed
- Start date
-
- Tags
- negotiations value
WildCat
NWO Master Conspirator
- Joined
- Mar 23, 2003
- Messages
- 59,856
Dont worry, any day now they'll have a vote in the UN on whether or not to send the matter to the Security Council. Baradei, BTW, is against such a move. I bet there's an Iranian-centered earthquake within 2 years that is not caused by any tectonioc plate action.
So lets see:
They have stated that Isreal ought to be destroyed
They have examined the calculus of a nuclear exchange and have found the numbers acceptable (since this is Allah's will)
They cannot be trusted
Sounds like a fine addition to the nuclear club.
They have stated that Isreal ought to be destroyed
They have examined the calculus of a nuclear exchange and have found the numbers acceptable (since this is Allah's will)
They cannot be trusted
Sounds like a fine addition to the nuclear club.
Do you actually believe this nonsense? First of all I don't see how the Iranian negotiator would know what the US said to the EU3. Does the US usually send its diplomatic correspondence through Tehran? Even disregarding how he obtained that knowledge the information is frankly just not plausible. There's no way in hell European diplomats are dump enough to trust the Iranian on anything, much less on what they say about their nuclear program. Also if you read the article you linked to you’ll see this passage
“In his address to the Supreme Council of Cultural Revolution, Mr Rowhani appears to have been seeking to rebut criticism from hardliners that he gave too much ground in talks with the European troika.”
Now what does that tell us about the potential slant of his speech?
As for the negotiations accomplishing something, I can think of two things. The first is time. The Iranians IIRC stopped enrichment while the negotiations where going on, and if this slowed down their program then it gave the US more time to try and stabilize Iraq, admittedly that doesn't seem to be going very well, but that's another matter. The second thing it accomplishes is political and diplomatic cover if you do those to launch some military strike.
It gave them time to build facilities whose nature makes a strike very difficult. Stopping enrichment is absolutely irrelevant.
Maybe but the only opinion that counts is that of the europeans and I suspect that they are scared to death. The opinion of the islamic world is irrelevant too.
Yes, I do.
I suspect it came from european who was trying to curry favor by sharing secrets.
So, why were they "negotiating" again? It was about their nuclear program, no?
The slant was for him to accrue much deserved applause for having bought his government 2 years to build bomb proof facilities. It tells me enough to know that the europeans are open to bridge buying, as are apologists for Iran.
I can think of one other population group whose opinion might matter: The Americans. The war in Iraq isn't exactly popular, and by extension I doubt launching another war as anything, but a last resort would be particularly popular either.
In that case I don't think European diplomats are the ones you should go to if you've got a bridge to sell.
It must be dreadfully comfortable to be able to fill any holes of logic and evidence with baseless speculation.
Let’s see, time (do you disagree that it would have been nice to have sorted out Iraq first before starting a war with Iran?), diplomatic cover or having populations that would not support a war, or they might have believed it was possible that the Iranians could be bribed or coeced into giving up their program, hardly the same as trust. Tell me, if the only reason for conducting the negotiations is that you trust the Iranians and the US doesn't trust them why was it exactly that the US supported the negotiations?
The source tells you didely squat, but you accept it as reliable because it fits your prejudices
Last edited:
WildCat
NWO Master Conspirator
- Joined
- Mar 23, 2003
- Messages
- 59,856
As far as war w/ Iran goes, it will not be one of ground troops (although there could be limited ground action to take out deeply buried nuclear sites, after which we'd get the hell out of Dodge) and occupation. It would be aerial bombardment meant to remove any offensive threat the Iranians could muster. Nuclear sites, airfields, naval bases, etc. Perhaps even take out their ports and oil pipelines to starve them of the cash they'd need to rebuild such infrastructure and programs. There is simply neither the men nor materiel available for an occupation or rebuilding.
Charlie Monoxide
Wag
- Joined
- Jul 8, 2003
- Messages
- 2,760
What other options besides negotiations do we have with Iran?
Charlie (perhaps an oil embargo?) Monoxide
Charlie (perhaps an oil embargo?) Monoxide
I have no idea what was going thru their minds. Our example with bribing the NK's should have been an object lesson of recent times. My point is that the negotiations gave them time which they put to good use.
It seems that you really don't like the fact that this story came out and are trying to discredit it in every way possible. Why? Iran has made it clear that they would like to see Isreal destroyed, they have thought of the costs of a nuke exchange (and found it acceptable) and they have plans to create a nuke. Why would you give them the benefit of the doubt?
Negotiate to what end? To give everyone something to do until they test a nuke?
ETA:
Yet somehow you know what goes though the minds of the Europeans, how was it that worked. Ohh yes, the Iranians said so, so obviously they must have an agent who'd of course European rather than American because we all know how Europeans are. This agent is trying to curry favour with the Iranians. What exactly a European official would need Iranian favour for is not entirely clear, but clearly he needs it for something because the Iranians, being the nice upstanding people they are certainly wouldn't invent fictional facts right? Tell me, is there any way I can convince you to share whatever you’re on, because clearly it’s quality stuff?
I have this trange tendency to be skeptical when unreliable sources make unlike claims about issues they have no obvious way of knowing anything about. I guess I'm just funny that way.
Last edited:
I dunno. It's hardly unlikely that Iran only sees "negotiations" with Europe as a way to buy time on its way to the bomb. In fact, it's self-evident.
Then it's a good thing that wasn't the claim I was refering to, wouldn't you say?
Dr Adequate
Banned
- Joined
- Aug 31, 2004
- Messages
- 17,766
...
Private Lee Ellis: 24th January 1983 - 28th February 2006
Private Lee Ellis was born on 24th January 1983. He lived in Wythenshawe, Manchester with his fiancée Sarah and his daughter Courtney.
Private Ellis joined the Army in September 2003 and completed his basic training at the Infantry Training Centre (Catterick). In April 2004 he joined D Company, the Second Battalion The Parachute Regiment. Suffering from an injury in 2005, he showed typical fortitude and determination to recover. He deployed to Iraq in October 2005 with D Company and operated in Maysaan Province as part of the Royal Scots Dragoon Guards Battle Group.
Private Ellis was a keen sportsman. An apprentice with Wigan Athletic Football Club, he gave up a career in professional football to join The Parachute Regiment. A committed Manchester City supporter; he made every effort to watch each televised match. An equally keen boxer, he looked forward to representing his Company and the Battalion on its return to Colchester.
Private Lee Ellis was not only a comrade but a close friend to many. He will be sorely missed by all those who were privileged to serve with and know him. Our thoughts are with his family and young daughter.
Lieutenant Colonel Chiswell said of Private Ellis:
"Bright, enthusiastic and immensely popular, Private Ellis displayed all the qualities of a first class Paratrooper. His strength of character and dedication were reflected in his determination to overcome injury and to join his friends and comrades on operations in southern Iraq.
"His comradeship stood out; he was always willing to help others, and invariably did so with a smile on his face. Hardworking, professional and with an irrepressible sense of humour, he showed enormous compassion in his dealing with the local Iraqis he encountered, whether they were Police, civilians or children.
"He was a natural team player who always looked out for others and who was always upbeat and focused. Above all else he was a total professional, dedicated to his task. He made a genuine difference in Iraq.
"Private Ellis was an outstanding soldier, comrade and friend. He will be sorely missed by all those who have served with him and our thoughts are with his fiancée and family."
The family of Private Ellis issued the following statement:
"We are proud of Lee and of the fact, as was he, that he was in the Army and the Parachute Regiment."
Dr Adequate
Banned
- Joined
- Aug 31, 2004
- Messages
- 17,766
Britain has been part of Europe for the last 135 million years, ever since Laurasia split into North America and Europe / Asia.
Look at a ****ing map.
Look at a ****ing map.