Merged (edited) General thoughts about Christianity and the bible

[Andy_Ross]

Has he mentioned Foxholes yet?

 

[JayUtah]

Has he mentioned Foxholes yet?

Not in so many words, but the sentiment appears in one of his eleventy thousand other threads.

 

[W.D.Clinger]

Have you seen this one?

Have you seen the one where that same bunch of liars says it has proof of anti-gravity technology?

Concerning another video from that same bunch, a spokesperson for the Tahoe Environmental Research Center said “There’s basically nothing in that video that’s true except that Lake Tahoe is here, and there’s water in it.”

Those videos are aimed at the same sort of people who thought the "Cave Found Beneath the Euphrates River!" video was factual.

 

[W.D.Clinger]

@Rusty Tyler Do you really think posting sensational YouTube videos is your best argument?

Yes, he thinks that, and he's not wrong.

They say it better than I could.

Well I suppose conceding that you are not quite as good at lying as the video makers is a small bonus in your favor.

 

[Joe Random]

Setting aside the (massive) issues of structural physics with the supposed Ark for a moment, thinking that the central point of the Ark story (taking 2 of each animal) could result in a repopulated Earth would require ignoring the effects of inbreeding beyond levels that Anne Rice and V.C. Andrews could ever dream of.

 

[Foster Zygote]

Setting aside the (massive) issues of structural physics with the supposed Ark for a moment, thinking that the central point of the Ark story (taking 2 of each animal) could result in a repopulated Earth would require ignoring the effects of inbreeding beyond levels that Anne Rice and V.C. Andrews could ever dream of.

We'd all look like the past living Hapsburg.



And to quote Tricky from way back, "you couldn't fit two of every animal on the ark if you froze and stacked them".

 

[JayUtah]

And to quote Tricky from way back, "you couldn't fit two of every animal on the ark if you froze and stacked them".

Make it a tanker and puree them.

I can't fathom how someone can put blind faith in the notion that a Bronze Age man with no prior shipbuilding experience built the largest wooden ship ever and carried two specimens of every species, but speciation via natural selection is a bridge too far. The people who revere the Old Testament and take the flood story literally are a very, very small minority: American Evangelicals and fundamentalist Muslims.

 

[Foster Zygote]

Is it fair to reject God on the basis of evidence?

Yes. What else are you going to use to evaluate something?

Faith is, quite simply, belief without evidence, or in spite of contradictory evidence. Can you imagine if a prosecutor addressed the jury and asked if they were really going to approach the question of a defendant's guilt by relying on all the available evidence? Can you imagine if said prosecutor presented no evidence to support the charges, but instead assured the jury that he had faith that the defendant was guilty, and that demanding evidence was an affront to his faith?

I know if I wanted people to believe my magical stories without logically evaluating them, I'd try to convince them that believing something without evidence, or in the face of contradictory evidence, was virtuous. I'd also indoctrinate them with the idea that people who don't believe the magic stories are dumb, because it says so right in the magic stories. And it wouldn't hurt to give them the idea that even questioning the magic stories was something to feel guilty about.

 

[theprestige]

They say it better than I could.

Considering how they say it, that's a pretty sad admission.

Considering what they have to say, it's probably to Rusty's credit that he's not as good at saying it.

 

[winter salt]

A) You can't stop rationalizing everything you "accept".
Rationalizing is resembling things you "like", to yourself.
Your ultimate goal as a believer is to be one with your god, or rather make him like yourself.
So it becomes impossible to believe in the Unknown.

B) Religion builds upon the concept of the Unknown and after hooking the believer it destroys the concept of the Unknown (by relating a lot of things to it, it no longer is the absolute unknown.)

 

[The Norseman]

Doubting Thomas was a skeptic.
Jesus applauded those who believed having not "seen". (scripture below)

And yet Thomas was shown physical proof. Funny how the same character (Yeshua) showed him but no others...

The Bible says that creation makes plain the evidence of a creator God. (so men are without excuse)
Skeptics renounce the Bible. How many other ancient texts do they discount?

Is it fair to reject God on the basis of evidence?

You have that backwards. It's only 'fair' to accept a deity when demonstrable, objective evidence is provided for its existence.

John 20:29 NIV
Then Jesus told him, “Because you have seen me, you have believed;
blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”

I guess he wasn't blessed then. Bummer for him.

exactly.
Faith and Science are none-overlapping.

You can believe in God, but do what the best empirical evidence supports.

Don't use science to disprove the existence of God, don't use God to question science.

Non-overlapping magisteria is a philosophical position, not a scientific one.

Anyone can only prove the existence of anything at all is through science. Not philosophy. Not religious fantasies.

Well, obviously science can't disprove religion, any more than I can disprove the existence of a billionaire who left me everything in his will. Just in both cases I won't plan my life around it being true

Science can't disprove a belief system (religion) but it is the only way to discover if any kind of god actually exists.

But aren't they incompatible?

Yes, science is absolutely incompatible with fantasy.

 

[The Norseman]

My agnostic friend says the same thing. "I don't need it."
What would have to happen to you before you reached the breaking point of calling on anything that would save you?

Saving from what? The eternal punishment meted out by the very same being which I'm supposed to be calling on to 'save' me? Total mafia behavior. ◊◊◊◊ that guy.

 

[Gulliver Foyle]

Yes, signs were given. But in general...
"Blessed are those who believe without seeing."

Yes, blessed are the gullible; they wil be easily relieved of their possessions!

 

[Gulliver Foyle]

That saw cuts both ways.

Evolution is a theory.

No, evolution is real.

The theory of evolution is the theory that best explains the fact of evolution. It has been tested and refined over the years but never yet been defeated.

 

[The Norseman]

I strongly suspect that the sentiment is less about God wanting a personal relationship with everyone and more about certain people wanting to believe they have a personal relationship with a god who cares that they exist. Faith then is more like delulu celebrity-stalkers or believing the stripper is really in love with you.

Well... sure. But in my case, she really was in love with me. You just wouldn't know her as she... uh... moved to Canada.

 

[Reformed Offlian]

Well... sure. But in my case, she really was in love with me. You just wouldn't know her as she... uh... moved to Canada.

Likening God to a "Canadian girlfriend" seems pretty spot on.

 

[The Norseman]

Well, I do believe we already established that our interlocutor has bugger all knowledge of any of the sciences which lie behind evolution and the evidence for it and natural selection.

I dread to think how our interlocutor thinks the computer/phone/magic talking box they use manages to communicate their, errrr, thoughts out to the rest of us...

It's obvious that it's turtles theories all the way down....

 

[Gulliver Foyle]

Quick call the Fantastic Four, Galactus is back!!

Oh wait.. Google AI reverse image search says...



To bad Rusty, ya nearly had us there...

View attachment 72121

While Google LLM is right in calling the image a fake, I think that calling it LLM generated is wrong. I recall seeing this image fifteen to twenty yeaes ago, meaning it was likely made with early photoshop or its predecessors.

 

[catsmate]

Surely this is claimed as evidence for god so it denies faith.

Very Adams.

 

[Gulliver Foyle]

Well... sure. But in my case, she really was in love with me. You just wouldn't know her as she... uh... moved to Canada.

Georgina Tropicana was your girlfriend too?